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  1. #1
    md_usaf is offline Junior Member
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    Exclamation Asperger Disorder & Military Fraudulent Enlsitment

    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? UCMJ

    I enlisted in the regular Air Force in Oct. 2009. During a security clearance investigation they discovered that I had Asperger Disorder, a mild form of Autism, of which dosent effect me other than a minor social skills impairment.

    My question is:

    I didnt disclose this condition due I felt that it wouldnt be disqualifying if they found out. I base this on (1) The medical enlistment standards do not specifically prohibit enlistment without a waiver for this condition [Current or history of other mental disorders (all 290319 not listed above) that in the opinion of the civilian or military provider will interfere with, or prevent satisfactory performance of military duty, are disqualifying.] (2) Asperger is not a mental illness under any legal definition, (3) Asperger in adults usually does not require any treatment (4) I was cleared by my doctor in 2008 to work at a prison, and I continued to work at the prison for the two years prior to my enlistment (5) If I could handle a stressful prison environment, then I could handle the military. (6) It is highly unlikely that I would ever be hendered by this condition in the future

    Did I mess up by not mentioning something prior to my enlistment? I know that to be considered fraudulent enlistment a concealed condition must be disqualifying. I do not feel that it was disqualifying, Did I apply the law correctly here?

    The Command has said nothing to me about it yet. The security investigator told me, that, at the most, they would probably order me to have a medical eval, and as long as they turned up OK, I would be fine.
  2. #2
    justalayman is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by md_usaf View Post

    Did I mess up by not mentioning something prior to my enlistment? I know that to be considered fraudulent enlistment a concealed condition must be disqualifying. I do not feel that it was disqualifying, Did I apply the law correctly here? e.

    you don't apply the law. You answer questions. If they said "what have you been treated for in the last 1, 5, 10, years or in your lifetime, you tell them. Failing to provide any information that applies is illegal is a basis for a fraudulent enlistment.

    Unless they changed things from the lase time I went through this, you are not asked to only inform them of medical treatment and problems you believe might be a problem.

    has the basic question of: what have you been treated for in the last (so many years,)? been changed to "tell us what you want to?

    btw; apply all the questions to autism that you applied to Aspergers. Take note of this:
    (2) Asperger is not a mental illness under any legal definition
    that is because it is considered to be this:

    they discovered that I had Asperger Disorder, a mild form of Autism
    from aspergers.com:

    Both Asperger's Disorder and Autistic Disorder are in fact subgroups of a larger diagnostic category. This larger category is called either Autistic Spectrum Disorders
  3. #3
    md_usaf is offline Junior Member
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    To clear things up a bit:

    Autism, Asperger, nor any other Autism Spectrum Disorder are not mental illnesses, based on the fact they are more of a dysfunction than an illness. To call an ASD, in and of itself, a Mental illness would be the same as to call Mental Retardation a Mental Illness. Mental Retardation being of course an intellectual impairment, and ASD's being more of a Social Impairment. ASD's are classified as developmental disabilities under federal and most state law, and not mental illnesses.

    You stated something in regards to the "tell all" to meps. However I see where your coming from. You cannot be guilty of fraudulent enlistment unless you "enlisted or appointed in an armed force" and "knowingly misrepresented or deliberately concealed a certain material fact or facts regarding qualifications of the accused for enlistment or appointment" and "your enlistment or appointment was obtained or procured by that knowingly false representation or deliberate concealment" [US vs Stevens ACM S30170 (A.F. Ct. Crim. Appeals, 20 Jul 2004)]

    Based on Steven, surpa, just because you fail to disclose something that they ask you on the form, you are not guilty as long as what you failed to disclose was not material to your enlistment.

    Furthermore, the Courts have held that only things that would have caused you to be rejected are material for fraudulent enlistment purposes. Example, you are not guilty of fraudulent enlistment just because you got your first ever traffic ticket and fail to disclose it to anyone, and it turns up later on, just as long as the branch of service that you are joining doesnt require a waiver to enlist with only one traffic violation.


    Did I apply the correct law here?
  4. #4
    cyjeff is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by md_usaf View Post
    To clear things up a bit:

    Autism, Asperger, nor any other Autism Spectrum Disorder are not mental illnesses, based on the fact they are more of a dysfunction than an illness. To call an ASD, in and of itself, a Mental illness would be the same as to call Mental Retardation a Mental Illness. Mental Retardation being of course an intellectual impairment, and ASD's being more of a Social Impairment. ASD's are classified as developmental disabilities under federal and most state law, and not mental illnesses.

