Right-of-Way

[slimpickens]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Penna.

Original private road, now a dead end, access runs parallel to my property. New private road was built with same access to get folks out. Current owner have access to old road & new road through their property but Their attorney says in letter that they should have right of way over old road to their properties, as there is no elimination or extinguishing of existing rights of way. They made another right of way across my property line to get to Original private road.

They have access to their property but prefer to use Original road across my property to get to their property which they are already on. Matter of convenience & inconsideration on their part instead of using their property.

Original road is on my property and is part of my deed. I have no problem with them using the Original right of way to get to Original road. However once they are on Original road they use it to drive their, lawn mowers, trucks, vehicles, building materials, cross my property to get to their property that they are already on. I would like to replant the grass, shrubs, plants that were there in the first place. The Original right of way shows that their Original drive way to their property was the Original right of way. Thank you for your patience & consideration. Thank you all so very much. Hope this helps!

SP

 

[HomeGuru]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Penna.

Original private road, now a dead end, access runs parallel to my property. New private road was built with same access to get folks out. Current owner have access to old road & new road through their property but Their attorney says in letter that they should have right of way over old road to their properties, as there is no elimination or extinguishing of existing rights of way. They made another right of way across my property line to get to Original private road.

They have access to their property but prefer to use Original road across my property to get to their property which they are already on. Matter of convenience & inconsideration on their part instead of using their property.

Original road is on my property and is part of my deed. I have no problem with them using the Original right of way to get to Original road. However once they are on Original road they use it to drive their, lawn mowers, trucks, vehicles, building materials, cross my property to get to their property that they are already on. I would like to replant the grass, shrubs, plants that were there in the first place. The Original right of way shows that their Original drive way to their property was the Original right of way. Thank you for your patience & consideration. Thank you all so very much. Hope this helps!

SP

**A: their attorney may be correct. Have your attorney review all docs and advise you.

 

[drewguy]

I'm a little confused by your description, but . . .

If there is an easement in your deed for access, they continue to have the right to use that described easement for its intended purpose even if there's a new road they can also use. But that doesn't give them the right to go off that road onto other parts of your property not included in the easement. Also, if the use is limited (e.g., for ingress/egress) then they can't use it for other things (parking, playing, etc.--they can use it only for access).

If the easement was created by necessity as opposed to deed, then it may be different--an easement by necessity for a landlocked parcel generally terminates once alternative access becomes available as it's no longer necessary.

 

[slimpickens]

I'm a little confused by your description, but . . .

If there is an easement in your deed for access, they continue to have the right to use that described easement for its intended purpose even if there's a new road they can also use. But that doesn't give them the right to go off that road onto other parts of your property not included in the easement. Also, if the use is limited (e.g., for ingress/egress) then they can't use it for other things (parking, playing, etc.--they can use it only for access).

If the easement was created by necessity as opposed to deed, then it may be different--an easement by necessity for a landlocked parcel generally terminates once alternative access becomes available as it's no longer necessary.

Apologize for the confusion on the description. This senior citizen will try to give you a better explanation. From what I can determine from the Indenture made in 1964 of the neighbors property that the aforedescribed right of way for the original private road is on the southern boundary of the neighbors.

The original private road runs northeast on my property. The neighbor made another ingress/egress to this private road through my property on the northeast. I explained that this would not be satisfactory and is not covered in the original Indenture that I can determine?

Their attorney wrote and said that all the neighbors will continue to have right of way to your properties over the original road. The original road runs a about 100 yds to a dead end. The neighbor has the right of way to the original road but uses it to truck in stone, topsoil, lawn & garden equipment, other purchases, etc. over my property.

