Advanced Health Care Directive

What is the name of your state? Montana

I am listed on a Health Care Directive for an old person who is in a rest home. The Directive states basically that I can make any decision about this persons health care including but not limited to "pulling the plug" to making funeral arrangements etc. etc. It really does cover everything.

My question is this: There are also a couple other people listed on this Directive all of us having the exact same powers. What happens if a very important issue comes up and we all cannot agree on what to do ? Does the majority rule or what ? I can see a possible conflict in the future and basically the Health Care Directive is really to avoid this sort of thing.

MadCowJudge said:

What is the name of your state? Montana

I am listed on a Health Care Directive for an old person who is in a rest home. The Directive states basically that I can make any decision about this persons health care including but not limited to "pulling the plug" to making funeral arrangements etc. etc. It really does cover everything.

My question is this: There are also a couple other people listed on this Directive all of us having the exact same powers. What happens if a very important issue comes up and we all cannot agree on what to do ? Does the majority rule or what ? I can see a possible conflict in the future and basically the Health Care Directive is really to avoid this sort of thing.

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If the other persons are not listed as Alternate Agents, there will be chaos for medical personnel when different directives are given. If the person is competent, he/she needs to make one person in charge with the others as successive alternates when the designated decision maker cannot be reached to make medical decisions.

Thank you Blondie,

So, what you are saying is that the agent listed is the one with the power and the alternates are to act only if that agent cannot be reached. I just read over the directive and it lists myself as the appointed "agent" and the three others as alternates.

So, if a decision to make an "end of life" decision needs to be made and I determine that is what I want to do and the others disagree, my decision will be carried out provided the doctors agree of course.

Thank you Blondie,

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You're very welcome.

So, what you are saying is that the agent listed is the one with the power and the alternates are to act only if that agent cannot be reached. I just read over the directive and it lists myself as the appointed "agent" and the three others as alternates.

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Or if the agent does not want to act.

So, if a decision to make an "end of life" decision needs to be made and I determine that is what I want to do and the others disagree, my decision will be carried out provided the doctors agree of course.

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Decisions are already made in the Health Care Directives. You are just following them. Doctors will let you know when it's time to implement the directives. Should the alternates disagree, there is a way that they can challenge your decision to implement the directives. Remember Terri Shiavo?

BlondiePB said:

You're very welcome.

Or if the agent does not want to act.

Decisions are already made in the Health Care Directives. You are just following them. Doctors will let you know when it's time to implement the directives. Should the alternates disagree, there is a way that they can challenge your decision to implement the directives. Remember Terri Shiavo?

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So, having "alternate" agents could conceivably cause problems in the case where a major decision has to be made. I don't anticipate this but as the "agent" I need to cover the bases. Additionally as the POA for this person with Dementia and as the person who approved the AHCD I guess I do have the power to remove, change, or add any alternate agents of my choice that I feel would be appropriate.

So, having "alternate" agents could conceivably cause problems in the case where a major decision has to be made. I don't anticipate this but as the "agent" I need to cover the bases.

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The alternate agents and anyone else who wants to challege your decision to implement the grantor's directives would have to know what to do which is something most do not know.

Additionally as the POA for this person with Dementia and as the person who approved the AHCD I guess I do have the power to remove, change, or add any alternate agents of my choice that I feel would be appropriate.

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Whoa.....how exactly do you have the authority to approve the AHCD and make any changes to the AHCD?

BlondiePB said:

...

Whoa.....how exactly do you have the authority to approve the AHCD and make any changes to the AHCD?

....

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I have seen this in some POAs, at least insofar as being able to get rid of agents, etc.

Alternate agents are okay; it's when you get co-agents that you have a real mess.

(Same with co-trustees or co-personal representatives.)

Hang on to your panties Blondie

>>Whoa.....how exactly do you have the authority to approve the AHCD and make any changes to the AHCD?<<

That was the question I asked, I didn't say I had that power. Perhaps I don't have that power. I don't know. But, I'll tell you how I can find out. I will call the Attorney that I work with in these matters.

