Military Contracts

[pete07172]

What is the name of your state? GA

I reenlisted in iraq back in NOV 07, for current station stabilization, not unit stabilization for 12 months upon redeployment. I am 5 months out from my stabilization is up and the army is telling me that i am stuck in my current unit due to a projected stop loss in jul 09 not a garunteed one. Is this in anyway a breach of contract because i fulfilled my obligation to the contract but now the army ain't keeping up there end. Yes i have read my contract and nowhere in there does it state i am subject to sto loss stop movement anywhere. Any and all info anyone can give me is greatly appreciated

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by pete07172

What is the name of your state? GA

I reenlisted in iraq back in NOV 07, for current station stabilization, not unit stabilization for 12 months upon redeployment. I am 5 months out from my stabilization is up and the army is telling me that i am stuck in my current unit due to a projected stop loss in jul 09 not a garunteed one. Is this in anyway a breach of contract because i fulfilled my obligation to the contract but now the army ain't keeping up there end. Yes i have read my contract and nowhere in there does it state i am subject to sto loss stop movement anywhere. Any and all info anyone can give me is greatly appreciated

There is no way to advise you without actually reading your contract. You should review the regulations for a stop loss and see if the Army has violated them. (very doubtful)

[pete07172]

Thank you for your reply, i can send you a copy of the contract if that would help.

[pete07172]

under paragraph 9C of the enlistment contract it states.

In the event of war, my enlistment in the Armed Forces continues until six (6) months after the war ends, unless my enlistment is ended sooner by the President of the United States.

Last I checked we are not at war anymore, and techniclly we have never been at war. Because if we had been then when bush declared war over on May 02 2003 then we would have to release the POW's, but yet we still hold all the prisoners at gitmo.

under paragraph 10A of my enlistment it states.

If this is my initial enlistment, I must serve a total of eight (8) years. Any part of that service not served on active duty must be served in a Reserve Component, unless I am sooner discharged.

This is my third enlistment, not my initial. and i hit 8 years in febuary. anymore info you can give me would be greatful.

[fozzy2]

There is really not a lot you can do. Since you are already enlisted there are two cardinal rules: You aren't done until discharged by the military, and until you are discharged you must pretty much do as you are told. You need to immediately file paperwork (a 'personnel action') stating that you don't think the government is going to live up to its end of the contract and that you request discharge. That way at least your situation will be reviewed by DC legal staff to see if it follows law and policy. But don't hold your breath - if the military wants to keep you, it generally can. Stop loss policies have been challenged, almost always unsuccessfully (your hope is that your case is somehow a violation of policy).

As for being "at war" - Quite simply, it doesn't matter what congress or the president "declares" or doesn't declare. The fact that "a state of war" exists (because the President says so) is normally good enough for the judiciary. Arguing over the legality of war is common by laypersons and poli-sci classes. In the courts, however, what is war or not war is usually simply delared by the executive.

[pete07172]

thank you for your reply, i now know what i need to do. Since the army dosn't feel it has to keep up there end of the deal, i don't feel i should have to keep up mine. Once again thank you for your reply. call me coward or whatever, i don't care. Unlke some people i have done exactly what the army tells me to do, but this is the thanks i get from them... Thanks again

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by pete07172

thank you for your reply, i now know what i need to do. Since the army dosn't feel it has to keep up there end of the deal, i don't feel i should have to keep up mine. Once again thank you for your reply. call me coward or whatever, i don't care. Unlke some people i have done exactly what the army tells me to do, but this is the thanks i get from them... Thanks again

To be honest Pete, you are approaching this situation with a very immature attitude. I understand the frustration that must be involved with this process but your insinuated course of action is not a viable solution. You have no idea how much you would give up with such a foolhardy decision to act like a toddler. Use the resources available to you and realize that there are people out there on your side. There is a better way to handle a tough situation like this and as an NCO I think you know that. Suck it up and do the right thing.

[pete07172]

No disrespect to you intended, but unless you have been in my situation, where you are trying to do things the right way but getting crapped on you have no idea what i am going through. If this was my first deployment, or even my first attempt to get away from my current station which i have been at for 5 years, and deployed with twice then that would be immature. But i have gone through all the right channels, gotten a 4187 turned in and got my code changed from a O code which is locked in to current unit, to a L code which is fully eligible to PCS, then the army went and changed it to a N code which is locked into current unit depending Deployment, for the 4th time in less the 6 years. If that is Immature then i guess i am, i have served 8 years in the army with a flawless service record and more ribbons and medals then most senior enlisted can shake a stick at. It's soldier's like me that do what they are told, when they are told to do it that get crapped on. So again thanks for your reply, even though it wasn't helpful

[ERAUPIKE]

You are the only member of the military to have to deal with any type of hardship. If you were a good NCO you would have more fortitude to deal with this situation and be able to attempt to adapt and overcome this adversity.

Loyalty
Bear true faith and allegiance to the U.S. Constitution, the Army, your unit and other Soldiers.
Duty
Fulfill your obligations
Respect
Treat people as they should be treated
Selfless Service
Put the welfare of the Nation, the Army and your subordinates before your own.
Honor
Live up to Army values.
Integrity
Do what’s right, legally and morally
Personal Courage
Face fear, danger or adversity (physical or moral)

Stop throwing a tantrum and look at this situation as an adult. Think of the impact this decision will have on your future and the benefits you will be throwing away. Think of the medals you wear so proudly and ask if they really mean that little to you. I said that I understand the frustration because I have dealt with situations like yours and I did the right thing, not the easy thing.