    You stated something in regards to the "tell all" to meps. However I see where your coming from. You cannot be guilty of fraudulent enlistment unless you "enlisted or appointed in an armed force" and "knowingly misrepresented or deliberately concealed a certain material fact or facts regarding qualifications of the accused for enlistment or appointment" and "your enlistment or appointment was obtained or procured by that knowingly false representation or deliberate concealment" [US vs Stevens ACM S30170 (A.F. Ct. Crim. Appeals, 20 Jul 2004)]

    Based on Steven, surpa, just because you fail to disclose something that they ask you on the form, you are not guilty as long as what you failed to disclose was not material to your enlistment.

    Furthermore, the Courts have held that only things that would have caused you to be rejected are material for fraudulent enlistment purposes. Example, you are not guilty of fraudulent enlistment just because you got your first ever traffic ticket and fail to disclose it to anyone, and it turns up later on, just as long as the branch of service that you are joining doesnt require a waiver to enlist with only one traffic violation.


    Did I apply the correct law here?
    Let me take a shot.

    You were applying for a security clearance.

    Even a single lie means you fail.
  5. #5
    md_usaf is offline Junior Member
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    Yes, I was applying for a security clearance, and I agree with you when you say you lie you fail. How is it a lie though. I didnt fail to disclose a materal disqualification that would have barred my enlistment with a waiver. I mean, even the investigator told me that it isnt an issue.

    I guess my question is, since I dont require modifications nor any other treatment, is it even an issue at this point.
  6. #6
    justalayman is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by md_usaf View Post
    I guess my question is, since I dont require modifications nor any other treatment, is it even an issue at this point.
    I would suggest it will be based on exactly what was asked. If asked a specific question and you failed to disclose something, whether it was material, in your opinion or not, you did not answer the question honestly.


    You cannot be guilty of fraudulent enlistment unless you "enlisted or appointed in an armed force" and "knowingly misrepresented or deliberately concealed a certain material fact or facts regarding qualifications of the accused for enlistment or appointment" and "your enlistment or appointment was obtained or procured by that knowingly false representation or deliberate concealment" [US vs Stevens ACM S30170 (A.F. Ct. Crim. Appeals, 20 Jul 2004)]
    if they asked you

    "have you been diagnosed or treated for anything you believe would be of concern" and you answered no, then you did not lie.


    If they asked "write down all medical conditions, treatments, and diagnosis applied to you", then you lied.

    so, yes, it could be material, not for the fact it is a disorder but for the fact you were not truthful.


    Autism, Asperger, nor any other Autism Spectrum Disorder are not mental illnesses, based on the fact they are more of a dysfunction than an illness. To call an ASD, in and of itself, a Mental illness would be the same as to call Mental Retardation a Mental Illness. Mental Retardation being of course an intellectual impairment, and ASD's being more of a Social Impairment. ASD's are classified as developmental disabilities under federal and most state law, and not mental illnesses.
    and the point is?



    I never said it was a mental illness but it is surely a condition that is relevant to your enlistment. My post was meant to state that Aspergers is considered to be related to autism and they both fall under the umbrella of Autistic Spectrum Disorders.
  7. #7
    cyjeff is offline Senior Member
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    Half of the security clearance process is not what you put down but what you hide.

    You see, the military has this crazy idea that they shouldn't trust you with their secrets if you would willingly lie to them.

    Wacky, I know.
  8. #8
    md_usaf is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyjeff View Post
    Half of the security clearance process is not what you put down but what you hide.

    You see, the military has this crazy idea that they shouldn't trust you with their secrets if you would willingly lie to them.

    Wacky, I know.
    Where are you drawing the conclusion that I lied to them???? As part of the security interview process I told them that I had Asperger Disorder, and what it was. They told me it was not an issue as to a security clearance, and appearently since I got my my interim after that, it wasnt a big deal to them.

    I guess I am worrying for no reason. I guess if they granted me an interum TS, I shouldn't be worries about getting kicked out. If they thought I might be guilty of fraudulent enlistment then I doubt they would have given me an interim.
  9. #9
    cyjeff is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by md_usaf View Post
    Where are you drawing the conclusion that I lied to them???? As part of the security interview process I told them that I had Asperger Disorder, and what it was. They told me it was not an issue as to a security clearance, and appearently since I got my my interim after that, it wasnt a big deal to them.
    You said you didn't disclose it... I couldn't tell from your post the timeline.

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