CC&R's

What is the name of your state? California

I recently moved into a community with CC&R's. At the time I moved in they did not have a rule on Skateboarding. We received a notice that my son was being a nuisance by skateboarding. I called and told the HOA that only one person had a problem. We received a second letter saying that we violated the nuisance rule from the same person who happens to be the husband of a board member. I again protested. A little later we received notice that skateboarding was not allowed within the complex. I told my son not to skateboard in the complex. This was 8 months ago. A few days ago some of my son's friends were skateboarding in front of my house and the same gentleman complained. My son was not skateboarding because he was grounded from it. I received a letter stating that I broke the skateboarding rule for the third time. The gentleman does not know where the other boys live so he blames my 12 year old son.

My Questions:

Can they say that is my third offence even though the last two were for a different rule?
Can they blame me if my son was not skateboarding?
Can I make then or do they have to prove their allegation before they fine me?
Can I sue them in small claims court to recover a fine that I pay if it is unjust?

[HomeGuru]

[quote]Originally posted by rpeoples
[b]What is the name of your state? California

I recently moved into a community with CC&R's. At the time I moved in they did not have a rule on Skateboarding. We received a notice that my son was being a nuisance by skateboarding. I called and told the HOA that only one person had a problem. We received a second letter saying that we violated the nuisance rule from the same person who happens to be the husband of a board member. I again protested. A little later we received notice that skateboarding was not allowed within the complex. I told my son not to skateboard in the complex. This was 8 months ago. A few days ago some of my son's friends were skateboarding in front of my house and the same gentleman complained. My son was not skateboarding because he was grounded from it. I received a letter stating that I broke the skateboarding rule for the third time. The gentleman does not know where the other boys live so he blames my 12 year old son.

My Questions:

Can they say that is my third offence even though the last two were for a different rule?

**A: yes.
*****************
Can they blame me if my son was not skateboarding?

**A: yes.
****************
Can I make then or do they have to prove their allegation before they fine me?

**A: yes.
****************
Can I sue them in small claims court to recover a fine that I pay if it is unjust?

**A: no, you should refuse to pay or litigate. I would first caution you to read the House Rules and other HOA docs before taking any action.

I need to clarify some of my questions.

They can say that this was my third offense for two diffetent rules, but can they fine me for the offense as a third violation even though the other two violations were from a different rule?

Also, the gentleman that is making the false complaints drives around in his car and then chases the kids if he sees them playing. To me this is stalking. When he cannot catch the other boys, my sons friends, he blames my son. He is the husband of a board member. Would I open myself up to legal action if I posted a note on the mailboxes stating what he is doing so that all of the other homeowners are aware?

[HomeGuru]

This is your initial thread.

I live in a community in California with CC&R's.

I was warned three times over 8 monthsabout my sone skateboarding under two different rules. The first two times they called a nuisance, they then passed a no skateboarding rule. 8Eight months later they then gave me a warning about his skateboarding under the new skateboarding rule alling it the third offense. I know that they can say it is a third offense for two diffetent rules, but can they fine me for the offense as a third violation even though the other two violations were from a different rule?

Also, the gentleman that is making the complaints drives around in his car and then chases the kids if he sees them playing. To me this is stalking. When he cannot catch the other boys, my sons friends, he blames my son. He is the husband of a board member. Would I open myself up to legal action if I posted a note on the mailboxes stating what he is doing so that all of the other homeowners are aware?

Is this better, does anyone have an answer for me?

[HomeGuru]

[quote]Originally posted by rpeoples
[b]What is the name of your state? California

I recently moved into a community with CC&R's. At the time I moved in they did not have a rule on Skateboarding. We received a notice that my son was being a nuisance by skateboarding. I called and told the HOA that only one person had a problem. We received a second letter saying that we violated the nuisance rule from the same person who happens to be the husband of a board member. I again protested.