This is essentially what I've been trying to resolve. I've tried to call their attorney to better understand & explain the situation but my calls have not been returned. Thank you for taking the time to understand where I was coming from. Your assistance & consideration has been very much appreciated. Hope this serves to clear up a few things. SP

 

[slimpickens]

**A: their attorney may be correct. Have your attorney review all docs and advise you.

Thanks for the input HomeGuru - SP

 

[154NH773]

Still not clear in my mind what the locations of the "original" road and "new" access road are, and how they relate, however; the fact that you granted what sounds like "permission" to cross other parts of your property does not extinguish the rights to use the "original" road for whatever purposes it was originally intended. If the right to the "new" route was GRANTED, then your options for negotiations may be limited
If you did not GRANT a new right-of-way, then maybe you could revoke permission to use that route, and try to negotiate a new easement route that everyone can agree on, and then extinguish all other routes.
I'd talk to a lawyer.

 

[slimpickens]

Still not clear in my mind what the locations of the "original" road and "new" access road are, and how they relate, however; the fact that you granted what sounds like "permission" to cross other parts of your property does not extinguish the rights to use the "original" road for whatever purposes it was originally intended. If the right to the "new" route was GRANTED, then your options for negotiations may be limited
If you did not GRANT a new right-of-way, then maybe you could revoke permission to use that route, and try to negotiate a new easement route that everyone can agree on, and then extinguish all other routes.
I'd talk to a lawyer.

The original private road gave all the people in the neighborhood access to the state highway which served as the outlet for many years. Original road was closed by state for safety purposes about 3 - 4 yrs ago. The new private access road grants the residents an outlet with right of ways established. The private land that was used belonged to another resident who granted the right of way.

Part of The original road joins the new road that now serves as the outlet. A section of The old road, about 100 yds, goes through my property and is now a dead end on the property of where it started/ended originally.

From what I can interpret from the neighbors Indenture shows his right of way to be on the South of his property to the old road that is now part of the new road as an outlet. However he has made another access to the new road through my property on the North. My property line is from 2 - 8 feet on the dead end original road but neighbor has extended some of his projects on my property. Just when I thought we had an understanding.

Thank you for taking the time to reply. Have received a lot of good information that will help when I take this matter up with an attorney. My other concern was what the scenario be if the old road was on both propertys? Perhaps I may try to sort this out in a different thread. SP

 

[HomeGuru]

The original private road gave all the people in the neighborhood access to the state highway which served as the outlet for many years. Original road was closed by state for safety purposes about 3 - 4 yrs ago. The new private access road grants the residents an outlet with right of ways established. The private land that was used belonged to another resident who granted the right of way.

Part of The original road joins the new road that now serves as the outlet. A section of The old road, about 100 yds, goes through my property and is now a dead end on the property of where it started/ended originally.

From what I can interpret from the neighbors Indenture shows his right of way to be on the South of his property to the old road that is now part of the new road as an outlet. However he has made another access to the new road through my property on the North. My property line is from 2 - 8 feet on the dead end original road but neighbor has extended some of his projects on my property. Just when I thought we had an understanding.

Thank you for taking the time to reply. Have received a lot of good information that will help when I take this matter up with an attorney. My other concern was what the scenario be if the old road was on both propertys? Perhaps I may try to sort this out in a different thread. SP

**A: no, please do not start a new thread on this issue.

 

[154NH773]

Have received a lot of good information that will help when I take this matter up with an attorney.

That would be my suggestion. It is very difficult (for me) to understand the relationships of the properties and roadways from your descriptions. It would be easier for you to discuss this with an attorney, with all the relevant maps and documents in front of him.
There's really no way to advise you without a clear understanding of the exact wording of the various easement documents involved, and locations and properties through which the easements are routed.
It sounds like the State was involved in rerouting the old easement, and perhaps they could help you in determining if the old easement was extinguished in favor of the new one.

but neighbor has extended some of his projects on my property

If you mean that the neighbor has traveled outside the boundaries of even the old easement, he cannot legally do that under any circumstances. He likewise; cannot utilize your property within the bounds of the old easement (if indeed it still exists) for uses not previously allowed. In other words, if only ingress and egress were previously allowed, he cannot park or store things or "extent some of his projects" onto the property.