Desertion Issue (Different Story)

[Oddyball]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA



My story is a fairly unique one.

LONG STORY: I was an e-3 at my unit in Ft. Irwin CA. I had joined the Army in 2005 and spent about 2 years in when I went AWOL in Oct. 2007. Now, I didn't purposefully go AWOL. I had been suffering from some stress/mental issues and I had asked my Platoon Sgt., squad leader and team leader if I could go to see mental health on base and I was denied over and over. I was a good solider, never had an Article 15, or any UCMJ. I had constantly asked to get help, but I was told we were "too busy". So on Oct. 6th 2007, while home visiting my family and friends, I had a stress breakdown and ended up trying to commit suicide. It's not something I was even aware of, and I have barely any recollection of it. My friends managed to talk me into going to the local hospital and I was admitted for 3 days. My friends contacted my chain of command and they told me to come back when I was let out of the hospital.

However, I chose not to go back when I got out. I had felt that I would rather see a psychologist for a month in the real world who could help me, instead of going back to my unit right away. I had always intended on going back in about a month or so. So I saw the psychologist and she diagnosed me with some issues. I asked her to write me a letter so I could bring it back to my chain of command which said that I had told her I planned on returning and that I did REALLY have issues. So after being "AWOL" for about a month and a half I finally packed my bags and was ready to go back to my unit. When I called my Platoon Sgt. to let him know I was returning, he said "no you're not, we're chaptering you out of the army. If you come back I will have you court marshaled and sent to prison for 6 - 10 years. DO NOT COME BACK."

I told him that I had never heard of anyone being discharged without being present and he said that there were new rules and regs, and he was telling the truth. He told me he would contact me when I was officially "out". A few months pass and I didn't hear anything while I was at my house. Finally he sent me a text message in Feb. 2008 saying simply "you're out." So I thought... "Okay, I'm out." So I went back to college, and started to try and live a normal life. Still, though... no discharge papers. So I called Desertion hotline, my sheriffs department, MP office, recruiters and all of them said they had no information on me. So I figured I was out. And then Halloween 08 comes, and I still hadn't heard a thing. So I called my battalion and spoke with someone on staff duty. I told him about my situation and asked him to get a hold of my old 1SG. He said that my 1SG was in the field, but he would call him and get him on his cell-phones speaker.

He told the 1SG about me and asked him if I was really out. The 1SG said "Yeah, he's out. He's been out for a long time now, we just didnt have a good address to send his paperwork." So I left my address and awaited my discharge papers. Now its Jan 09, and still nothing. So I called back a few days ago and actually spoke directly with my 1SG. He said:

"Hey there, whats up?"

"Hey 1SG, its ****** here, Sgt. so-and-so told me not to come back, said I was being chaptered. I was just wondering where my discharge paperwork is?"

"What discharge paperwork? You're still in the Army."

My jaw dropped.

I asked him why I had been told I was not to come back by a Staff Sergeant and why he had at an earlier point said that my paperwork wasnt sent because of no address.

And of course, he said: "I can neither confirm, nor deny what anyone said at any point about anything."

He said that he had sent my paperwork was sent up to Texas, but I was considered AWOL. He said that I had 3 days to get back, or else it would be hard on me, blah blah blah. I've been in contact with lawyers, GI Hotline, everyone I can think of, and I get many conflicting statements and advice. Most people say they've never heard anything like this before. I do have my medical records from my hospital stay, I do have my letter from the shrink - phone records from Verizon which show that my sgt was in contact with me, and the text message from him saying "you're out."

If I do go back to that unit, I know I will be martyred. I'm quite certain I will be court marshaled even though I was told NOT to come back. I mean, yeah I guess I was somewhat naive to listen to him about not coming back, but as an infantryman, we were NEVER told about DFR, or anything having to do with AWOL or desertion. I never ever ever decided to "run away". I went to the hospital, decided to take some time to myself and when I wanted to come back I was told not to. So yeah...


Right now, at this moment, I'm in Mississippi because my grandfather passed away last month and I came out here to take care of my grandma. I'm alone out her, I'm 23, she's 85 and she has dementia. She doesn't want care takers coming over because she is afraid of strangers. I have a small family, so for the time being I can't leave her. I've called the Desertion hotline, they said they can't tell me my status. I'm really pissed off because I WANTED to finish my career. I wanted an Honorable discharge. I wanted to become a cop and have my time served. But because one NCO lied to me it seems my dreams are forever going to be screwed. I'm just looking for any ADVICE....

