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Failure to ID

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soulbro

Guest
What is the name of your state? Texas
Hello folks, this is my first post and am in need of building a strong defence. I am a 53 yo male, artist/musician who is in serious trouble because of a young punk cop. Heres my story.
I LIVE WITH MY GROWN SON WHO IS 30 YEARS OLD. SOME WEEKS BACK THE NEXT DOOR NEIGHBORS ADULT SON WHO IS DEAF CAME OVER TO OUR HOUSE. WE HAVE NEVER BEEN AQUANTED WITH THIS MAN BEFORE AND THATS OK. HE'S MINDED HIS BUSNESS AND LIKEWISE WE DO THE SAME. HOWEVER ON THIS DAY WHILE I WAS GONE HE KNOCKED ON THE DOOR AND REQUESTED TO BORROW AND ONION. MY SON OBLIDGED AND GAVE HIM AND ONION. THEY COMMUNICATED WITH PEN AND PAPER. MY SON WAS HAPPY TO HELP. AS HE WAS LEAVING HE ASKED MY SON IF HE COULD COME BACK IN AND JASON SAID YES. WHEN INSIDE THIS DEAF NEIGHBOR MADE SIGN LANGUAGE USING HIS MOUTH AND HAND, OFFERING TO HAVE ORAL SEX WITH MY SON, AT WHICH TIME JASON POLITLY BOOTED HIM OUT THE DOOR AND CLOSED IT. IN SHOCK HE WENT BACK TO HIS ROOM AND PROCEDED TO TRY AND GET HIS MIND OFF WHAT HAD JUST HAPPENED, ONLY TO HAVE THIS MAN RETURN TO OUR FRONT DOOR AND KNOCK. JASON STAYED IN HIS ROOM AND WOULD NOT ANSWER THE DOOR. AFTER KNOCKING SEVERAL MORE TIMES HE FINIALLY LEFT, ONLY TO RETURN A THIRD TIME. AGAIN JASON JUST IGNORED HIM AND HE LEFT. MY SON WAS SO SHOCKED THAT HE NEVER MENTIONED THIS TO ME FOR OVER A WEEK. WHEN I FOUND OUT, I TOO WAS SHOCKED. THE INCIDENT BOTHERED ME DAILY FOR SEVERAL WEEKS AND ON TUESDAY THE 6TH OF MARCH AT ABOUT 10:30 PM WHILE I JUST HAPPENED TO BE IN MY FRONT YARD THE NEIGHBOR DROVE UP AND WHEN HE GOT OUT OF HIS CAR I SHOT HIM THE FINGER FROM MY FRONT YARD AND RETURNED INSIDE. ABOUT 15 MINUTES LATER THERE WAS A VERY LOUD KNOCK AT MY FRONT DOOR. I ANSWERED IT. A LOCAL POLICEMAN DEMANDED MY ID, DID NOT TELL ME WHO HE WAS, OR WHY HE WAS THERE. I ASK HIM WHY HE WANTED TO SEE MY ID. HE DID NOT ANSWER AND ASKED ME TO STEP OUTSIDE. I STEPPED OUT OF THE FRONT DOOR AT WHICH TIME HE AGAIN ME DEMANDED MY ID, AND I AGAIN ASKED WHY. WITHOUT ANY TYPE OF WARNING I WAS (FOR LACK OF BETTER WORDS) AMBUSHED! HE GRABBED ME AND THREW ME TO THE GROUND. HE PROCEDED TO TWIST MY RIGHT ARM BEHIND ME. I SCREAMED. WHAT ARE YOU DOING? HE STATED "YOUR UNDER ARREST"! I ASK WHY, AND HE STATED "FAILURE TO ID"? I