advice on my discharge

[youngfool]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? IN

i have been in the army for 11 years now (4 yrs active, 7 yrs ARNG), and i have to face the BCM here in a few weeks about my request for discharge. heres the story, i have served with no AWOLS, no reprimands, nothing at all on my record. recently i have had a change of heart with the way that the national guard does things, and how it tries to play real army. now i have no problems with the deployments, (OIF3,and 5), but going back is not really an option that i want to entertain. i have seen the crap, put up with it, supported it in front of my subordinates, and im just done. i sat down with the company commander and told him that i didnt want to do this anymore, that i dont believe in the fight anymore, and that i cant in good conscience be a part of a system that i have grown to despise.

i have done all the right moves, havent just disappered, and am still attending. heres the problem. the CO told me that because i want out of my contract, i will be given a OTH, and i have to repay a pro-rated portion of my reenlistment bonus, and that i will forfeit all of my vetern rights. i sit before the BCM in july, and my requests to see a JAG have been delayed every time that i request one. i dont know what will happen, but does anyone have any advise as to what they could do? i dont care about repayment of the bonus, that is only fair, but my VA benefits? any help would be gratefully appreciated.

[ArmyOTH]

You need counsel now to avoid this discharge before you receive it. You need a JAG. If you can't get one, as you say, you need an experienced Civilian Lawyer. You need counsel, period.

Do not give up your fight. Get competent, experienced counsel. Do not, at any time, sign any form, or make any written statement that could be viewed as a request for, or an acceptance of, an OTH discharge. Do your research on regulations and DoD directives, so even if you don't get the counsel you want, or counsel at all, you will be prepared for the BCM. You may even be able to undercover something so you do not have to go before the BCM.

The best way to fight the system and win, is to know what they know, use what they use, and level the playing field.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by youngfool

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? IN

i have been in the army for 11 years now (4 yrs active, 7 yrs ARNG), and i have to face the BCM here in a few weeks about my request for discharge. heres the story, i have served with no AWOLS, no reprimands, nothing at all on my record. recently i have had a change of heart with the way that the national guard does things, and how it tries to play real army. now i have no problems with the deployments, (OIF3,and 5), but going back is not really an option that i want to entertain. i have seen the crap, put up with it, supported it in front of my subordinates, and im just done. i sat down with the company commander and told him that i didnt want to do this anymore, that i dont believe in the fight anymore, and that i cant in good conscience be a part of a system that i have grown to despise.

i have done all the right moves, havent just disappered, and am still attending. heres the problem. the CO told me that because i want out of my contract, i will be given a OTH, and i have to repay a pro-rated portion of my reenlistment bonus, and that i will forfeit all of my vetern rights. i sit before the BCM in july, and my requests to see a JAG have been delayed every time that i request one. i dont know what will happen, but does anyone have any advise as to what they could do? i dont care about repayment of the bonus, that is only fair, but my VA benefits? any help would be gratefully appreciated.

Your CO is absolutely right. Your enlistment contract does not stipulate a clause for changes of heart.

[ArmyOTH]

It doesn't have to. What he's doing (which is conscientious objection) is a fundamental human right. That being said, he has the right to submit an application as a conscientious objector. He'll have to answer some questions and be evaluated.

Youngfool - I am not recommending you do this, it is just another option for you to entertain, and it is your right to do so. I advise you to research conscientious objection to see if that fits your current morals or ethics.

[youngfool]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

It doesn't have to. What he's doing (which is conscientious objection) is a fundamental human right. That being said, he has the right to submit an application as a conscientious objector. He'll have to answer some questions and be evaluated.

Youngfool - I am not recommending you do this, it is just another option for you to entertain, and it is your right to do so. I advise you to research conscientious objection to see if that fits your current morals or ethics.

would that still be conscientious objection if ive already done two tours? i didnt think that it would be that, i just dont believe in THIS war anymore. i dont have a clue as to whether i would even be called back to iraq again, i just dont want to be a part of the military system anymore. im not trying to dodge a deployment like some others ive seen.

[youngfool]

Originally Posted by ERAUPIKE

Your CO is absolutely right. Your enlistment contract does not stipulate a clause for changes of heart.

ok, so heres another question. i have my DD 214 from active duty, however it doesnt have my overseas on it. if i do end up with an OTH, will that definatly mean that all my VA is gone too, or is my active duty 214 automatically replaced with the OTH with a bad RE code? i dont know.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by youngfool

ok, so heres another question. i have my DD 214 from active duty, however it doesnt have my overseas on it. if i do end up with an OTH, will that definatly mean that all my VA is gone too, or is my active duty 214 automatically replaced with the OTH with a bad RE code? i dont know.

Army OTH is in no way an expert. You cannot claim an objector status because you are not one. I do not believe that a reserve discharge can have any effect on your active duty discharge.

[ArmyOTH]

Apparently you don't appear to be much of an expert on anything besides dispensing mostly negative advice. Guess people get what they pay for with you.

