Torn on decision

jcg33 · Jun 24, 2005

What is the name of your state? Illinois

Thanks in advance for reading. I am in a tough situation, my wife has seperated from me and is living at her mothers and is in a hurry to get an apartment and start school in august. The catch is we have accrued $20k in debt and that needs to be paid before she can do all that so she is in a hurry to sell our condo. I don't want to sell due to the fact we have a daughter and she has her room here. She just wants equity from our condo to pay of the debt and start saving. She has told me she doesn't want a divorce but wants to pay all the debt and have her head cleared before we start concentrating on our relationship. What I am afraid of is that she has decided on divorce but wants me to sell our condo so that I am left without a home for my daughter. If she were to divorce me I would be able to say she abandoned the home and left me with all the responsibility which she basically did. She wants us to get 2 apartments and see if our relationship works and cancel a lease and move in together. I am also afraid of the fact that she has a spending problem so that may be an issue. I have offered to buy her out and she gets angry and tells me to do whatever I want but if she decides to come back she will not be coming back to our condo. She thinks it would take too long to sell and be a waste of money. She doesn't think renting 2 apartments is a waste. What our my options and would me claiming she abandoned the home in case of a divorce help me any? She did not leave because of physical abuse and we are on speaking terms she claims I was not supporting and controlling, I have been going through couseling and it has helped but she is not sure of what to do she said. Sorry is so long and if I left any info out I can add it to better explain. Thanks

LdiJ · Jun 24, 2005

jcg33 said:
What is the name of your state? Illinois

Thanks in advance for reading. I am in a tough situation, my wife has seperated from me and is living at her mothers and is in a hurry to get an apartment and start school in august. The catch is we have accrued $20k in debt and that needs to be paid before she can do all that so she is in a hurry to sell our condo. I don't want to sell due to the fact we have a daughter and she has her room here. She just wants equity from our condo to pay of the debt and start saving. She has told me she doesn't want a divorce but wants to pay all the debt and have her head cleared before we start concentrating on our relationship. What I am afraid of is that she has decided on divorce but wants me to sell our condo so that I am left without a home for my daughter. If she were to divorce me I would be able to say she abandoned the home and left me with all the responsibility which she basically did. She wants us to get 2 apartments and see if our relationship works and cancel a lease and move in together. I am also afraid of the fact that she has a spending problem so that may be an issue. I have offered to buy her out and she gets angry and tells me to do whatever I want but if she decides to come back she will not be coming back to our condo. She thinks it would take too long to sell and be a waste of money. She doesn't think renting 2 apartments is a waste. What our my options and would me claiming she abandoned the home in case of a divorce help me any? She did not leave because of physical abuse and we are on speaking terms she claims I was not supporting and controlling, I have been going through couseling and it has helped but she is not sure of what to do she said. Sorry is so long and if I left any info out I can add it to better explain. Thanks

While your argument that she "abandoned" the home might help you obtain primary custody of your daughter, assuming that your daughter has remained with you, your wife is correct that selling the condo and using the equity to cover your marital debt is probably a wiser move, financially. Its also less risky for the two of you in the long run should you divorce. If you were remaining together refinancing the condo to cover the debt would also be a wise decision financially.

There is nothing more risky than separating or divorcing with a large amount of joint debt. Your creditors are not a party to your divorce or separation and would not be bound by its terms. Therefore, no matter how debt might be divided, there is simply too much potential for one of you to do serious damage to the other's credit history. Paying off the debt with marital assets is the safest way to eliminate that problem.

Stating that you must keep the condo in order to provide a home for your daughter is unlikely to fly in court. Your daughter will have a home with either you, your wife, or both of you whether you keep the condo or not.
However, if you feel stronger about it you do have the option of attempting to refinance the condo for enough to completely pay off the marital debt and to pay off your wife any excess equity that may be due to her over and above her share of the debt.

jcg33 · Jun 24, 2005

Thanks for the response. Unfortunately my daughter has not remained with me. She expresses interest in staying home in front of my wife which in turn angers her and takes her to her mom's forcefully. I didn't make clear that my wife has a problem that has been diagnosed by a therapist and it is obsessive compulsive spending disorder along with the fact that she is going through an identity crisis. What concerns me with that is if she blows her money after the settlement and comes back to me with a ton of debt. I have given her the option and told her if a divorce is what you want do it and this is making it harder, at the same time if time is what you need thats fine also. I am trying to make the best decision on the debt and condo to benefit me and my daughter whether my wife comes back or not. Thanks for listening and the response.