TRYED TO RESIST BEING HANDCUFFED AT FIRST, AT WHICH TIME HE TOLD ME HE WOULD PEPPER SPRAY ME. WITH HIS LEFT HAND ON THE GROUND INCHES FROM MY FACE HE HAD A CAN OF PEPPER SPRAY AND PUTS IT RIGHT NEXT TO MY LEFT HAND! FOR REASONS OF SELF DEFENSE I PLACED MY FINGERS ON TOP OF IT TO STOP HIS AGRESSION BECAUSE I WAS IN A STATE OF SHOCK AND SCARED TO DEATH OF BEING SPRAYED. SELF DEFENSE NOTHING MORE! HE THEN CALLS BACK UP. I WAS CUFFED SO TIGHT THAT I THOUGHT I WAS GOING TO LOOSE MY RIGHT HAND. I WAS THEN TAKEN STRAIGHT TO THE COUNTY DETENTION CENTER BY THE PD AT SPEEDS OF 85 90 MPH. AGAIN I ASKED WHY I WAS BEING ARRESTED AND AGAIN TOLD FAILURE TO ID. I WANT EVEN GO INTO HOW BADLY I WAS TREATED THERE THAT NIGHT.
ON WEDNESDAY I WAS INFORMED BY A JUDGE THAT I AM CHARGED WITH ASSAULT ON A POLICE OFFICER, RESISTING ARREST, TRYING TO TAKE HIS PEPPER SPRAY, REACHING FOR HIS GUN, AND FAILURE TO ID! THEN I WAS TOLD I THREATENED THE NEIGHBOR WITH A STICK. ALL LIES.
ALL I DID WAS STOP HIS THREAT TO PEPPER SPRAY! I FEEL CERTAIN HE WANTED TO SPRAY ME IN THE FACE AT A DISTANCE OF ABOUT 10 INCHES. I WAS SCARED TO DEATH. I HAVE NEVER OWNED PISTOL IN MY LIFE. I WAS THE ONE ASSAULTED NOT HIM! I NOW HAVE 2 FELONY AND 2 MISTERMENER CHARGES AGAINST ME STIMMING FROM THIS INCIDENT IN MY FRONT YARD. I FACE LEGAL CHARGES THAT I CAN NOT AFFORD. I WAS ASSULTED BY A PEACE OFFICER FOR ONLY ASKING WHY I WAS BEING TOLD TO ID. NOTHING MORE. I GOT A $23,000 BOND BECAUSE OF THIS!
. MY LIFE IS TURNED UPSIDE DOWN. MY MOTHER IS A NINETY YEAR OLD WIDOW WHO LIVES ON A FIXED INCOME. SHE BORROWED MONEY FROM THE CREDIT UNION (10%) AND GOT ME RELEASED ON FRIDAY. I CANT EAT, I CANT SLEEP AND FEEL SICK INSIDE AND OUT SINCE THIS HAS HAPPENED. THE THOUGHT OF HAVING TO GO BACK TO JAIL IS DISTROYING ME. I LOVE MY MOTHER DEARLY AND LOOK AFTER HER. THE NEWS PAPER ARTICAL HAS DESTROYED THE FAMILY AND SMEARED MY REPUTATION VERY BADLY, BUT I CAN PICK UP THE PIECES AND START AGAIN. BUT THE THOUGHT OF JAIL TIME IS PHYSICALLY AND MENTALLY MAKING ME SICK. IM PETROFIED AND FEEL LIKE I AM GOING TO BREAK DOWN. I FEEL MY RIGHTS WERE VIOLATED FROM THE START. I HAD MY WALLET IN MY POCKET AND WAS NEVER OPPOSED TO SHOWING MY TDL, I ONLY ASK WHY, AND WAS NEVER ANSWERED. I WAS NEVER TOLD I WAS UNDER ARREST, I HAD TO ASK WHILE I WAS UNDER ASSULT. I CANT RAISE MY RIGHT ARM OVER MY HEAD BECAUSE OF THE PAIN. HELP!!!
 