[IrishLady47]

Different stop loss policies have been utilized since 9/11. No one's enlistment contract addresses whether or not they will or won't be subject to a possible future stop loss. As Fozzy2 points out - legal challenges against previous stop loss policies have not been successful. You should still check with your PSNCO about the details of the stop loss policy you would be falling under and what are the exemptions--you may meet one of those. You can also find out what your ETS will be extended to for future planning. Believe me--the Army's not keeping you forever.

Right now there are no MOS stop loss policies in effect so I'm assuming that the unit you're assigned to may be placed on a deployment schedule in July 2009 thereby creating a stop loss for all assigned soldiers not otherwise exempt.

You state that you enlisted for 12 month current station stablization and that you have 5 months left on that. If your unit is not deploying until after July 2009 (more than 5 months from now), why do you feel the Army has not fulfilled the contract? You have had your 12months of stabilization. What am I missing here? You also state that you've been in almost 8 years, especially the last 8 years--so you have seen first hand that stop loss/movement policies DO exist and are invoked with little notice. If you did not consider that when you reenlisted (perhaps a bonus clouded your mind), I think that is your oversight--not the Army's.

I do thank you for your service to our country and wish you luck. I hope you will not mar your military record with an action you will regret later.

[IrishLady47]

Originally Posted by pete07172

No disrespect to you intended, but unless you have been in my situation, where you are trying to do things the right way but getting crapped on you have no idea what i am going through. If this was my first deployment, or even my first attempt to get away from my current station which i have been at for 5 years, and deployed with twice then that would be immature. But i have gone through all the right channels, gotten a 4187 turned in and got my code changed from a O code which is locked in to current unit, to a L code which is fully eligible to PCS, then the army went and changed it to a N code which is locked into current unit depending Deployment, for the 4th time in less the 6 years. If that is Immature then i guess i am, i have served 8 years in the army with a flawless service record and more ribbons and medals then most senior enlisted can shake a stick at. It's soldier's like me that do what they are told, when they are told to do it that get crapped on. So again thanks for your reply, even though it wasn't helpful

Sorry, this was not posted before my earlier reply. But, now I'm really confused. Why did you reenlist for current station stabilization if you wanted to PCS? Why didn't you reenlist for a station of choice?

[pete07172]

Trust me i don't want to tarnish my record, and why am i gripeing about it now is because in 5 months guess what i'll still be here, already been told that by my branch which handles where and when i can leave. When i reenlisted for stabilization we were scheduled to leave for a deployment in Nov 09 not July 09, so stop loss would have taken affect in August not july which would have given me plenty of time to leave, but because of the time shift i got stuck. Now all i want from the army is to leave my current unit and actually be home for more then one year, unless you can say you have been deployed 3 years out of the last 5 then you wouldn't understand. I really don't care about deployments i'll do those while standing on my head. But what i would like is a break more then a year with my wife and son. At what time do you put your family before your job... if you can honestly answer that one please do...

[pete07172]

The reason reenlisted for stabilization is because the only duty stations available to me at the time were, fort hood, fort drum, fort carson, fort lewis, fort bragg, fort campbell. All combat arms and rapidly deployed units. Sorry if you feel like what i did was a mistake, the only mistake i made was reenlisting at all. Thank you for you reply

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by pete07172

Trust me i don't want to tarnish my record, and why am i gripeing about it now is because in 5 months guess what i'll still be here, already been told that by my branch which handles where and when i can leave. When i reenlisted for stabilization we were scheduled to leave for a deployment in Nov 09 not July 09, so stop loss would have taken affect in August not july which would have given me plenty of time to leave, but because of the time shift i got stuck. Now all i want from the army is to leave my current unit and actually be home for more then one year, unless you can say you have been deployed 3 years out of the last 5 then you wouldn't understand. I really don't care about deployments i'll do those while standing on my head. But what i would like is a break more then a year with my wife and son. At what time do you put your family before your job... if you can honestly answer that one please do...

Putting your family before your job in this case will jeopardize the future you have worked so hard to secure for them. While it may seem hard now, looking back you will see that staying was the right decision for you and your family.

[IrishLady47]

Originally Posted by pete07172

The reason reenlisted for stabilization is because the only duty stations available to me at the time were, fort hood, fort drum, fort carson, fort lewis, fort bragg, fort campbell. All combat arms and rapidly deployed units. Sorry if you feel like what i did was a mistake, the only mistake i made was reenlisting at all. Thank you for you reply

Understood. And, I do understand about wanting to be with your family. I handle retirements and separations for the population I support & the #1 reason my workload is up 30% the last few years is that very reason. Too many deployments in too short a time period.

Since your options from your career branch aren't any better than your current unit, have you considered volunteering for a special priority assignment?- - i.e., such as recruiting duty, drill sergeant or the Defense Attache System (wb assigned overseas--but most are accompanied tours and it is branch immaterial). Probably not what you want to hear, just throwing out other possibilities.

Again, best of luck to you and your family.