INTERNET disorderly conduct? help!

[JHoersten2]

What is the name of your state - Kenosha County, Wisconsin

I'll make this brief:

I went onto Craigslist.org (free classified ad site) and made a post under the "free" section about giving away a free baby, or else I'd throw it away as a joke for my buddies. A way to mock most of the ridiculous free content listed there.

3 people contacted the police: 1 by phone, 1 to crimestoppers, and 1 by fax.

The police showed up, asked me to come to the station to talk. I made no written statement. Afterwards said if I didn't, I would have been arrested and forced to come.

I was printed/pictured and served a ticket for "disorderly conduct" ordinance 11.02M - Disturbing the peace: Engage in violent, abusive, indecent, profane, boisterous, unreasonably loud, or otherwise disorderly conduct under circumstances in which such conduct tends to cause or provoke a disturbance.


How is a privately owned internet site, not based out of this state, being governed by local law enforcement? And even so, my speech? I didn't FORCE anyone to read what I posted... they had to click on it first.

Any ideas how I could fight this measly ticket and prove victorious? Would those three people who complained have to show up in court with me to act as witnesses? ...is the internet within county law jurisdiction?

Your help would be most appreciated. Thank you bunches-

-J

 

[JHoersten2]

That may be, yes, but this is much bigger than that. If any "disturbance" on the internet can now be issued tickets and fines, this will change the entire internet as we know it. For anything that somebody is offended by to be a crime, will prove disastrous to the web.

 

[seniorjudge]

That may be, yes, but this is much bigger than that. If any "disturbance" on the internet can now be issued tickets and fines, this will change the entire internet as we know it. For anything that somebody is offended by to be a crime, will prove disastrous to the web.

Okay, so plead not guilty.

At your jury trial, plead the first.

 

[JHoersten2]

Okay, so plead not guilty.

At your jury trial, plead the first.

Ugh. I regret even posting something here. Seems you people are so jaded from babbling on this site so long that you've lost all sense of compassion and helpfulness.

God save your souls.

 

[seniorjudge]

Ugh. I regret even posting something here. Seems you people are so jaded from babbling on this site so long that you've lost all sense of compassion and helpfulness.

God save your souls.

I gave you accurate and correct legal advice...for FREE!

So why are you complaining!?

 

[Some Random Guy]

If you want to prepare for court, try using google for relevant topics on the first amendment

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q="falsely+shouting+fire+in+a+theater+and+causing+a+panic"

 

[CdwJava]

Given events similar to this in the past few years, the police would have been remiss had they NOT investigated the matter. Freedom of speech is not absolute, and people DO try to "sell" children. Your "ad" was worthy of investigation.

That being said, it is likely that the "disorderly conduct" citation will not stand up at court. However, there may be recent case law decisions that permit such an ordinance to cover these kinds of events. I would recommend you consult an attorney. And, refrain from such ire provoking ads in the future.

Note: It is likely that the Admins of Craigslist contacted the appropriate authorities. That's not the kind of thing you joke about.

EDIT: What city was this citation issued in? Kenosha County has an ordinance 11.02, but it has nothing to do with this.

- Carl

 

[CdwJava]

How is a privately owned internet site, not based out of this state, being governed by local law enforcement? And even so, my speech? I didn't FORCE anyone to read what I posted... they had to click on it first.

The same argument can be made about kiddie porn, etc. However, the possibility that your ad was real was sufficient to justify an investigation ... they might have been able to get a search warrant based on the ad as well.

Any ideas how I could fight this measly ticket and prove victorious?

Challenge the elements of the offense.

Would those three people who complained have to show up in court with me to act as witnesses? ...is the internet within county law jurisdiction?

If the police saw the same ad, then no the three people wouldn't have to show.

Yes, when the internet advises of potential crimes within their jurisdiction, it is within their ability to pursue these crimes.

- Carl

 

[JHoersten2]

EDIT: What city was this citation issued in? Kenosha County has an ordinance 11.02, but it has nothing to do with this.

- Carl

Kenosha. Ordinance 11.02M Disorderly conduct - Disturbing the peace.

That's what was issued against me.


EDIT: "If the police saw the same ad, then no the three people wouldn't have to show."

was printed and faxed to them.

 

[CdwJava]

Kenosha. Ordinance 11.02M Disorderly conduct - Disturbing the peace.

That's what was issued against me.

In my opinion they are going to have a hard time articulating that your ad breached that ordinance. But, there might be case law applicable to WI broadening these definitions.

"If the police saw the same ad, then no the three people wouldn't have to show."

was printed and faxed to them.

And it's likely they logged in and looked as well. It's sufficient to investigate. Though, as I said, I don't think that even WITH those other witnesses they could make much of a case on that charge.

Another thing to consider is the possibility that there MIGHT be an applicable charge under state law they can come back with. It might be worthwhile to save some pennies for a consultation with an attorney. It's better safe than sorry.

- Carl

 

[garrula lingua]

OP, the fact that the police cited you, doesn't mean the Prosecutor will charge you.

Most Prosecutors would cringe at trying that case. (unless you go to Duke University)

Go to your first court appearance and get as much info as possible - ask for discovery (a copy of the police report & the charging document); see if you can find out what, if anything, the Prosecutor is offering to dispo the case (maybe an infraction). Then, ask for a continuance to confer with an attorney.

Don't make any statement regarding guilt or the facts of the case.

You may find out, when you go to court, that the Prosecutor declined to charge.

 

[panther10758]

I look at this and am appalled. First off why would play a sick joke like this? Ok lets forget how dumb this was for a moment. Selling babies is againist the law and who told Police is not the issue if they saw article and can tie it to you your guilty! Disorderly conduct is a blessing in my view. This (in my view) is similar to the person who phones in a false bomb threat! Your actual intent is unknown only you know! Now you may very well have no intent to sell babies but you placed an ad for one! I would follow last advice you got and get this continued until you can speak to a Lawyer

 

[CdwJava]

While I agree that the ad was in bad taste and reprehensible, I cannot think of any law that might cover this sort of thing. Had the OP actually engaged in activity to actually indicate he was trying to move forward with the sale of an infant, I can see that some crime might have occurred. However, simply posting a sick ad likely gives little more than cause to investigate.

My guess is that the cops came over to investigate, played hardball, and decided that they needed to charge SOMETHING, so someone decided that a local disorderly conduct ordinance was appropriate. Personally, I would have sought for some kind of electronic communication offense, at least then you would have a charge where the elements involve the correct medium!

- Carl