Limitations of PO/SO abilities

[jdbiggers]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Arizona

I am NOT on parole or probation. I built a motorized bicycle for a client and often see him while doing repairs and customization. I have delivered and picked up the bike at his house. I have given him rides to appointments when I had the bike as a favor. He is a client.

He has been told he cannot have contact with me unless I am registered with his PO, and his PO and SO (surveillance officer) have tried, very rudely, to ask me personal questions. I haven't even given them my name because of the extremely rude tone in their voices. They look at mean with disdain and in an accusatory manner (I am 48, retired, with a doctorate (PhD) in macroeconomics) because they think I just work on bicycles. I simply told them that their job is to protect the public and to ASSIST the parolee in making the necessary life changes to successfully rehabilitate and that my name and other information is none of their business.

Am I correct that they have no such authority nor should they be restricting this individual from doing business with people (particularly since my motorized bike is a means for him to be compliant with his parole condition of not driving)? They have threatened me with arrest for obstruction and have threatened HIM to revoke his parole. He is a good kid, but I hate when these public servant lunatics think they have more power than in fact is within their bailiwick.

Thank you.

jdbiggers
Pima County, Arizona

 

[quincy]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Arizona

I am NOT on parole or probation. I built a motorized bicycle for a client and often see him while doing repairs and customization. I have delivered and picked up the bike at his house. I have given him rides to appointments when I had the bike as a favor. He is a client.

He has been told he cannot have contact with me unless I am registered with his PO, and his PO and SO (surveillance officer) have tried, very rudely, to ask me personal questions. I haven't even given them my name because of the extremely rude tone in their voices. They look at mean with disdain and in an accusatory manner (I am 48, retired, with a doctorate (PhD) in macroeconomics) because they think I just work on bicycles. I simply told them that their job is to protect the public and to ASSIST the parolee in making the necessary life changes to successfully rehabilitate and that my name and other information is none of their business.

Am I correct that they have no such authority nor should they be restricting this individual from doing business with people (particularly since my motorized bike is a means for him to be compliant with his parole condition of not driving)? They have threatened me with arrest for obstruction and have threatened HIM to revoke his parole. He is a good kid, but I hate when these public servant lunatics think they have more power than in fact is within their bailiwick.

Thank you.

jdbiggers
Pima County, Arizona

I do not understand why you would refuse to give your name to the fellow's parole officer. You would be helping your "client" by doing so.

 

[davew128]

Did it occur to you that your client is likely not allowed to associate with certain classes of people and that the PO and SO are charged with making sure he abides by the terms of his release? They don't know you, and can't verify if you're not in the group of individual types he is prohibited from contacting. I suspect if you give them your name and you check out, they would be friendlier to you in the future...

 

[Silverplum]

Find out for yourself: https://corrections.az.gov/sites/default/files/1002-3_2.pdf

 

[jdbiggers]

Limitations and RESPECT

Did it occur to you that your client is likely not allowed to associate with certain classes of people and that the PO and SO are charged with making sure he abides by the terms of his release? They don't know you, and can't verify if you're not in the group of individual types he is prohibited from contacting. I suspect if you give them your name and you check out, they would be friendlier to you in the future...

So a parolee can't even order a pizza or other product that may require delivery or personal contact without first notifying the PO/SO? Sorry, that makes no sense.

And, as for why I would not give them my name is because of the excessively rude tone of the persons question."Who are you? Show me some ID RIGHT NOW!" I'm talking their getting right into my face and barking with actual spit flying in my face. If I spit on an officer, it is assault with a bodily fluid; they do it in the course of speaking.

Sorry, these guys are public servants whose salaries I more than pay for with the taxes I pay (I pay more in AZ income tax alone than the median annual gross income in AZ).

People deserve to be treated with respect. I am NOT one of his parolees, so I should not be assumed to be a criminal, nor should any officer of the law be disrepectful of any community member, even during questioning of a crime or violation of ordinance. They train police officers to keep their cool and be respectful at all times, even during the arrest of an individual. Why should this not hold for POs and SOs?

 

[Silverplum]

So a parolee can't even order a pizza or other product that may require delivery or personal contact without first notifying the PO/SO? Sorry, that makes no sense.

And, as for why I would not give them my name is because of the excessively rude tone of the persons question."Who are you? Show me some ID RIGHT NOW!" I'm talking their getting right into my face and barking with actual spit flying in my face. If I spit on an officer, it is assault with a bodily fluid; they do it in the course of speaking.

Sorry, these guys are public servants whose salaries I more than pay for with the taxes I pay (I pay more in AZ income tax alone than the median annual gross income in AZ).

People deserve to be treated with respect. I am NOT one of his parolees, so I should not be assumed to be a criminal, nor should any officer of the law be disrepectful of any community member, even during questioning of a crime or violation of ordinance. They train police officers to keep their cool and be respectful at all times, even during the arrest of an individual. Why should this not hold for POs and SOs?

https://corrections.az.gov/sites/default/files/1002-3_2.pdf

 

[quincy]

So a parolee can't even order a pizza or other product that may require delivery or personal contact without first notifying the PO/SO? Sorry, that makes no sense. ...

