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Using funds from the estate for personal use

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What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? AL

Hello again anteater, et al...:)

I knew this question would come up sooner or later with this family, but I didn't think it would be sooner!

The Personal Representative is getting money from life insurance companies which is earmarked for the estate. She is going to put the money in her own account for safe-keeping until the attorney asks for it, she says. What is wrong with the estate's account?

Just when and under what circumstances can the PR use the estate's funds? Can she loan money to the beneficiaries of the estate in anticipation of them receiving what is listed on the statement of accounts; CDs, bank checking account, etc?

I hope this estate ends soon or I will be absent a patient and all because my ward is to receive more than her stepsisters. Cinderella syndrome, you think? :confused:
 


anteater

Senior Member
She is going to put the money in her own account for safe-keeping...
Safekeeping? Ask her what happens to that "safely kept" money if she runs over some 40 year old investment banker making $5 mil a year and is sued.

Just when and under what circumstances can the PR use the estate's funds? Can she loan money to the beneficiaries of the estate in anticipation of them receiving what is listed on the statement of accounts; CDs, bank checking account, etc?
Probably, although it is not exactly what you would call a best practice.

I know the story as you have told it. But do you suspect that the PR is actually attempting to deal from the bottom of the deck? Or is she just clueless?

If you have any kind of relationship with her, tell her that she retained an attorney for a reason. She needs to have a chat with the attorney about the fiduciary responsibility of a PR. And the personal liability that could ensue if some of her transactions go awry.
 
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Safekeeping? Ask her what happens to that "safely kept" money if she runs over some 40 year old investment banker making $5 mil a year and is sued.


Probably, although it is not exactly what you would call a best practice.

I know the story as you have told it. But do you suspect that the PR is actually attempting to deal from the bottom of the deck? Or is she just clueless?

If you have any kind of relationship with her, tell her that she retained an attorney for a reason. She needs to have a chat with the attorney about the fiduciary responsibility of a PR. And the personal liability that could ensue if some of her transactions go awry.
Oh she doesn't want to talk to me!! I have been told this doesn't concern me directly!! It has to do with the health and well-being of someone I care for who has MS and unable to afford a setback of any kind so it really does.

Her stepsister (my ward) found out today that the PR is going to "adopt" the daughter of the deceased sister now ...evidently because she will inherit some money.

My husband and I now agree that it would be in the best interest of our ward to have counsel herself. I almost feel like contacting the attorney handling this case and asking him to talk to the PR so no more money will be spent hiring another attorney. She can't afford this monetarily or mentally. I have to wonder does this attorney know what ire she is causing? Is he just letting her have her way or possibly doesn't know what she is doing?

Could you please tell me what items have to show up on the final accounting sheet of this case? There are a couple of CDs that came in whose amounts are not recorded on the List of Accounts that are in the thousands of dollars in this PR's possession.

We owe a debt of gratitude for the excellent advice we have attained on this forum.

As always thank you for your time.
 

anteater

Senior Member
Her stepsister (my ward) found out today that the PR is going to "adopt" the daughter of the deceased sister now ...evidently because she will inherit some money.
I am rather confused. Are you the legal guardian of the testator's predeceased niece's daughter? (Woo.. That's a mouthful.) If you are, I would think that it does "...concern [you] directly." But keep in mind what I said in prior responses. The PR is not required to engage in a constant dialog with the beneficiaries. The PR can say, "Quit bugging me. If you have a problem, get yourself an attorney and petition the court with your problem."

I almost feel like contacting the attorney handling this case and asking him to talk to the PR so no more money will be spent hiring another attorney.
It's worth a try. Attorneys usually don't like their clients going off the reservation. Particularly, if they are not working on an hourly fee basis. The worst that can happen is that the attorney responds, "I'm sorry, but I can't speak to you. You will have to speak with the PR."

Could you please tell me what items have to show up on the final accounting sheet of this case?
Should be everything that is properly part of the probate estate. While not certain on this, I would think that Alabama law would require the PR to submit a revised inventory if some assets were unknown/overlooked when the inventory was first submitted.

Are you certain that the CD's did not have beneficiary designations, and, therefore, would not be part of the probate estate?
 
I am rather confused. Are you the legal guardian of the testator's predeceased niece's daughter? (Woo.. That's a mouthful.) If you are, I would think that it does "...concern [you] directly." But keep in mind what I said in prior responses. The PR is not required to engage in a constant dialog with the beneficiaries. The PR can say, "Quit bugging me. If you have a problem, get yourself an attorney and petition the court with your problem."


It's worth a try. Attorneys usually don't like their clients going off the reservation. Particularly, if they are not working on an hourly fee basis. The worst that can happen is that the attorney responds, "I'm sorry, but I can't speak to you. You will have to speak with the PR."


Should be everything that is properly part of the probate estate. While not certain on this, I would think that Alabama law would require the PR to submit a revised inventory if some assets were unknown/overlooked when the inventory was first submitted.

Are you certain that the CD's did not have beneficiary designations, and, therefore, would not be part of the probate estate?
No, my ward's sister was the predeceased one. I am legal guardian of the sister who is alive and inheriting 1/2 of 1/2 of the first part of the estate and 1/3 of the second half of the estate.. The PR is the stepsister. (Two full-sisters; two stepsisters involved in this Will.)

As to the CDs, no I am not certain about the beneficiary designations as all communication by the PR to my ward has ceased and the information that we are receiving is coming from a daughter of the PR. Yep....complicated I know. I would think if the PR is able to pull in the CD, then she must be entitled to it. I assume she doesn't have to tell anyone that she is entitled other than the attorney.