I know my situation is... different. I have no reason to make any of this up. I will take a lie detector test by anyone to prove my innocence. I've even written a statement and was planing on sending it to my congressman. I won't let some stupid NCO's lie to me and trick and deceive me any longer.

[ERAUPIKE]

The only thing different about your story is that you gave every insignificant detail. Interpreting your story will help you better understand what it looks like.

You went home on leave and tried to commit suicide. You then decided that you were not going to return to your command for a month. You became a deserter.

Sounds like the same story that every other deserter has posted.

Your story will hold about as much water as a funnel.

[Oddyball]

Originally Posted by ERAUPIKE

The only thing different about your story is that you gave every insignificant detail. Interpreting your story will help you better understand what it looks like.

You went home on leave and tried to commit suicide. You then decided that you were not going to return to your command for a month. You became a deserter.

Sounds like the same story that every other deserter has posted.

Your story will hold about as much water as a funnel.

Uhm I wasn't on leave, first off. Second off I wasn't a typical awol soldier who was trying to commit suicide. I went awol to get help. When I said I was coming back I was told DO NOT COME BACK. I was told, with evidence, that I was NOT TO COME BACK. So... how am I a deserter? Explain it to me. I never intentionally stayed gone. I TRIED to go back. Hmm?

Looks like the military and their "rough and tough" NCO's can lie. Huh, don't say that in the commercials do they? Army strong my ass.

[Oddyball]

Originally Posted by ERAUPIKE

The only thing different about your story is that you gave every insignificant detail. Interpreting your story will help you better understand what it looks like.

You went home on leave and tried to commit suicide. You then decided that you were not going to return to your command for a month. You became a deserter.

Sounds like the same story that every other deserter has posted.

Your story will hold about as much water as a funnel.

Oh and... a story is something fictional, with no facts based in reality and no evidence, timelines, witnesses and proof to back it up. Mine, however, has all of those. So what story are you referring to?

Look man, I'm not trying to condescend you. I don't know you, and I'm not here to fight. I was a good soldier, and made the choices I made but I also was told not to come back because I was being chaptered. Now, to find out a year later that all of that was an ENTIRE LIE, you know... makes everything flip upside down in my life. I want to go back, and I am. But... I feel like Im going to be ignored and punished and the ******* who lied to me won't have a thing done to him.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by Oddyball

Uhm I wasn't on leave, first off. Second off I wasn't a typical awol soldier who was trying to commit suicide. I went awol to get help. When I said I was coming back I was told DO NOT COME BACK. I was told, with evidence, that I was NOT TO COME BACK. So... how am I a deserter? Explain it to me. I never intentionally stayed gone. I TRIED to go back. Hmm?

Looks like the military and their "rough and tough" NCO's can lie. Huh, don't say that in the commercials do they? Army strong my ass.

You went AWOL, there is no denying that. Regardless of your intentions, you were AWOL and in violation of the UCMJ. You were classified as a deserter after the initial month and a half you were AWOL. That is also clearly spelled out in the UCMJ. Unless there was an amendment added in the past week covering individuals with "some issues" you are still subject to punishment under the associated article.

I find it difficult to comprehend how you can "try" to return to your unit. A wise man I served under used to say "There are two ways to do things, you can try or you can." You didn't go back because you were told if you did come back you would be sent to court martial. You decided on your own not to return at that point.

Bring your sad tale and any "evidence" you may think you have with you when you go to Ft. Sill. You will soon see that your "story" is the same as a majority of the other deserters returning to face their mistake. The sooner you realize this the better off you will be.

[Oddyball]

Originally Posted by ERAUPIKE

You went AWOL, there is no denying that. Regardless of your intentions, you were AWOL and in violation of the UCMJ. You were classified as a deserter after the initial month and a half you were AWOL. That is also clearly spelled out in the UCMJ. Unless there was an amendment added in the past week covering individuals with "some issues" you are still subject to punishment under the associated article.

