(NYC) Bus Lane 7pm, ticketed by red light camera 6:59:10pm...cell phone said 7:02pm

[dddbbb]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? NY

I've been very wary of getting tickets from RL cameras lately because I have been ticketed by them in the past for not moving my car until 7:02am when it should've been out by 7am. So, I am 99% sure that I would have waited for it to have been past 7pm before attempting to park. The ticket is for $115...is there any wiggle room to dispute the time?

 

[sandyclaus]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? NY

I've been very wary of getting tickets from RL cameras lately because I have been ticketed by them in the past for not moving my car until 7:02am when it should've been out by 7am. So, I am 99% sure that I would have waited for it to have been past 7pm before attempting to park. The ticket is for $115...is there any wiggle room to dispute the time?

The question here is where did you get the time when the violation allegedly occurred? Was it printed on the ticket or photo?

If the stated time of the violation was clearly printed on the ticket or photo, one might be able to argue that the ticket was issued prematurely and ask that it be dismissed.

If, however, the time was based upon your own estimation of the actual time, then the ticketing authority could simply argue that YOUR clock was out of sync.

 

[HighwayMan]

I've been very wary of getting tickets from RL cameras lately because I have been ticketed by them in the past for not moving my car until 7:02am when it should've been out by 7am. So, I am 99% sure that I would have waited for it to have been past 7pm before attempting to park. The ticket is for $115...is there any wiggle room to dispute the time?

How did your cell phone show the time when you probably weren't even aware your picture was taken? Please explain that.

You were not caught by a "red light camera".

Follow the instructions for adjudication printed on the Notice of Liability. If it is determined that the time is wrong you'll have the NoL dismissed.

 

[dddbbb]

Ty for replies.

To clarify, Just received the ticket in the mail today. The date of incident was 7/30. The time 6:59:10 is printed on the photo. They say there is a video online, i have yet to look at that. The violation is sprcifically for entering a bus lane before 7pm without the intent to turn right

trying to go through old emails to see what exactly my schedule was for that day. Usually what I do is stand around the corner in front of a hydrant (parking in the area isn't easy, its the only legal spot I can wait around and camp)until my cell says 7:02 then drive around and get my spot.

Is there a way to show that my cell phone - where the time is derived from cell towers or verizons network? - has a non synced time with the light's time?

I really wish the ****ing curb would turn green in NY when parking is allowed...

 

[dddbbb]

Or at this point am I basically saying "50 seconds? cmonnnn" with my palms up and begging...

 

[HighwayMan]

Is there a way to show that my cell phone - where the time is derived from cell towers or verizons network? - has a non synced time with the light's time?

Forget the cell phone angle. I doubt that will get you anywhere. If the system used by the cameras is found to be out of sync you'll probably have the NoL dismissed. Otherwise you really have no chance. Adjudicate the NoL and find out - that's all you can do.

You'd be better off listening to 1010 WINS or WCBS for a time check rather than depending on your phone.

I have AT&T and my friend has Verizon - yesterday both of our phones showed times two full minutes apart - which was accurate? Who knows but obviously a cell phone should not to be considered very accurate when seconds count.

 

[You Are Guilty]

Let me preface this by making it 100% clear that THIS CODE DOES NOT APPLY TO BUS LANE VIOLATIONS, but, if the "cell phone time was right" argument fails, you may want to just throw it out there to see if it sticks. The thinking goes that if the City saw fit to give a 5-minute grace period for parking because of the differences in time between peoples phones, watches and the meter maid's time, then why shouldn't there be a similar window for bus lane turns? (Again, this does NOT currently apply to bus lane violations so you are, in effect, arguing for an expansion of the law, which rarely works. But it's better than nothing).

Grace period.
a. For the purposes of this section, the term "munimeter receipt" shall mean the receipt showing the amount of parking time purchased that is dispensed by an electronic parking meter and must be displayed in a conspicuous place on a vehicle's dashboard.

b. No notice of violation shall be issued for allegedly parking in excess of the allotted time displayed on a munimeter receipt or longer than the time period allowed by a sign posted by the department until five minutes after the time that such a violation occurs.

 

[HighwayMan]

(Again, this does NOT currently apply to bus lane violations so you are, in effect, arguing for an expansion of the law, which rarely works. But it's better than nothing).

I agree - I doubt it will work but it is worth a try.

I would like to know what the OP was actually cited for - Traffic Rules 4-12(m) or something else?

 

[You Are Guilty]

I agree - I doubt it will work but it is worth a try.

As they say in law school, when the law is against you argue the facts; when the facts are against you argue the law; and when the law and the facts are against you, just argue. Particularly appropriate for traffic tickets

I would like to know what the OP was actually cited for - Traffic Rules 4-12(m) or something else?

4-05(a) maybe?

Either way OP, its time to verify the signage actually present at the intersection (photos) and whether that was the appropriate sign(s) for that location (NYC DOT request. Maybe through STATUS?) Who knows, you might get lucky and find out it was an outdated sign that was supposed to have been removed.

 

[HighwayMan]

4-05(a) maybe?

Doubtful, it seems to be a bus lane violation. On most streets use of that lane is permitted only to make right turns. Actually I think it's all streets except for Madison Avenue between 42 and 59 streets. I don't know if there is some special violation for the bus lane camera offenses.

Either way OP, its time to verify the signage actually present at the intersection (photos) and whether that was the appropriate sign(s) for that location (NYC DOT request. Maybe through STATUS?) Who knows, you might get lucky and find out it was an outdated sign that was supposed to have been removed.

Again, doubtful. I've done alot of bus lane enforcement in alot of locations and signage is on the ball. If there are errors I've never seen one. For the benefit of the OP the signage does not have to be at the intersection - many signs are mid block or just beyond the intersection depending on the direction of the cross streets or avenues. He should check the signage but I can't see it helping.

 

[dddbbb]

Argued for difference in clocks among other things.


Violation Decisions: REGLTN NOT IN EFF/NON-CODE NOT GLTY

"period and NOL indicates it was a few seconds prior to expiration. Due to possible difference in watches the NOL is dismissed."

Hoorah

 

[HighwayMan]

Bravo.



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