Unregistered Vehicle/Abandonment of Vehicle

[platinum90]

What is the name of your state? NJ

Sent in my registration on a Monday. Check hit bank MVC deposited it to on Friday of the same week. My car was towed by NJ transit on the next day Saturday based on being "unregistered" NJ transit is claiming the system the have access to is "real time" Perhaps, the info they have available to them from MVC is not updated daily or perhaps the transit cop who called to check on my vehicle's status inadvertently provided the wrong license plate, but perhaps not because the following Monday I had to complete another registration at MVC in order to retrieve my car since they still claimed to have no record for the previous registration even though they happily cashed my check.

Shouldn't the date-stamped checked be sufficient to prove (on my court appearance for "vehicle abandonment") that my vehicle was not abandoned and also that the car was, in fact, registered. I have also saved our round-trip train tickets (and receipts from our day's purchases) to prove that we had every intention of returning to our car. What is the best course of action to recoup the towing costs-where does the responsibility lie- MVC for accepting payment for a "service" they failed to provide or NJ transit for towing so quickly without taking proper steps to determine that my car was, in fact, registered.

 

[platinum90]

moburkes,

here are the answers to your questions from a different thread.

the registration I don't think will be enough proof of registration because the registration card never arrived. I sent the registration via mail. The only proof I have to demonstrate that my car was registered on (in fact prior to) the day it was towed is the check I used to pay the registration fee. On Monday, the MVC still didn't show anything in their system indicating my car was registered and I absolutely needed to get my car out of impoundment that day (the fees escalate daily). I couldn't show the MVC my check because the check image was not yet available from my bank on my online account. I had to pay for a second registration in person in order to retrieve my car. NJ doesn't have a sticker system on the windshield to demonstrate whether or not the car was registered. NJ transit simply phones into some allegedly "real-time" system in order to determine whether cars parked on their property are registered. The system is either not actually real time. I still have no explanation about why MVC cashed my check but didn't enter any information regarding my registration into their computer.

The mess is-

towing company obviously won't refund towing costs because they were authorized by NJ transit to tow my car

NJ transit blames MVC saying we only tow based on information they provide

MVC is a government agency so being efficient and prompt is not a high priority. they simply don't care and have no explanation for why the check was cashed, with some effort, I could get my second registration fee back, but they don't want to be responsible for towing costs, etc.
I am required to make a court appearance for abandoning my vehicle which I didn't do because I purchased round trip train tickets for the day. I still might have to pay minimal fines due to "inconveniencing" the court, and I still have to pay the court cost of appearing. on top of the towing/impoundment nonsense i already paid just to get my car back.

 

[moburkes]

You mailed it on a Monday, and the registration expired on a Tuesday?

 

[platinum90]

the registration had expired three months prior. I was relying on public transit (the bus stop is blocks from my house) to get to work to reduce my commuting costs. since i needed to begin using the car again during my workday (public transit was no longer a good option) I sent the registration in. i should have probably filed online to have the registration be processed immediately, but i'm not sure that would be any guarantee because it's still possible the MVC would have had to do some manual work to complete the registration. i used my car that day to get to the train station since I had submitted the registration earlier in the week (but not yet having access to the cleared check i sent) so that i wouldn't have to leave my newer registered vehicle (purchased the month my registration expired on the towed vehicle) unattended in a parking lot in a sketchy part of town. in any case, i don't think MVC acted in good faith by cashing my check but not processing my registration in their system. in the rest of the world, services are usually provided upon receipt of payment, but government seems to be exempt from that logic.

if i had been stopped by a cop while driving the car, i wouldn't have had the registration card either because it didn't yet arrive in the mail, and i suppose when they would have called in my registration, the same result would show up-not registered. but i would have been allowed to drive the car home and had to pay a fine for not being registered (even though assuming a cashed check is proof of payment-the cop wouldn't have access to that info) the car would not have been impounded. in this case it was because it was parked, so they're assuming it was abandoned. but it's doubtful i would have been pulled over in NJ for not being registered because there is no sticker system, so the cop would not visibly see an expired sticker on my car.

 

[moburkes]

the registration had expired three months prior
That's your problem right there. You were not legally allowed to drive without the sticker. You drove, expecting not to get caught, but you did. If you look up the exact violation that you received, I'm sure it will state that you are driving illegally unless the sticker is displayed on the vehicle.

 

[platinum90]

the location i mailed the registration to is about an hour away. i think by now i should have received the first registration card, but it never came. perhaps, completing a second registration to get my car out of impoundment later caused an employee to throw out my earlier registration form (the one associated with the check they cashed) because the computer would show the car as being registered. i'm not sure of their standard procedures but i'm speculating they separate payment from the actual paperwork for whatever reason, and then later process the paperwork, even though they deposited the checks, and perhaps my paper got misplaced or thrown out. i guess this all comes down to what counts as proof of registration. the NJ transit cop phoning in my license plate on a cell phone perhaps with bad reception, to a MVC worker who is stucking working the weekend shift and is half alert, to my physical check that states payment went through. i can't imagine why payment for registration doesn't equate with proof of registration, but this is NJ, and I've come to realize their logic is far removed from the rest of the U.S.

the prosecutor will likely claim that i should have sent my registration in sooner in which case i can show my method of transportation during that time (my monthly bus pass) if the NJ transit acted in good faith by towing my car because they towed it based on the only information they had available to them at the time, i can show i parked my car in good faith. i didn't abandon it, i did intend to return to it (round trip train ticket that day) it really depends on what type of prosecutor i get, i suppose. this was a Saturday, the parking lot was very sparse, had it been a work day, i might have been taking up space from someone trying to get to work, etc. essentially, my car was towed from a very empty lot. but in any event, i'm not waivering from my claim that proof of payment should be equivalent to proof of registration.