I find it difficult to comprehend how you can "try" to return to your unit. A wise man I served under used to say "There are two ways to do things, you can try or you can." You didn't go back because you were told if you did come back you would be sent to court martial. You decided on your own not to return at that point.

Bring your sad tale and any "evidence" you may think you have with you when you go to Ft. Sill. You will soon see that your "story" is the same as a majority of the other deserters returning to face their mistake. The sooner you realize this the better off you will be.

You speak of Army Regulations, you've spoken of everything RIGHT the military does, but mention nothing about what they've done WRONG in my situation. Misinformation is disinformation. Instead of saying "ok, come back to base, we'll take care of this." they said "if you come back you'll go to prison for 6 years. Dont come back, you're out of the military, move on with your life." So, in your opinion I've done everything wrong, yet they haven't. As if there is only one side to the coin. I am going back, but I came here for advice, hence "Free"advice".com."

If you've served you know that the military "loses" paperwork, and more or less never gives a straight answer. I did not come here to DEFEND my own actions because I take 100% responsibility for the fact that I went AWOL. Now that is out of the way. My concern however is what will happen when I return to my base. I will take and accept full punishment for my one month of missing formation and being absent. Yet I ALWAYS had the intent to return, except the difference is, when I called my chain of command back to go through the proper "channels" like we were always trained (at least in the infantry) I was told by everyone in my chain of command that I was being DISCHARGED.

Now obviously that is a LIE. So I'm making no excuses, I just want to know what I should expect when I return. I doubt they will believe me until I give them my documents and phone records. Now, is there a chance that I will be able to be retained and processed back in to finish my term? Or has too much time passed for that to occur? I would honestly like to finish my contract out and do what I promised to do. Or should I go back and just try to get out? I mean, in my opinion they will either A) Try to retain me, B) Try to Discharge me or C) Try to court marshal me. If it is the latter of the three, should I hire a personal attorney before I return? I'm just here for advice, because I know the truth behind my situation. I have not once, in this entire thread tried to abdicate myself from what has happened. Yet, I wasn't the only factor in this situation who ****ed up. And seeing as I am dealing with the Military, it's unlikely that they will sacrifice their own to help me.


Also, "You didn't go back because you were told if you did come back you would be sent to court martial. You decided on your own not to return at that point." That's like saying, "Well, you knew you had a chance to rob a bank, but since you didn't, you won't be able to pay your mortgage or bills." Like taking ANY ACTION that they told me about is the best. Hmm, yeah let me choose between option A) Prison or B) Discharge. So I'm at fault for not returning and going to prison, the only option that was LEFT ON THE TABLE. And you know that was a lie. I mean, you come here to give advice, so you know about desertion cases and you know that prison isn't normally the punishment if you return; especially after 1 month dude. However, at that time in my career as a private in the infantry, I didn't. I knew nothing of what proper procedures where for dishcarges. I just listened to what I was told like I always did and was TRAINED to do. But in your opinion I should have listened to EVERYTHING as a soldier but yet I should have been able to see through that one single lie? Seems to me like you're picking and choosing which parties here are right based on bias. Your statement falls flat because you obviously take preference to the military, even though THEY LIED to me, which got me into crud even deeper. So the people who lied to me are going to be the people to punish me. Sounds fair, right?

[Silverplum]

Originally Posted by Oddyball

I have not once, in this entire thread tried to abdicate myself from what has happened. Yet, I wasn't the only factor in this situation who ****ed up.

The only thing you've done is try to abdicate yourself (of responsibility, which is the only reasonable usage of that word.)

[Oddyball]

You know, I'd love to sit here and retort back and forth with one another over semantics of who is wrong and who isn't, but it's pointless and won't get me anywhere. I came here for some advice which no one has seemed fit to help me with, so I'm just going to drop this. Thanks for the fun, later.