LdiJ · Jun 24, 2005

jcg33 said:
Thanks for the response. Unfortunately my daughter has not remained with me. She expresses interest in staying home in front of my wife which in turn angers her and takes her to her mom's forcefully. I didn't make clear that my wife has a problem that has been diagnosed by a therapist and it is obsessive compulsive spending disorder along with the fact that she is going through an identity crisis. What concerns me with that is if she blows her money after the settlement and comes back to me with a ton of debt. I have given her the option and told her if a divorce is what you want do it and this is making it harder, at the same time if time is what you need thats fine also. I am trying to make the best decision on the debt and condo to benefit me and my daughter whether my wife comes back or not. Thanks for listening and the response.

If your wife has an obsessive, compulsive spending disorder then I think its even more important to get the current debt load erased, and perhaps some sort of legal separation (if possible in IL) in place to ensure that you cannot be held responsible for future debt. I would also recommend cancelling any joint credit cards.

I would also recommend a consult with an attorney. Some of IL's laws regarding debt that takes place during a marriage are a little different than the average around the country, and it would be in your best interest to know exactly where you stand.

Here is an example of what I mean:

My cousin's wife (now ex-wife) also has an obsessive, compulsive spending disorder. This caused her to embezzle, from her employer, more than 20,000 over the course of two years. She was caught, arrested and ordered to pay restitution. She and my cousin separated. The employer decided to try for a civil judgement for amounts not included in the restitution. The employer did not sue her, did not sue my cousin, but sued their marriage for the amounts involved. The employer did not prevail due to lack of evidence, but that demonstrated to me that IL laws are definitely different than many other states. Of course this was 15 years ago, so the laws may not be the same now....but a consult with an attorney is probably in your best interest.

jcg33 · Jun 24, 2005

LdiJ said:
If your wife has an obsessive, compulsive spending disorder then I think its even more important to get the current debt load erased, and perhaps some sort of legal separation (if possible in IL) in place to ensure that you cannot be held responsible for future debt. I would also recommend cancelling any joint credit cards.

I would also recommend a consult with an attorney. Some of IL's laws regarding debt that takes place during a marriage are a little different than the average around the country, and it would be in your best interest to know exactly where you stand.

Here is an example of what I mean:

My cousin's wife (now ex-wife) also has an obsessive, compulsive spending disorder. This caused her to embezzle, from her employer, more than 20,000 over the course of two years. She was caught, arrested and ordered to pay restitution. She and my cousin separated. The employer decided to try for a civil judgement for amounts not included in the restitution. The employer did not sue her, did not sue my cousin, but sued their marriage for the amounts involved. The employer did not prevail due to lack of evidence, but that demonstrated to me that IL laws are definitely different than many other states. Of course this was 15 years ago, so the laws may not be the same now....but a consult with an attorney is probably in your best interest.

I think your right about contacting a lawyer, I am just concerned with my wife's mental stability right now. I have been offered a line of credit from my parents to pay of the debt until something is decided, whether it be a divorce or reconcilliation. (hoping for the latter) My wife is refusing help from anybody so I may have to do this on my own and have a legal letter stating this loan from my parents is to pay off joint debt and if she does divorce me with the equity made off the condo we are both responsible for it. Thanks

LdiJ · Jun 24, 2005

jcg33 said:
I think your right about contacting a lawyer, I am just concerned with my wife's mental stability right now. I have been offered a line of credit from my parents to pay of the debt until something is decided, whether it be a divorce or reconcilliation. (hoping for the latter) My wife is refusing help from anybody so I may have to do this on my own and have a legal letter stating this loan from my parents is to pay off joint debt and if she does divorce me with the equity made off the condo we are both responsible for it. Thanks

Don't borrow the money from your parents until you consult an attorney. Don't put their assets at risk without proper legal advice.

dallas702 · Jun 24, 2005

It's time to stand up and put your duties as a father first. Your wife will contuinue to drag you and your daughter into debt and pain until she gets help and gets over her "obsession". Until then, make a home for you AND your daughter.....and let your wife fix her own life after the divorce. Set up a separate account for every liability or asset you have. ASAP!