**A: I presume that you are an owner of a home in that community, if not please so advise.
So you received 2 written notices and each time protested rather than tell your son to have him and his friends stop skateboarding. I am sure that you are telling only your side of the story.
***********


A little later we received notice that skateboarding was not allowed within the complex. I told my son not to skateboard in the complex.

**A: ok, so did you advise your son to tell his friends not to skateboard in the complex?
************
This was 8 months ago. A few days ago some of my son's friends were skateboarding in front of my house and the same gentleman complained. My son was not skateboarding because he was grounded from it.

**A: are these friends of your sons invited guests from outside the complex that come specifically to visit your son or neighbor friends that live in the same complex?
*************


I received a letter stating that I broke the skateboarding rule for the third time. The gentleman does not know where the other boys live so he blames my 12 year old son.

**A: that unfair unless of course those friends are invited guests of your son from outside the complex.

I presume that you are an owner of a home in that community, if not please so advise.
So you received 2 written notices and each time protested rather than tell your son to have him and his friends stop skateboarding. I am sure that you are telling only your side of the story.

**A: The reason I protested the first two times was because I was told my son was being a niusance. All of my other neighbors disagreed and said at a meeting that they did not have a problem with him and his friends skateboarding.
***********


A little later we received notice that skateboarding was not allowed within the complex. I told my son not to skateboard in the complex.

**A: ok, so did you advise your son to tell his friends not to skateboard in the complex?
**A:Yes, I did and he does not ride his skateboard within the complex.
************
This was 8 months ago. A few days ago some of my son's friends were skateboarding in front of my house and the same gentleman complained. My son was not skateboarding because he was grounded from it.

**A: are these friends of your sons invited guests from outside the complex that come specifically to visit your son or neighbor friends that live in the same complex?

**A:The friends all live within the same complex. None of them have ever received a letter warning them about their skateboarding.
*************


I received a letter stating that I broke the skateboarding rule for the third time. The gentleman does not know where the other boys live so he blames my 12 year old son.

**A: that unfair unless of course those friends are invited guests of your son from outside the complex.

**A:I am only telling my side, obviously. However I have tried to keep an open mind to the rules. This gentleman gets in his car and chases the children. He has also been overheard talking to another homeowner that he wants to trap and detain the children when he sees them. This guy used to live by me in another area and disliked all of the children there as well. My son was not with me then.


**Q: Would I open myself up to legal action if I posted a note on the mailboxes stating what he is doing so that all of the other homeowners are aware?

[HomeGuru]

Originally posted by rpeoples
I live in a community in California with CC&R's.

I was warned three times over 8 monthsabout my sone skateboarding under two different rules. The first two times they called a nuisance, they then passed a no skateboarding rule. 8Eight months later they then gave me a warning about his skateboarding under the new skateboarding rule alling it the third offense. I know that they can say it is a third offense for two diffetent rules, but can they fine me for the offense as a third violation even though the other two violations were from a different rule?

**A: please post the exact language from the new approved rule that makes you liable for the fine.
************

Also, the gentleman that is making the complaints drives around in his car and then chases the kids if he sees them playing. To me this is stalking.

**A: no it is not stalking. Contact the police for further info on this subject.
*********

When he cannot catch the other boys, my sons friends, he blames my son.

**A: that makes sense and is logical.
*********
He is the husband of a board member.

**A so what. This information has no bearing on the fact that your son was warned about not skateboarding and continued with the same action.
********
Would I open myself up to legal action if I posted a note on the mailboxes stating what he is doing so that all of the other homeowners are aware?

**A: yes, if under USPS gudelines, the mailbox is for USPS use only.
You are free to send a written rebuttal to the Board and also give your opinion on the actions of the gentleman via: print your own newsletter and mail to all the owners, show up at a HOA meeting and voice your concern, post a giant billboard in the town, put up a website, send a letter to the editor, be on the news, call in on a radio talk show**************
If what you state is the truth, you are protected by the free speech ammendment.

Is this better, does anyone have an answer for me?

