NYC: Double-parking during street cleaning time

[NYorker]

What is the name of your state? NY

I got a $115 ticket for double parking during street cleaning time. It is customary in Brooklyn, NY to double park your car for 1,5 hours during street cleaning time. I've been double-parking twice a week every week for about 10 monthes on the same street near my office. (and for 5 years on other streets in Brooklyn) Never got a ticket - but last week.

I know that law does not provide for any break for double parking just because it's cleaning time. But actually I never heard of a person ticketed for that.

Is there a defense? Does judge have a soft spot for double-parking during street cleaning time?

I' going to fight this ticket anyway. I took pictures of the same street this week with 17 (seventeen) cars doubleparked bumper-to-bumper during cleaning time on the same block. Two local residents were so kind and gave me written statements as to "I live on this block for 7 years, always double-park during cleaning time, I know 10 other neighbors that double-park, nobody ever got a ticket."

What are my chances?What is the name of your state?

 

[Zigner]

What in the world makes you think that "other people do it" is a valid defense?
Don't even bother fighting it - you'll save yourself some embarassment!

 

[NYorker]

What in the world makes you think that "other people do it" is a valid defense?
Don't even bother fighting it - you'll save yourself some embarassment!

Well, thanks for input.

I was just wondering if judges use common sense. You think they don't?

To make it clear, "other people do it" means at least 50,000 cars every day are double parked for 1,5 hours during cleaning time in Brooklyn.

There are no emotions here - I am really willing to invest some time and money to fight the existing situation. And existing situation in Brooklyn, NY is: if an agent feels like ticketing a double-parked car during cleaning time - he will ticket; if he feels like not ticketing - he will not. I beleive this is unjust. There should be a law, not just discretion of an agent. Am I wrong?

If it were one-time thing I would pay and forget it as I usually do. I would even put it like that: if it was not the street where my office is and where I doublepark twice every week (there is no other option) - I would pay and forget it. But if a particular agent is about to start ticketing all cars on THAT street twice a week....

 

[ceara19]

Well, thanks for input.

I was just wondering if judges use common sense. You think they don't?

To make it clear, "other people do it" means at least 50,000 cars every day are double parked for 1,5 hours during cleaning time in Brooklyn.

There are no emotions here - I am really willing to invest some time and money to fight the existing situation. And existing situation in Brooklyn, NY is: if an agent feels like ticketing a double-parked car during cleaning time - he will ticket; if he feels like not ticketing - he will not. I beleive this is unjust. There should be a law, not just discretion of an agent. Am I wrong?

If it were one-time thing I would pay and forget it as I usually do. But if a particular agent is about to start ticketing all cars on that street twice a week....

Can you prove that you were singled out? Do you know for a fact that the agent DIDN'T ticket everyone else that was doubled parked in the area at that particular time?

 

[NYorker]

Can you prove that you were singled out? Do you know for a fact that the agent DIDN'T ticket everyone else that was doubled parked in the area at that particular time?

No, I don't know for a fact that other cars ON THAT DAY were not ticketed. I didn't check on that. Now I understand, I should have. I could have teamed up with other drivers....

Frankly, I have no reasons to believe that ONLY MY CAR was ticketed on that day on that street. I think, all others were, too.

My point is that car(s) on that particular street on that particular day were singled out for no reason.

 

[ceara19]

No, I don't know for a fact that other cars ON THAT DAY were not ticketed. I didn't check on that. Now I understand, I should have. I could have teamed up with other drivers....

Frankly, I have no reasons to believe that ONLY MY CAR was ticketed on that day on that street. I think, all others were, too.

My point is that car(s) on that particular street on that particular day were singled out for no reason.

You weren't singled out. The agent happened to be in your area on that particular day.

 

[NYorker]

Well, "singled out" may not be the right word.

Yes, the agent "happened" to be in the area on that day! What if from now on he happens to come to that street twice a week during cleaning hours? I really don't think I should let it go....

 

[ceara19]

Well, "singled out" may not be the right word.

Yes, the agent "happened" to be in the area on that day! What if from now on he happens to come twice a week? I really don't think I should let it go....

If he happens to start coming by twice a week during street sweeping hours and you continue to double park, you will start getting 2 tickets a week. You said it yourself in your first post.

I know that law does not provide for any break for double parking just because it's cleaning time.

Until such time as this law changes, it will be illegal to double park on the street at any hour of the day for any reason.

Just because everyone has been doing this forever without getting caught does not mean that it is suddenly legal. If I go out and rob a bank, I have committed a crime. I may be lucky enough to rob 20 banks without being caught. However, if I get caught during robbery #21, I can't tell the Judge "Well, I robbed 20 banks BEFORE this one and never got caught, so I can't be punished for THIS one either".

