Lie to a vendor for my employer?

[ashton]

I work for a publicly traded company in New Jersey. Management at a high (but not the highest) level wants us to pay an important vendor for 3 service contracts when we have 200 (identical) devices. We would save hundreds of thousands of dollars per year, but myself and my coworkers would be required to give one of the three phony serial numbers to the vendor every time we call for one of the 200 devices. If the vendor is alert, the deception would quickly be discovered. Also, we sometimes must give the vendor data when making a support call - we are expected to clumsily alter the data to make the deception less obvious.

There is certainly a contract with the vendor, although I have not seen it.

I am concerned that myself and my co-workers would be committing a crime that we could be prosecuted for. I am further concerned that altering data before providing it to the vendor is a significant aggravating factor in any such crime.

As it stands, I expect to threaten my management that I will ask the company's lawyers for advice on this topic.

Is this behavior as shocking as it seems to me? Or should I just shut up and do what I'm told?What is the name of your state?

 

[AlanShore]

Sounds like your company has issues with Microsoft.....just a guess.

You should contact a higher level of management then those who ordered you and the companys lawyer. You do not have to threaten them. They can not fire you for refusing to commit a crime. I would however to CYA doing keep careful records of everything you have done and continue to do. And I would not engage in this activity any further.

 

[Zigner]

And also understand that there may be a special contract arranged for service based on the large # of these items that you have. The logistics of said special arrangement may require that you give them one of the 3 serial numbers.
So, before you go over your bosses' head, you may want to discuss it with your boss.

 

[ashton]

alanshore - If I contact a level of management above the (rather high) one that has approved this policy, or if I contact the lawyers, it will result in the instant loss of my job. I'm not sure where you got the idea that a person can not be fired for refusing to do something illegal - it happens all the time. But, I am willing to lose my job rather than commit a crime for them. A real crime, that I could actually be prosecuted for, not something that is "technically" a crime. If I am going to lose my job over this, I would like to be sure that it really is a crime, and hopefully the management who ordered it can also lose their jobs in time.

zigner - trust me, I am sure. This is not a mere suspicion. I have been asked to engage in specific overt acts to perpetuate this deception. (altering records before giving them to the vendor).

 

[Zigner]

If you feel so strongly that this is morally wrong, then you should consider finding a new job. As can be said in many areas, just because it's not illegal doesn't make it "right".

 

[ashton]

There are things out there that are a lot more immoral than one big corporation ripping off another. Like children going to public school and growing up without health insurance because Dad quit his job to go work somewhere that was kinder to his feelings.

I'm not really concerned with one corporation treating another morally - they certainly don't treat individuals morally. I am really only concerned with the welfare of myself and my family. That is why my question is not "is this morally wrong", it's "could I be prosecuted for this".

If a careful evaluation of the relationship between the two companies reveals that the greater moral good is for us to rip them off by not paying, rather than for them to rip us off by making us pay, what then? Luckily, I don't care.

 

[Zigner]

Then I misunderstood you. For you, it's OK to screw somebody else, as long as it won't affect you.

 

[longneck]

can someone please explain why this is illegal? i can't think of a single reason why it would be.

as far as i can tell, this would strictly be a civil matter between the company and the service agency.

 

[ashton]

There seem to be a lot of laws that this might run afoul of. For example, NJSA 2C:20-4, "Theft By Deception". The jury would get these instructions:

http://www.judiciary.state.nj.us/charges/jury/theft005.htm

And then it's very close to forgery, NJSA 2C:21-1A:
http://www.judiciary.state.nj.us/charges/jury/forgery1.htm

Although it might sqeak by if computer-generated logs are not "writings of another" and if the copy sent to the vendor is not purporting to be a "copy of an original".

Seems a really narrow margin for safety. Is there some reason these laws wouldn't apply at all?

 

[Kane]

Ashton,

I wish I could give you a good answer. Unfortunately, the chances of getting somebody on this board who's knowledgable about both the law and the practice of NC white-collar criminal law is pretty slim. I'm sure there are any number of NC laws that might apply to your situation.

I can also tell you you could go into any courtroom in the state, and you'd see row after row of people charged with drug crimes/prostitution/shoplifting/DWI... and probably not see one guy charged with "altering vendor's records"... or any white collar crime at all for that matter. Whether that's because corporations are full of law-abiding citizens or for some other reason I couldn't tell you.

If you feel you can't go to "legal," consider at least talking to a criminal defense attorney of your own. Make sure he's knowledgeable about white collar/corporate crime. You may have to talk to several before you find one.

Also, remember if you do wind up talking to legal, the company's lawyer's represent the corporation, not you.