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outonbail

Senior Member
This is a good example of how fast everything can turn to crap when you don't simply cooperate with the police and comply with their requests right from the start. Going by the information you've posted, it certainly sounds like the officer could have handled the situation much better than he did.
However, I must take into consideration, the fact that most, if not all posters claiming they were treated inappropriately by the police, tend to spin a rendition of the event that places them in the best light.
With that said, the only hope I can see for building a strong defense, would come by way of either an independant witness, or video of the incident. Aside from that, it's your word against that of the officer.
This is where your credibility will carry considerable weight. However, judging by the adolescent method you chose to employ in dealing with the alleged situation involving your son, I don't see you winning any credibility battles in the near future.
Now before you get the impression I'm just bashing you, try to look at this from an outsider's perspective.
For starters, how was it that you just happened to be in your front yard that night? Were you drinking? What did you think you would accomplish by flipping off your neighbor? I assume that when you say you "shot him the finger", your talking about the deaf son's parent(s). Who it appears, would have had absolutely no knowledge of the alleged actions of their handicapped son.
Additionally, adding the weeks up that passed between the alleged incident, to your hearing of it, then to the night you just happened to be in the yard at 10:30 PM and within finger flipping range of your neighbor, well over a month had passed. Frankly, if you were so bothered by what your son claims happened, I don't understand why you wouldn't have spoken with the deaf son's parents about it shortly after you were informed and in a respectful, adult like manner. Shooting your finger at a parent, who has no clue as to why you would do so, over a month after the fact, is absurd.
Then there's the fact that your son is 30 years old and I would assume, adult enough to deal with the situation without your muscle there to back him up. Not that there was any reason for muscle since this incident was by way of a hand jesture and no physical pushing of the point, or touching went on at all. You also realize that this son is deaf, as in handicapped. Hence, it is entirely possible that he could also suffer from some sort of mental deficiancy, which may contribute to his odd behavior.
In light of these issues, your actions were not only childish, but completely uncalled for.

Then when the police arrive, you have no respect for the fact that he is an officer of the law and decide you'll only cooperate on your terms. It would have been so easy to simply hand him your ID and wait for him to explain why he was there. And, unless your a complete idiot, you certainly had a pretty good idea why he was there anyway.
So I'd say you came off as being an obnoxious jerk, to an officer who was in no mood to put up with any crap that night. So the officer makes the decision to place you in cuffs. He most likely did so, because your attitude and hesitation to comply with his very common request, gave him just cause to look out for his own safety, at least until he could sort out what exactly was going on. His intentions at that point may not have been to arrest you, but simply to detain you and safely encourage some cooperation. But of course, you resist those efforts and the struggle to prevent the officer from cuffing you begins. The result, everything is blown out of proportion.
This is why I ask if you had been drinking that night, because it sure has the sound of alcohol written all over it.

So, you should expect the court to believe the situation transpired close to how I've presented it and not "because of a young punk cop".
Which means, at this point, you need to hire a good lawyer for damage control. Just how much damage control you can expect will depend on alot of other factors, such as any prior criminal charges appearing on your record, accepting responsibility for your actions and showing signs of remorse for being an idiot, such as appologizing to your neighbor etc. etc.
 
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soulbro

Guest
dude this deaf man is older than my son, married with two small kids and it was him I flicked off not his parents. Based on his coming and going by himself constantly, I get the impression he is very promiscuous. I was hoping Id bump into someone here who knows the law and not a wacko like yo!. Do me a favor and dont post again, because you clearly DONT know the 4th amendment rights! :mad: ....
 

CdwJava

Senior Member
You have to understand that the police are not part of a great debating society. If TX law requires you to ID yourself if contacted or detained for a criminal investigation, than that is the law on the matter. After your first attempt to make inquiry and his refusal to tell you why, you should have simply given up the ID. Perhaps you could have asked if you had a choice or not, but the officer is NOT there to debate the issues with you.

Once the officer was attempting to take you into custody, you do not generally have a right to fight with him! While I believe TX law gives you the lawful right to resist the unlawful use of force, this will require a heck of a defense.

Hire a good attorney and you might be able to minimize the impact of these charges.