LdiJ · Jun 24, 2005

dallas702 said:
It's time to stand up and put your duties as a father first. Your wife will contuinue to drag you and your daughter into debt and pain until she gets help and gets over her "obsession". Until then, make a home for you AND your daughter.....and let your wife fix her own life after the divorce. Set up a separate account for every liability or asset you have. ASAP!

I agree that his duties as a parent are critical...but his financial duty to himself is almost more important at this point...because a healthy financial situation for him means that he is in the position to provide for his child.

Setting up separate accounts is important. However, as I stated that doesn't guarantee in Illinois that he won't be held liable (or their marriage held liable) for her separate debts. Therefore I believe its critical that he consult an attorney about how to best protect himself financially.

dallas702 · Jun 24, 2005

....sure can't disagree with that.

I think he needs to move quickly. though.

jcg33 · Jun 25, 2005

Well she is insisting she doesn't want a divorce but wants to sell our property and get seperate apartments while we work out our problems. I have responded with I am not selling and I think we should resolve our issues and than worry about everything else. I gave her the option of going ahead with the divorce if she is so concerned with the equity, once again she doesn't want a divorce so I have given her until monday evening when we will have dinner together. The only thing I will not do is file the divorce myself, I will not sell until I know if it is a divorce or if she wants to work it out, I have been firm with my decision. I just hope I am making the right decision for the sake of my marriage if not than I will be contacting an attorney the day after her decision. Thanks for the advice everyone.

dallas702 · Jun 25, 2005

Well, getting a separate apartment to see if your relationship works out isn't exactly a step towards solving problems. She seems to want her cake and eat it too. Separation can work if both parties are going to counseling or seeking resolutions in some way, but the living apart just makes it that much easier to stay apart. Having to sell your home is an extreme measure just to see if it "will work". It sounds to me like she already has a direction planned, but wants to keep that little anchor to hold on to in case things don't go right. If you divorce that will certainly set her free to "find herself", but without financially killing you. Filing asap might stop the trail of debt back to you.

jcg33 · Jun 25, 2005

dallas702 said:
Well, getting a separate apartment to see if your relationship works out isn't exactly a step towards solving problems. She seems to want her cake and eat it too. Separation can work if both parties are going to counseling or seeking resolutions in some way, but the living apart just makes it that much easier to stay apart. Having to sell your home is an extreme measure just to see if it "will work". It sounds to me like she already has a direction planned, but wants to keep that little anchor to hold on to in case things don't go right. If you divorce that will certainly set her free to "find herself", but without financially killing you. Filing asap might stop the trail of debt back to you.

This is what some of my family members and friends are saying about wanting to be married and go to school at the same time on her own and see if she makes it. I guess I am basically her safety net is what people are saying. What has me torn on it is the fact of the identity crisis and I still have hope for my marriage. I feel like being firm on not selling our condo will force her to make a decision either way because of our debt. I see my daughter wanting to see her mommy and daddy together and I would not be able to live with the fact I made a decision to divorce to quick so I am trying to force my wife to make a decision either way. I hope I don't make a mistake that will affect my daughter more.

LdiJ · Jun 25, 2005

jcg33 said:
This is what some of my family members and friends are saying about wanting to be married and go to school at the same time on her own and see if she makes it. I guess I am basically her safety net is what people are saying. What has me torn on it is the fact of the identity crisis and I still have hope for my marriage. I feel like being firm on not selling our condo will force her to make a decision either way because of our debt. I see my daughter wanting to see her mommy and daddy together and I would not be able to live with the fact I made a decision to divorce to quick so I am trying to force my wife to make a decision either way. I hope I don't make a mistake that will affect my daughter more.

I very much respect your desire to make the right decision regarding your marriage and your child. However I am very much concerned that you are not making wise financial decisions in light of your current debt and the potential for her to rack up more. A separation, if its a legal one, puts protections in place that don't exist now. Please do get yourself a consult with an attorney. Make sure that you know where you stand.

Torn on decision

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