 

[PrinceCharming]

Listen up everyone. If you are not from New York City, don't bother commenting.

Here in NYC it is indeed the customary practice to double park on one way streets that are non-school blocks during street cleaning. Even if there is no law in the law books, this is the accepted practice of the law enforcements. As a matter of fact, I was double parked that day and a poilce officer drove right by my car without given me a ticket. This should be a valid defense. Fight this defense over the internet.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dof/html/contact/contact_app_hearbyweb.shtml

In your defense make sure that your ticketed address and date DO MATCH the time for street cleaning. If the ticket is given even a minute later, you will have to pay the fine.

If you dispute the ticket, you will have a reduced offer of about $90. You can choose not to pay the reduced offer, but if the judge finds you guilty, you will not have the chance for a reduced offer anymore.

 

[Zigner]

Listen up everyone. If you are not from New York City, don't bother commenting.

Prince -

You do NOT dictate who gets to reply in this forum. The simple fact is that (per the OP's words), OP broke the law. OP then received a ticket for it. I don't care if 1/2 of ALL the cars in New York City double park - if it's illegal, then ALL of those cars, or any portion thereof can receive a ticket.

 

[PrinceCharming]

Prince -

You do NOT dictate who gets to reply in this forum. The simple fact is that (per the OP's words), OP broke the law. OP then received a ticket for it. I don't care if 1/2 of ALL the cars in New York City double park - if it's illegal, then ALL of those cars, or any portion thereof can receive a ticket.

You obviously don't live in NYC. OP did NOT break the law according to his/her story.

 

[NYorker]

. 1) As a matter of fact, I was double parked that day and a poilce officer drove right by my car without given me a ticket. This should be a valid defense.

2) In your defense make sure that your ticketed address and date DO MATCH the time for street cleaning. If the ticket is given even a minute later, you will have to pay the fine.

.

1)What do you mean "that day"? The day I was ticketed?
Do you think statements that I collected from residents and pictures of the same block (taken the next Friday after ticketing) with double-parked cars all over it are useless? (if I contest the ticket on the Internet, I will not be able to enclose pictures and statements signed by local residents, right?)

I also have a picture of an agent near my double-parked car (again, taken next week after ticketing). The car was not ticketed. I asked that agent "are you going to ticket this car?" She said "why would I? It's cleaning time!" I told her I got a ticket on the same spot at the same time last week. She said "you see, technically I can ticket the whole block right now. I just don't wanna". Should I tell the judge about that?


2)Yes, ticketed address matches actual address. Time of the offence is right in the middle of sweeping 1,5 hours.

We have loud buzzer in the office set for 10 minutes before the beginning and the end of cleaning time twice a week. All clerks (including me) drop everything they were doing (including million dollar clients) and rush to move their cars to or from double-park position

 

[You Are Guilty]

You obviously don't live in NYC. OP did NOT break the law according to his/her story.

Well, actually he did.

Double Parking: In many neighborhoods in New York City, people double park their cars for the duration of street cleaning, on the side of the street that is not being cleaned that day. This practice has always been technically illegal ("Double parking of passenger vehicles is illegal at all times, including street cleaning days, regardless of location, purpose or duration"--DOT). In some neighborhoods, on many streets, however, double parking for the duration of street cleaning is openly tolerated by the authorities. Since this practice is not permitted everywhere, it's best to check with the locals of the neighborhood before you try this yourself, because tickets are too easy to get if you make a mistake. Also, if you double park your car for an extended period of time, it's very important that you leave some contact information displayed in your car, such as a piece or paper with your telephone number on the dashboard. This way any cars that you have blocked in can call you so you can let them out. Leaving your telephone number is a little thing you can do that makes the city a more livable place.

(Not a statute, but a nice overall view on the situation).

Even according to "Gridlock Sam" (locals know who he is), the PVB ALJ's rarely, if ever, dismiss the double parking tickets, even in neighborhoods where it's "permissible", if they are filled out correctly. That's abut the only hope - if the ticket is one of the old handwritten ones, there's a good chance there is an error on it somewhere. (Computerized ones may be incorrect too, but it's much less likely).

Search my old posts for "fatal flaws" to see what info needs to be correct, and for more information about a "settlement", which is probably your best option.

 

[PrinceCharming]

It looks like You Are Guilty is making a valid point.

If you happened to be unloading or picking up a young passenger to your place of business
(how unlikely) you would have a sure win.

A settlement would get your fine reduced to $90.

 

[Zigner]

It looks like You Are Guilty is making a valid point.

Yep sure does