Youngfool, you can still be a conscientious objector even if you've already been deployed in the past. A question in the application specifically asks what changed your mind, so they anticipate people may object after enlistments and deployments. As I advised, do your research and see if filing an application is in your best interests and if you believe your current views of the military would fit in with what is known as conscientious objection.

Your last discharge will be the one to affect you. It does not matter if it was from active or reserve. If the last DD 214 you received states OTH, then that's currently what you are considered as. However, the VA can determine if you are eligible for benefits base don your current and past discharges. An OTH discharge is not an automatic disqualification for VA benefits.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

Apparently you don't appear to be much of an expert on anything besides dispensing mostly negative advice. Guess people get what they pay for with you.

Youngfool, you can still be a conscientious objector even if you've already been deployed in the past. A question in the application specifically asks what changed your mind, so they anticipate people may object after enlistments and deployments. As I advised, do your research and see if filing an application is in your best interests and if you believe your current views of the military would fit in with what is known as conscientious objection.

Your last discharge will be the one to affect you. It does not matter if it was from active or reserve. If the last DD 214 you received states OTH, then that's currently what you are considered as. However, the VA can determine if you are eligible for benefits base don your current and past discharges. An OTH discharge is not an automatic disqualification for VA benefits.

My advice is not negative, it is accurate. I fail to see how your 3 months in the Army would make you an expert on anything. The description that the OP gave was not that of a CO. There are many variables that would make the OP capable of receiving VA benefits since he did complete a full active duty enlistment. That is yet one more thing you know nothing about. I am sorry that you came to this board and did not find the answers you were looking for. You have been and will continue to be held accountable for your actions.

[ArmyOTH]

The advice I give is based on research. In the event that I might be incorrect I advise people to research for themselves. How are you to know, without evaluating someone whether they are a CO or not? The Army can't discern it, so how do you expect to tell people what they are or are not? I advised him to research it himself and base his opinion on his own ethics and morals. As I advised, he is not automatically DQ'ed from VA benefits based on his OTH.

However, what is most telling here, is you would rather debate with me about this man's situation, than advise him. If I were only here looking for answers I would not reply to other threads. Continue to dispense your negative comments which clearly illustrate your poor attitude, these people will get advice they need from others such as myself.

[youngfool]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

The advice I give is based on research. In the event that I might be incorrect I advise people to research for themselves. How are you to know, without evaluating someone whether they are a CO or not? The Army can't discern it, so how do you expect to tell people what they are or are not? I advised him to research it himself and base his opinion on his own ethics and morals. As I advised, he is not automatically DQ'ed from VA benefits based on his OTH.

However, what is most telling here, is you would rather debate with me about this man's situation, than advise him. If I were only here looking for answers I would not reply to other threads. Continue to dispense your negative comments which clearly illustrate your poor attitude, these people will get advice they need from others such as myself.

thanks for the advise guys, i appreciate it. i think im gonna have to camp out at the s1 and get in and see a jag. i do wonder what you mean by i may not lose my va benefits. i really need to keep seeing the mental health guys, and i cant afford that without the va. i know that i need help, but i dont know what else to do.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

The advice I give is based on research. In the event that I might be incorrect I advise people to research for themselves. How are you to know, without evaluating someone whether they are a CO or not? The Army can't discern it, so how do you expect to tell people what they are or are not? I advised him to research it himself and base his opinion on his own ethics and morals. As I advised, he is not automatically DQ'ed from VA benefits based on his OTH.

However, what is most telling here, is you would rather debate with me about this man's situation, than advise him. If I were only here looking for answers I would not reply to other threads. Continue to dispense your negative comments which clearly illustrate your poor attitude, these people will get advice they need from others such as myself.

There is nothing more to advise him on. I unfortunately lack the ability to see the future. There are chances that many different things could happen but no real guarantee that anything except his being denied CO status will happen.

OP, you will still qualify for free health care because you served in OEF/OIF. There is a relatively new program that would grant you 5 years of service related care for free. The VA does have a toll free number but contacting an office nearer to your area may prove to be more rewarding. Fight to retain your benefits. The Chapter 33 GI Bill is an amazing opportunity for you to better yourself and attend college for free.

ArmyOTH has his heart in the right place but please remember he is just some kid that spent three months in the Army and ran away. The amount of benefits you may have available to you would make it foolhardy to listen to someone like that or to anyone on a free internet forum.

[url=http://www1.va.gov/opa/Is1/1.asp]Federal Benefits for Veterans, Dependents and Survivors - Public and Intergovernmental Affairs[/url]


Veterans, including activated reservists and members of the National Guard, are eligible for the enhanced “Combat Veteran” benefits if they served on active duty in a theater of combat operations after Nov. 11, 1998, and have been discharged under other than dishonorable conditions.

[youngfool]

hey just a quick update. i went before the battalion commander, and i argued my case. he was impressed with my understanding of the procedure, and he and jag both agreed that i was to get a general under honorable conditions with an RE code of 3. thanks for the info and the support guys