My ward is becoming very ill over this course of affairs. Her blood pressure, gait and overall appearance is suffering. I do feel it will be in her best interest to wait the outcome of this case and if she there is any embezzlement or unfair measures that were taken, then sue! :confused: I do want her alive when this case is finally settled.

I'll come back and let you know from time to time what is happening.

We thank you for being here anteater. :)
 

BlondiePB

Senior Member
No, my ward's sister was the predeceased one. I am legal guardian of the sister who is alive and inheriting 1/2 of 1/2 of the first part of the estate and 1/3 of the second half of the estate.. The PR is the stepsister. (Two full-sisters; two stepsisters involved in this Will.)

As to the CDs, no I am not certain about the beneficiary designations as all communication by the PR to my ward has ceased and the information that we are receiving is coming from a daughter of the PR. Yep....complicated I know. I would think if the PR is able to pull in the CD, then she must be entitled to it. I assume she doesn't have to tell anyone that she is entitled other than the attorney.

My ward is becoming very ill over this course of affairs. Her blood pressure, gait and overall appearance is suffering. I do feel it will be in her best interest to wait the outcome of this case and if she there is any embezzlement or unfair measures that were taken, then sue! :confused: I do want her alive when this case is finally settled.

I'll come back and let you know from time to time what is happening.

We thank you for being here anteater. :)
Where's your guardian attorney? The PR has no business talking to your ward about all this. You are the one with which the PR must deal about the estate, not your ward.
 
Where's your guardian attorney? The PR has no business talking to your ward about all this. You are the one with which the PR must deal about the estate, not your ward.
Yes you are so correct! I have an appointment in Oct. Until then I have asked them NOT to call here. Mainly the sister to the PR who likes to keep confusion going regardless how sick a person is. The daughter of the PR wants to keep us informed of everything that her mother is doing as she doesn't agree with everything her mom is doing. It is time for our counsel to step in and go over the papers.
 
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BlondiePB

Senior Member
Yes you are so correct! I have an appointment in Oct.
October...??? Find an attorney that will take this now. And, find one that does both guardianships & probate.
Until then I have asked them NOT to call here. Mainly the sister to the PR who likes to keep confusion going regardless how sick a person is.
Put it in writing, sign it with your name then guardian for name of your ward, and send it CRR. Remember, you have a legal duty to protect your ward.

The daughter of the PR wants to keep us informed of everything that her mother is doing as she doesn't agree with everything her mom is doing.
Instruct daughter of PR to speak only with you.

It is time for our counsel to step in and go over the papers.
What kind of counsel waits until October?????
 
October...??? Find an attorney that will take this now. And, find one that does both guardianships & probate.

Put it in writing, sign it with your name then guardian for name of your ward, and send it CRR. Remember, you have a legal duty to protect your ward.


Instruct daughter of PR to speak only with you.


What kind of counsel waits until October?????
We called on the 4th of September and was told the attorney who took care of the guardianship would be out of the country until the first week in October and he would have to be the one to handle our case.

We do have an appointment for the lst with him.
 
The attorney we saw handles probate matters.

My husband called and spoke to the attorney that is handling this estate. The attorney was apprised of some of the things that were being said and done by the PR; mainly the PR not sending him the same written information that we have to him. It seems the attorney was very surprised at the PR and said he would take care of the matter and to let him know if anymore calls were received here and gave us his email address to notify him of any further issues.

Had it not been for this forum and the excellent help of anteater, I don't know if we could have held in here this long. I have to hand it to all of you; this kind of work is rough on the nerves and creates a lot of anxiety. Atleast it does with us old folks! :confused:

Thanks FreeAdvice Forum!! Will be back if only to say all is well! Anteater ^5 LOL
 

BlondiePB

Senior Member
The attorney we saw handles probate matters.

My husband called and spoke to the attorney that is handling this estate. The attorney was apprised of some of the things that were being said and done by the PR; mainly the PR not sending him the same written information that we have to him. It seems the attorney was very surprised at the PR and said he would take care of the matter and to let him know if anymore calls were received here and gave us his email address to notify him of any further issues.

Had it not been for this forum and the excellent help of anteater, I don't know if we could have held in here this long. I have to hand it to all of you; this kind of work is rough on the nerves and creates a lot of anxiety. Atleast it does with us old folks! :confused:

Thanks FreeAdvice Forum!! Will be back if only to say all is well! Anteater ^5 LOL
My husband and I have now contacted the attorney who took care of the guardianship of our ward because there are issues where we can't go any further.
I pulled the above from your other thread that you posted to today. This is exactly what needs to be done - getting the guardian attorney involved. The guardian attorney can obtain the beneficary info from the insurance company by subpeona if necessary and all other documents necessary to protect your ward's inheritance.

The court really frowns on taking advantage of a protected person. With all the smoke & mirrors going on with the PR, she may end up right in front of a judge with some serious 'splaining to do regarding your ward. And, you'll be able to watch the entire show. :D
 

BlondiePB

Senior Member
We called on the 4th of September and was told the attorney who took care of the guardianship would be out of the country until the first week in October and he would have to be the one to handle our case.

We do have an appointment for the lst with him.
Okay, that's a good reason. Please update us next month.
 
Okay, that's a good reason. Please update us next month.
This will be my final post on the subject. I have more than stayed my welcome on this board and on this subject and have received all of the help I can for the ward I am taking care of. She will be best served by the guardianship attorney.

Now more time can be devoted to other people and I won't become the subject of a thread all by myself LOL. Not a problem. Peace to all and remember Grandparents Day this Sunday, September 13, for us gray-haired, taking all the space grandmas LOL.

Good luck to Phase08 as well. I am not the ward of the deceased niece, however. I am the guardian of the ward. No relationship whatsoever. Anyway, take care all.
 
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