When he cannot catch the other boys, my sons friends, he blames my son.

**A: that makes sense and is logical

** Q:I agree that it is logical, but can they fine me for it?
*********
**A: yes, if under USPS gudelines, the mailbox is for USPS use only.

Q: So if I post them around the complex on Lightposts then I am okay?
*********
**A: please post the exact language from the new approved rule that makes you liable for the fine.

**A: I do not have the exact words with me, however they say something to the effect that " No scotters, skateboards, rollerblades, or skates will be allowed to be used on any common area within the Cornerstone Complex. Bicycles can only be ridden in a manner that obeys all traffic laws within the cornerstone complex." If it is much different than that I will post it later. There are dozens of kids that ride bikes, rollerblade and ride scotters within the complex and never get warned. I have talked to most of their parents.

[HomeGuru]

[quote]Originally posted by rpeoples
[b]When he cannot catch the other boys, my sons friends, he blames my son.

**A: that makes sense and is logical

** Q:I agree that it is logical, but can they fine me for it?
*********
**A: yes, if under USPS gudelines, the mailbox is for USPS use only.

Q: So if I post them around the complex on Lightposts then I am okay?
*********
**A: please post the exact language from the new approved rule that makes you liable for the fine.

**A: I do not have the exact words with me, however they say something to the effect that " No scotters, skateboards, rollerblades, or skates will be allowed to be used on any common area within the Cornerstone Complex. Bicycles can only be ridden in a manner that obeys all traffic laws within the cornerstone complex." If it is much different than that I will post it later. There are dozens of kids that ride bikes, rollerblade and ride scotters within the complex and never get warned. I have talked to most of their parents.

**A: so where is the language with respect to the fine for the third violation that was the gist of your thread? That was your main question so let's deal with that.
For posting a flyer on a light post, read your House Rules.
The dozens of kids that never got warned is not relevant to your assessment of the fine.
Yor son probably pissed the guy off by saying something to the guy, giving him the one finger salute, exhibiting a normal teenager bad attitude, wearing a Life Sucks or Ozzy t-shirt, having orange or purple hair, wearing piercings etc.
You never know. Maybe the gentleman has a complex because as a kid he asked Santa for a skateboard and all he got was a hula hoop. Now he takes revenge on your son.

**A: so where is the language with respect to the fine for the third violation that was the gist of your thread? That was your main question so let's deal with that.
For posting a flyer on a light post, read your House Rules.
The dozens of kids that never got warned is not relevant to your assessment of the fine.
Yor son probably pissed the guy off by saying something to the guy, giving him the one finger salute, exhibiting a normal teenager bad attitude, wearing a Life Sucks or Ozzy t-shirt, having orange or purple hair, wearing piercings etc.
You never know. Maybe the gentleman has a complex because as a kid he asked Santa for a skateboard and all he got was a hula hoop. Now he takes revenge on your son.

**A: I will get the wording and post it tomorrow morning or later tonight. As for the latter part of your answer, I believe that he is just a grumpy old man that never had any fun as a child. As most parents will say, my son is clean cut,(No orange hair or anything like that), well behaved and would never give someone the finger

[HomeGuru]

Ok and don't forget to answer my "friend" question.

**A: are these friends of your sons invited guests from outside the complex that come specifically to visit your son or neighbor friends that live in the same complex?

**A:The friends all live within the same complex. None of them have ever received a letter warning them about their skateboarding.

If this is your friend question, I had answered it eariler. Here it is again. Is that the one you were asking about?

[HomeGuru]

That's it.
Ok, go in peace.

Here is the wording of the enforcement rules:

2.1 All residents will be entitled to two(2) written warnings for a particular violation within (1) year prior to action being taken against them. After the second association warning, the mattwill be turned over to the association's legal counsel for a final warning.

2.2 Residents shall have no more than three (3) written warnings for each separate violation within one year. If the violation continues after receipt of the attorney's request for compliance, the owner in violation will be called before a hearing panel.