 

[platinum90]

No, NJ does NOT have a sticker system. there is no sticker to display.

so NJ transit sees vehicles in the parking lot, they call a phone number and provide the license plate number. in PA, a cop would see an expired sticker, in NJ it's unlikely a motorist is ever pulled over solely for the reason of the car being expired because the cops would have no visible way of knowing based on appearance of the car. the cop later might pull someone over for another reason, trace the license plate, and then find out, but there is no sticker to alert them to that. had i been pulled over for any reason while driving, i would not have had the registration card to show to the cop, but at max, once he called in my license plate, he would have given me an $85 fine and let me drive home. i've never been pulled over in my life, so the issue is somewhat irrelevant, i guess. the NJ transit simply calls in plates in the parking lots they are patrolling in order to determine the registration.

i wasn't hoping not to get "caught" because the registration was sent in on a monday and the registration was paid. under normal circumstances according to the MVC website, i should have recevied the card in seven days. had a cop pulled me over and found out the MVC system indicated the car was not registered i would have gotten an $85 fine which could have been waived once i submitted the canceled check. the cop would not have taken my car to impound and forced me to walk home, since the car was parked, they impound it because they are operating under the assumption it was abandoned.

 

[platinum90]

essentially, i'm claiming my registration begins when the check is processed, not when the MVC decides to get around to processing the paperwork associated with the check they already cashed. this might be a more clear cut case if i had gotten pulled over and didn't physically have the card available. since there is no sticker system in NJ and the car was parked, the NJ transit relies on whatever info MVC provides to them over the phone. had i initially registered in person, i would have given a check (not yet cashed) and left the premises with a registration card. in this case, registration would be effective PRIOR to the check being cleared. if registration can become effectively immediately upon showing up at the MVC in person, i'm not sure why a cashed check doesn't count as proof of registation in this case. there is no way for the NJ transit to prove that my registration card was not in my glove box the whole time. the second registration card i got doesn't appear to have any visible identifying features or date to differentiate it is the registration card that was associated with my payment on the following Monday, not the prior Friday. i have proof of payment for a registration card i never received. i would think proof of payment has to count for something. if not, then crimes likes theft would be at epidemic proportions.

 

[FlyingRon]

Cars with expired registrations in NJ will frequently not have a valid INSPECTION sticker. You can't get an inspection sticker without a valid registration card and proof of insurance. Believe me I learned that one the hard way when I found my insurance card was an old one when I went through the lane once.

 

[platinum90]

Cars with expired registrations in NJ will frequently not have a valid INSPECTION sticker.

In this case, the inspection was valid and current.

 

[platinum90]

Had your registration expired a few days or a week before you parked it, it probably wouldn't have been towed. Three months is a little over-the-top.




There is nothing to be gained by not renewing on time. If your registration expires in May, but don't renew until August, your new registration will not expire in August, it'll still expire in May. You're still paying for those months whether the car sits in your driveway or not.

As for holding MVC responsible for not processing fast enough, mailing in payment takes time. As stated, under ideal conditions, seven days. It can take longer. Despite what you think, a delay in processing hardly qualifies as Theft.

I may be wrong, but I bet there was an additional late payment fee attached that you didn't add to your renewal payment. Failure to send it usually puts a stop on the renewal process.

No additional fines were paid for the late registration because the registration was not more than 6 months expired, so I'm safely guessing that first check was the correct amount and that was not the delay in processing the actual paperwork.
I'm not even sure calling it a delay is probably the best description because they cashed the check. Why cash the check if they had no intention of properly crediting me with my registration?

Yes, I'm aware that my registration is still expiring at the same month again, not the month of late renewal, and so clearly there would have been no loss and possibly greater benefit in paying a nominal fee to have my car sit at home. I'm unclear what the penalties for having an unregistered vehicle on your own property are but I'm guessing it doesn't result in impoundment. Even driving without a registration wouldn't have resulted impoundment. I'm just as guilty of failure to process paperwork efficiently just as NJ MVC. We're the same in that regard.

I'll have to up my goody-two shoes quotient. I have a sinking suspicion I'm going to end up slightly more pathetic than I already am (i clearly thought i was goody-two shoes already) but of course I'll be several hundred dollars richer.
in any case, failure to show in small claims court is common with larger entities, so i'll take my chances that the papework gets lost in the mail and possibly win by default if they fail to show.

 

[platinum90]

Cars with expired registrations in NJ will frequently not have a valid INSPECTION sticker. You can't get an inspection sticker without a valid registration card and proof of insurance. Believe me I learned that one the hard way when I found my insurance card was an old one when I went through the lane once.

I've come to learn that NJ is quite different than PA was on many things despite being so close in geography. I never heard of impoundment issues in PA, yet after this experience, I've encountered many horror stories, even as much as a day late in registration.

I just hope they don't automatically fine me with abandonment of vehicle. that will defy all logic. my payment should hold some regard as well as my round trip train tickets which demonstrate proof of intent to return to the car rather than abandon it.

 

[platinum90]

Cars with expired registrations in NJ will frequently not have a valid INSPECTION sticker. You can't get an inspection sticker without a valid registration card and proof of insurance. Believe me I learned that one the hard way when I found my insurance card was an old one when I went through the lane once.

But at least inspection is free in NJ. haha. large government at its finest.

 

[platinum90]

I think I'm going to cut my losses and move on. there are only so many hours in the day, and the negative energy surrounding this issue is too detrimental. i'll just be glad there are no points associated with this citation, so my impeccable driving record will remain unchanged. that and I might move out of NJ. they do things incredibly different than PA, which is much more preferable, imo.