- Carl
 

Kane

Member
§ 38.02. FAILURE TO IDENTIFY. (a) A person commits an
offense if he intentionally refuses to give his name, residence
address, or date of birth to a peace officer who has lawfully
arrested the person and requested the information.
(b) A person commits an offense if he intentionally gives a
false or fictitious name, residence address, or date of birth to a
peace officer who has:
(1) lawfully arrested the person;
(2) lawfully detained the person; or
(3) requested the information from a person that the
peace officer has good cause to believe is a witness to a criminal
offense.
(c) Except as provided by Subsections (d) and (e), an
offense under this section is:
(1) a Class C misdemeanor if the offense is committed
under Subsection (a); or
(2) a Class B misdemeanor if the offense is committed
under Subsection (b).
(d) If it is shown on the trial of an offense under this
section that the defendant was a fugitive from justice at the time
of the offense, the offense is:
(1) a Class B misdemeanor if the offense is committed
under Subsection (a); or
(2) a Class A misdemeanor if the offense is committed
under Subsection (b).
(e) If conduct that constitutes an offense under this
section also constitutes an offense under Section 106.07, Alcoholic
Beverage Code, the actor may be prosecuted only under Section
106.07.


The Fail to ID charge is, at most, a Class C misdemeanor, according to your version of the facts. It's unlikely they could even make a Class C against you, based on your facts.

However, the fact that an arrest is unlawful is not justification for assaulting a police officer, under Texas law. So the issue at trial would be whether you did in fact assault hime, or try to grab his gun.

The jury will listen to your version of events, and listen to the officer's, and then make a decision about who's telling the truth.
 

outonbail

Senior Member
dude this deaf man is older than my son, married with two small kids and it was him I flicked off not his parents. Based on his coming and going by himself constantly, I get the impression he is very promiscuous. I was hoping Id bump into someone here who knows the law and not a wacko like yo!. Do me a favor and dont post again, because you clearly DONT know the 4th amendment rights! :mad: ....
Well, I’m sorry my post wasn’t filled with answers you wanted to hear.
But wacko?

Here you spend a month “shocked” over an incident you were not a witness to, then decide it’s time to come to your 30 year old son’s rescue by shooting the finger to a deaf neighbor, who you believe is promiscuous because he’s always coming and going.
Following this totally irrational thought process, your emotions have you demanding explainations before your going to show some young punk cop your ID. This leads to him “ambushing” you, which is where the entertainment really swings into high gear. The visual I have of him twisting your arm behind your back, as he calls for back up and threatens you with pepper spray is priceless.
Even after all this, your still stuck on stupid and go into “self defense” mode, until you’re cuffed so tight you’re afraid you might lose a limb. The stage for this fiasco is the same front lawn your being accused of threatening harm to your deaf neighbor with a stick.
Then the show goes on the road, where you find yourself racing to jail at nearly 100 mph, and sit for a day until a judge informs you of the charges your facing. Then it’s time to call your poor old 95 year old mother and ask her to go into debt to bail your bruised a$$ out of jail, which is when you discover the embarrassment this foolish mess is causing your entire family, because your insanity was awarded with a story in the local newspaper. So tell me, how many copies did you buy?

Now your posting your silly antics on line, because you have this dream of building a strong case by claiming your civil rights were violated.
But your calling me wacko?
 

The Occultist

Senior Member
dude this deaf man is older than my son, married with two small kids and it was him I flicked off not his parents. Based on his coming and going by himself constantly, I get the impression he is very promiscuous. I was hoping Id bump into someone here who knows the law and not a wacko like yo!. Do me a favor and dont post again, because you clearly DONT know the 4th amendment rights! :mad: ....
If you apparently know so much about the law, then why are you even asking for legal advice? Shoot, your knowledge is apparently so high, I say when you go to court to just go ahead and represent yourself. You know, since you're an expert in law and 4th amendment rights and everything.

Just because it's not an answer you like doesn't mean it's not correct.
 
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soulbro

Guest
the occult

what a waist of time!...
Kane and Java thank you ! ! !

No post bail and no post cult.
 
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Ozark_Sophist

Senior Member
According to the citation Kane provided, the offence of Failure to Identify comes in play AFTER "a peace officer ... has lawfully arrested the person and requested the information." Unless you were cited under some other code for failure to identify, you appear to be in the clear for this charge ONLY.
 

311Spider

Junior Member
Another example of cops jailing innocents..

I'm trying to picture the whole incident in my mind here, help me out...you were in your front yard at 10:30 pm on a Tuesday night. You were wearing shorts but no shirt, correct? Trailer possibly? I've seen this so many times on the TV show Cops, where the police go around busting people like you who are doing absolutely nothing wrong, just for the sport of it. Its sickening.
 
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