Policy Question for CBJ - Or anyone with UC knowledge

What is the name of your state? FL

Hi CBJ, this is Jackie who wanted to quit her job a few weeks ago.

Well, the saga continues.

I have the stomach flu and I called in sick yesterday. That's probably the 5th time in 4 years that I ever called in sick and one of those times was last week due to being "sick" of my job/boss. Yes, I faked it last week but I'm very rarely out. There's another woman in the office who has called in sick about 20 times in the last year. My boss never says a word to her.

So I called in sick again this morning because I really am sick (did I jinx myself last week or what? LOL) My boss said that my absences have gotten exuberant and that he is requiring me to get a doctors note before I can come back to work. After 2 days! He never required that of anyone in 4 years. We don't have a company handbook although we do write them for other companies. Go figure.

I really want to get fired from this job. I need some time to de-stress and find another comparable job and be able to collect UC while I'm looking.

I asked him this morning if I was fired if I didn't bring a doctors note and he said we'd talk about that when the time came. I want to go to work tomorrow and NOT bring a doctors note and see what he does. Is that advisable? Is it misconduct if I have the stomach flu and there's nothing a doctor can do for me anyway??

Thanks for your help!

My boss said that my absences have gotten exuberant Good one.

So your question is if you are fired for not bringing in a doctor's note, will you be eligible for UC benefits? I don't think anyone here can tell you that. The answer is far-too fact specific.

What you are overlooking is that if you get fired from this job for absenteeism or whatever, it's going to make it very difficult for you to find a new job. Most employers won't touch an employee who was fired for his or her attendance with a 10-foot pole.

Thanks Beth! That's just it, I'm NOT out a lot, sheesh! He's just mad because he has to supervise the other employee that's filling in for me. I hope he's p-oed over that all day long.

What are the other "fact-specific" things? I dont keep a time card, we've always gone on the honor system but I get paid close to 40 hours, plus or minus, every week. We also don't get paid for sick time so there's no tracking there to look at, for me or the other woman, which could be to my disadvantage.

Another question is can he require me to go to the doctor and spend money when there's no written company policy stating a time limit that a person can be out sick before producing a note?

I'm not sure how I would handle being fired in regards to my next employer. I'm an honest person so I hope that they wouldn't call to check the reason for termination because a lot of small companies don't check. I prefer small companies anyway, so y'all can keep the corporate world!

The fact-specific issue, for UC purposes, is whether your failure/refusal to bring in a doctor's note will be deemed "willful misconduct" by the State. If it is, then UC benefits will be denied. What I'm saying is that I have no idea what the State would rule on that issue.

Another question is can he require me to go to the doctor and spend money when there's no written company policy stating a time limit that a person can be out sick before producing a note? A written company policy is not required. Since you faked an illness the previous week, it's quite reasonable for your employer to request a doctor's note to substantiate this latest absence.

Yes, I faked it last week but he doesn't know that for certain. I was mentally sick actually... soooo sick of dealing with him that it caused extreme anxiety! LOL

My employment with this company and him will come to and end very soon, one way or another. But since I'm pretty much doomed to receive UC if I quit, I'd much rather be fired and take my chances. I'm trying to find out the best way to cover my bases in that regard as much as I can. Any other thoughts are most appreciated!!

(BTW, it's cbg as in george, not j as in jane )

It's up to you if you want to take your chances. But you are taking your chances not only with whether or not you will receive unemployment, but also with references for future jobs. It is not illegal for an employer to say you were fired and what for. You need to think about the long term effects of "trying to get fired", not just the short term.

I've been in situations like yours but I think you are far better off looking for a new job and quitting when you get one, rather than playing russian roulette with your umemployment and future employment prospects.

Hi CBG... sorry for the initials mix-up! I remembered you tho

Looking for another job while I'm still employed will mean that I'll probably have to take more time-off for job interviews. Should I tell my employer I'm looking? Can he fire me for that?? LOL

I also have been feeling very stressed out the past few months and I'm developing bags under my eyes (I'm 41). I hate to go to a job interview without feeling fresh and rejuvinated, ya know?

Thanks.

Yes, your employer can fire you for looking for another job. It's your call whether to tell him or not; generally I advise against it.

Ok, I'll sleep on that one. Thank you.

I'd also like to ask you if you think I could be denied UC benefits for failing to produce a doctors note that's not company policy in 4 years? The other woman has been out a few times for 3 days in a row. But her job is not as critical as mine is.

I think it is possible that you could be denied unemployment for failing or refusing to provide a doctor's note. I'm not necessarily saying I think you WILL be denied UC - I just don't know how your state would look at it. But I definitely think think the possibility exists.

Jackie, I don't mean to be rude, and I definitely want you to keep coming back with your questions, but I have to tell you this; there are so many people out of work right now through NO fault of their own and who, because of the tight market, are running out of unemployment, that I have something of a problem with people deliberately looking for ways to get fired so that they can collect. That is running perilously close to fraud in my opinion. I understand the situation you are in and I'm not unsympathetic. But please do not ask me for advice on how you can get fired and collect unemployment. I won't provide any more than I already have. Okay? Still friends?

And not that you asked this question, but if you are a nonexempt employee the FLSA requires the employer to keep records of the hours you worked. The "honor system" is noncompliant with the record-keeping requirements of the FLSA. If there were ever a claim against the company for nonpayment of wages or overtime, or a DOL audit, the burden of proof would be on the company to provide documents that would counter the employee's claim/records of what hours they worked. Not a good idea by the company.

Patty.. the company complies to the regs it likes... and it's an employee leasing company! I know!

CBG... you're not being rude at all. I came here for honest advice and you've been more than nice and helpful, others have been too. I've never been in this position before and I wanted to know my rights and options. I've only collected UC once before when I was 19 years old and in a different state. I'm a motivated, efficient worker and I've had jobs for many years at a time, but my work environment has become so bad that I'm looking for ways to escape, yes. I know I'll take a pay cut to go to another job but my sanity is invaluable. I'm considering being a server where the hardest part is an upset customer because their steak is over cooked!

Ok - I have a plan. Here it is:

I've drafted an email to my boss telling him that I think it's unfair for him to require a doctors note from me and not others in the past. I also told him that I dont want to spend the $$$ and time to go sit in a clinic for a few hours when I have the stomach flu (that I got from my sister) and there's really nothing a doctor can do. I also said that I was resigning in light of the fact that he will probably terminate me when I return to work without a note. But I made him an offer. I offered to give him up to 1 month to find another employee (I'm an office manager and I process payroll for 925 employees) and that I will happily train a new employee if he agrees to classify my departure as a lay-off. If he doesn't want to agree to that then my resignation will be effective immediately.

I haven't sent it yet. Whaddya think?

Don't send it. If this is really what you want to do, call your boss and tell him you'd like to meet with him in the morning. Email is never an appropriate method to discuss matters of importance.

But shouldn't I get his answer in writting?

If you really want his answer in writing ask for it that way. But I agree with Beth - email is not an appropriate way to deal with the issue at hand.