Your pizza comment reminds me of a true story out of Michigan: A man was released from jail on a tether and confined to his home. He ordered a pizza and, when the pizza was delivered, he robbed the pizza delivery man. The police had no trouble at all tracking down the thief.

The best way to deal with disrespectful people often can be to be overly polite and respectful in response. It makes the disrespectful people look bad and, with luck, feel bad. At the very least, it does not lower you to their level.

You should have provided your name. It was a bit silly on your part not to.

 

[not2cleverRed]

The fact is, your client is in a situation where he happens to have a PO and SO. So apparently he was deemed guilty of something.

We don't know what your client allegedly did. But apparently it wasn't something "good", and perhaps this is why the PO is concerned that "good boy" could (again) fall prey to bad influences.

So, what would be so wrong with being overly polite and helpful, rather than belligerent? Do you really think that they couldn't find out who you are, if they wanted to? (Do you really think that they don't know who you are already?) Your hostility is reflecting poorly on your client.

Oh, and having a PhD doesn't mean you're automatically a paragon of virtue, or an upstanding, respectable member of society. Even if it's in macroeconomics.

 

[davew128]

So a parolee can't even order a pizza or other product that may require delivery or personal contact without first notifying the PO/SO? Sorry, that makes no sense.

Neither does your completely inaccurate analogy.

And, as for why I would not give them my name is because of the excessively rude tone of the persons question."Who are you? Show me some ID RIGHT NOW!" I'm talking their getting right into my face and barking with actual spit flying in my face. If I spit on an officer, it is assault with a bodily fluid; they do it in the course of speaking.

My personal response to them would have been GFY.

Sorry, these guys are public servants whose salaries I more than pay for with the taxes I pay (I pay more in AZ income tax alone than the median annual gross income in AZ).

Quick, let me call a waaaambulance.

People deserve to be treated with respect. I am NOT one of his parolees, so I should not be assumed to be a criminal, nor should any officer of the law be disrepectful of any community member, even during questioning of a crime or violation of ordinance. They train police officers to keep their cool and be respectful at all times, even during the arrest of an individual. Why should this not hold for POs and SOs?

File a complaint with the department then. Last time I checked, being a @*(&#$ is not a crime even if wearing a badge.

 

[davew128]

So, what would be so wrong with being overly polite and helpful, rather than belligerent?

On this one I'm going to side with OP. A few choice expletives and insults back in that situation, IMO would be completely acceptable.

 

[quincy]

... Oh, and having a PhD doesn't mean you're automatically a paragon of virtue, or an upstanding, respectable member of society. Even if it's in macroeconomics.

Kenneth Lay comes to mind.

dave128, if jdbiggers responds to rudeness with expletives and insults, that puts him on the same level as those whose rudeness he finds offensive. There is really no good reason to respond in kind.

 

[dave33]

Sorry, these guys are public servants whose salaries I more than pay for with the taxes I pay (I pay more in AZ income tax alone than the median annual gross income in AZ).

Well then Mr. Bigshot, If so rich and educated you should be able to grasp the concept of hiring an attorney and lodging a complaint. If totally and completely morally outraged than hire two (what the heck you've got the dough).

 

[quincy]

Well then Mr. Bigshot, If so rich and educated you should be able to grasp the concept of hiring an attorney and lodging a complaint. If totally and completely morally outraged than hire two (what the heck you've got the dough).

He might not be able to afford an attorney. jdbiggers' money appears stretched already, paying as he is the salaries of the public servants who rudely asked him for his name.

 

[davew128]

dave128, if jdbiggers responds to rudeness with expletives and insults, that puts him on the same level as those whose rudeness he finds offensive. There is really no good reason to respond in kind.

I disagree. I take great satisfaction in humiliating loudmouths who try to intimidate me simply because they have a badge, are drunk, whatever the reason. Particularly in an instance where I otherwise don't know these people and wouldn't otherwise interact with them. It sounds like the PO/SO are used to intimidating their charges because of their position and might have a more difficult time interacting with street people who don't have to answer to them. Like I said previously my personal response in that situation would have been expletive laced and quite insulting.

 

[not2cleverRed]

I disagree. I take great satisfaction in humiliating loudmouths who try to intimidate me simply because they have a badge, are drunk, whatever the reason. Particularly in an instance where I otherwise don't know these people and wouldn't otherwise interact with them. It sounds like the PO/SO are used to intimidating their charges because of their position and might have a more difficult time interacting with street people who don't have to answer to them. Like I said previously my personal response in that situation would have been expletive laced and quite insulting.

Because that's so effective for diffusing a situation?

OP doesn't have to be polite.

But he's not doing his client any favors with his attitude.

You can be polite and agreeable and act respectful and respectable - and when the other side isn't, go file a complaint with their superiors. And guess what? That complaint will have more weight if you are consistently a class act, rather than going around with a chip on your shoulder because your snowflake brilliance was disrespected.