Also, you know I understand how some people can sit here all high and mighty and deem so many soldiers as peices of **** for going AWOL and leaving, abandoning their 'obligations." Yet, if the military actually took time to listen to some of the issues which their HUMAN property are dealing with instead of turning a blind eye, over working and exhausting every aspect of their resources (both human, and mechanic) then maybe they wouldn't see so many soldiers run away. The alcohol, suicide, drug and desertion rates are higher than they were in Vietnam. You so faithful to the uniform and romanticized image of "Serving" should probably reassess what is actually important in the military. My NCO's always preached that the military would be nothing without the people, low ranking and high. Unfortunately the Army and Marine corps are dealing with old worn out equipment at an administrative level, making the possibility of dealing with everyone's problems almost impossible. The military as a whole isn't horrible, but the lack of oversight from officers is. They allow NCO's to get away with lies and deciet in order to get their way. So please, save the "Holier Than Thou" attitude. I served, I did what only certain people do - and yeah, I may not have ended it in the picture perfect way, but I'd like to see those of you who haven't served tell me and others on this forum that we didn't try. We aren't all the same, so don't think that my life should be held to your standard.

Dozens of my friends who I am still in contact with who have finished their terms aren't getting their GI bills because as the Army puts it "We don't have the resources due to two wars." It's not the Army's fault necessarily, but it is the Governments. Recruiters are so quick to pretend to care about those who they are trying to recruit because it's their JOB; like a car salesmen. But all soldiers really are are numbers, bodies if you will. And yeah I loved serving, loved my squad and the friends I made, but the lies and bull**** just can't be ignored by anyone with self respect and common sense. I know I didn't "run away." I had real mental issues which a PROFESSIONAL Psychologist diagnosed me with. Unlike the military's "counselors" who turned a blind eye from me because their only concern is making sure they weed out the fakers from the real people dealing with issues and keeping soldiers from leaving the Army. Sad to see how poorly our military is run, but hey... they still have awesome PR companies who can put out wonderful commercials and pamphlets. It's not hard to trick and deceive kids straight out of high school who are completely impressionable. Drug dealers do it on a daily basis, and at least they tell you what you're getting yourself into. But whatever, live and learn, and then go to college.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by Oddyball

You know, I'd love to sit here and retort back and forth with one another over semantics of who is wrong and who isn't, but it's pointless and won't get me anywhere. I came here for some advice which no one has seemed fit to help me with, so I'm just going to drop this. Thanks for the fun, later.

Also, you know I understand how some people can sit here all high and mighty and deem so many soldiers as peices of **** for going AWOL and leaving, abandoning their 'obligations." Yet, if the military actually took time to listen to some of the issues which their HUMAN property are dealing with instead of turning a blind eye, over working and exhausting every aspect of their resources (both human, and mechanic) then maybe they wouldn't see so many soldiers run away. The alcohol, suicide, drug and desertion rates are higher than they were in Vietnam. You so faithful to the uniform and romanticized image of "Serving" should probably reassess what is actually important in the military. My NCO's always preached that the military would be nothing without the people, low ranking and high. Unfortunately the Army and Marine corps are dealing with old worn out equipment at an administrative level, making the possibility of dealing with everyone's problems almost impossible. The military as a whole isn't horrible, but the lack of oversight from officers is. They allow NCO's to get away with lies and deciet in order to get their way. So please, save the "Holier Than Thou" attitude. I served, I did what only certain people do - and yeah, I may not have ended it in the picture perfect way, but I'd like to see those of you who haven't served tell me and others on this forum that we didn't try. We aren't all the same, so don't think that my life should be held to your standard.

Dozens of my friends who I am still in contact with who have finished their terms aren't getting their GI bills because as the Army puts it "We don't have the resources due to two wars." It's not the Army's fault necessarily, but it is the Governments. Recruiters are so quick to pretend to care about those who they are trying to recruit because it's their JOB; like a car salesmen. But all soldiers really are are numbers, bodies if you will. And yeah I loved serving, loved my squad and the friends I made, but the lies and bull**** just can't be ignored by anyone with self respect and common sense. I know I didn't "run away." I had real mental issues which a PROFESSIONAL Psychologist diagnosed me with. Unlike the military's "counselors" who turned a blind eye from me because their only concern is making sure they weed out the fakers from the real people dealing with issues and keeping soldiers from leaving the Army. Sad to see how poorly our military is run, but hey... they still have awesome PR companies who can put out wonderful commercials and pamphlets. It's not hard to trick and deceive kids straight out of high school who are completely impressionable. Drug dealers do it on a daily basis, and at least they tell you what you're getting yourself into. But whatever, live and learn, and then go to college.

First I am not a dude. You won't have to try to get out when you return. You are going to be adversely discharged at the least. The best you can hope for is a quick OTH, which with your attitude is highly unlikely. You are wrong though. Prison is very common for members that are charged with desertion. You may have convinced yourself that it is no big deal, but you face some very serious charges upon your return that you are unarguably guilty of.

Again you leave the standard form answer of this not being your fault at all. It's the officers fault, NCO's fault, the Army's fault, or the recruiters fault you refused to serve your voluntary obligation. I'd like to see where you got your statistics from when you referred to the rate of alcohol, drug, desertion and suicide. I never called you anything, you assume that is what I think of you. To be honest I don't form any of opinion of you as a person. I know that you have a burden to carry the rest of your life that will show you many closed doors that would have otherwise been open.

You should talk to your friends about their G.I. Bill. The Army has nothing to do with the disbursement of funds to qualified members. That is completed by the Department of Veterans Affairs. In fact the G.I. Bill has just been revamped to offer veterans even more money for attending college. 100% of the highest state schools tuition, BAH, and a once a year book stipend. The G.I. Bill will also be free to every member that is eligible upon discharge. Nobody has to put into it anymore. Read this a few times and every time you look at your minimum wage paycheck remember how your decisions kept you from receiving this free help to better yourself. Maybe part of your problem with your command is your now obvious propensity to not tell the truth. You were given valid advice, you just didn't like what you heard. Which is understandable because you are facing a life altering punitive action by the Army in the very near future.

Bottom line is that you have no one to blame but yourself. I have no pity for you and as a veteran stories like yours make me wonder where the character of your generation has gone. I am sure with your limited experience in the armed forces you know what is best for the military as a whole. You should write to the President and let him know your educated opinion on how the military should be run. Include your management and supervisory experience for credibility as well.

[Oddyball]

Originally Posted by ERAUPIKE

First I am not a dude. You won't have to try to get out when you return. You are going to be adversely discharged at the least. The best you can hope for is a quick OTH, which with your attitude is highly unlikely. You are wrong though. Prison is very common for members that are charged with desertion. You may have convinced yourself that it is no big deal, but you face some very serious charges upon your return that you are unarguably guilty of.

Again you leave the standard form answer of this not being your fault at all. It's the officers fault, NCO's fault, the Army's fault, or the recruiters fault you refused to serve your voluntary obligation. I'd like to see where you got your statistics from when you referred to the rate of alcohol, drug, desertion and suicide. I never called you anything, you assume that is what I think of you. To be honest I don't form any of opinion of you as a person. I know that you have a burden to carry the rest of your life that will show you many closed doors that would have otherwise been open.

You should talk to your friends about their G.I. Bill. The Army has nothing to do with the disbursement of funds to qualified members. That is completed by the Department of Veterans Affairs. In fact the G.I. Bill has just been revamped to offer veterans even more money for attending college. 100% of the highest state schools tuition, BAH, and a once a year book stipend. The G.I. Bill will also be free to every member that is eligible upon discharge. Nobody has to put into it anymore. Read this a few times and every time you look at your minimum wage paycheck remember how your decisions kept you from receiving this free help to better yourself. Maybe part of your problem with your command is your now obvious propensity to not tell the truth. You were given valid advice, you just didn't like what you heard. Which is understandable because you are facing a life altering punitive action by the Army in the very near future.

Bottom line is that you have no one to blame but yourself. I have no pity for you and as a veteran stories like yours make me wonder where the character of your generation has gone. I am sure with your limited experience in the armed forces you know what is best for the military as a whole. You should write to the President and let him know your educated opinion on how the military should be run. Include your management and supervisory experience for credibility as well.

It's so cute how you think you're correct. Well I made a few phone calls, faxed a few documents and found out the answer to my issue. It appears that I actually AM discharged, with an HONORABLE discharge. It seems though that my paperwork was sent to the wrong installation twice, and it is now in the hands of the department of the Army. I was sent my DD214 first class mail and it arrived today. I am also setting up when I am going to get my GI Bill. So thank you for reading and participating in this little discussion of ours. Yet, I can't help but feel some pity for you and your close minded way of seeing situations. Oh well, all works out well in the end. Take care!