The Alternate agents were appointed by me two months ago in the Attorney's office. They just have proven to be of no use whatsoever so I thought I would remove them. I will obviously do it through the attorney if I decide to go that route.

I appreciate all the comments and answers.

I have seen this in some POAs, at least insofar as being able to get rid of agents, etc.

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We both know that that is rare.

Alternate agents are okay; it's when you get co-agents that you have a real mess.

(Same with co-trustees or co-personal representatives.)

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Agree...and what a mess!

MadCowJudge said:

Hang on to your panties Blondie

>>Whoa.....how exactly do you have the authority to approve the AHCD and make any changes to the AHCD?<<

That was the question I asked, I didn't say I had that power. Perhaps I don't have that power. I don't know. But, I'll tell you how I can find out. I will call the Attorney that I work with in these matters.

The Alternate agents were appointed by me two months ago in the Attorney's office. They just have proven to be of no use whatsoever so I thought I would remove them. I will obviously do it through the attorney if I decide to go that route.

I appreciate all the comments and answers.

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Have you read the original documents drafted by the grantor?

Cowtowwing(sp) around my last question, MadCowJudge?

BlondiePB said:

Cowtowwing(sp) around my last question, MadCowJudge?

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No, not at all. I just haven't read this thread again until just now. Sorry, I am not online as much as you are

Yes, I have read over the AHCD, it doesn't state anything about the agent having the power to remove or add "alternate agents". So, I called the attorney about that and he made up a new AHCD and removed the agents I had previously asked him to add. It is all signed and complete. It is a done deal you might say.

Thank you for your input.

MadCowJudge said:

No, not at all. I just haven't read this thread again until just now. Sorry, I am not online as much as you are

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The time(s) of high tide(s) hasn't/haven't been condusive to playing since Thursday, so I've been aound more frequently while doing some other research for the next rounds of shootouts at OK corral.

Originally Posted by MadCowJudge
Yes, I have read over the AHCD, it doesn't state anything about the agent having the power to remove or add "alternate agents". So, I called the attorney about that and he made up a new AHCD and removed the agents I had previously asked him to add. It is all signed and complete. It is a done deal you might say.

Thank you for your input

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You're very welcome. However, you didn't answer the following question:

Originally Posted by BlondiePB
Have you read the original documents drafted by the grantor?

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It's VERY important!!

BlondiePB said:

The time(s) of high tide(s) hasn't/haven't been condusive to playing since Thursday, so I've been aound more frequently while doing some other research for the next rounds of shootouts at OK corral.

You're very welcome. However, you didn't answer the following question:

It's VERY important!!

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If you mean the Original AHCD the answer is Yes. I have also read over the Original POA, several times in fact. Are you referring to either one of these.

Blondie, I am not an attorney, I fix cows and horses. Sometimes you have to spell it out for dummies like myself.

You should come to my corral sometime. I am a quick draw but I promise to slow down for you. !!

MadCowJudge said:

If you mean the Original AHCD the answer is Yes. I have also read over the Original POA, several times in fact. Are you referring to either one of these.

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Yes...

The problem here that I'm having is that POA's cannot be reassigned. It is exceptionally rare that even an ACHD can be reassigned. This does not mean you cannot be a Health Care Surrogate/Proxy. It just means that another legal trail must be followed.

Blondie, I am not an attorney, I fix cows and horses. Sometimes you have to spell it out for dummies like myself.

You should come to my corral sometime. I am a quick draw but I promise to slow down for you. !!

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Slow Hand (by the Pointer Sisters)

As the midnight moon, was drifting through
The lazy sway of the trees
I saw the look in your eyes, lookin' into mine
Seeing what you wanted to see
Darlin' don't say a word, cause I already heard
What your body's sayin' to mine
I'm tired of fast moves
I've got a slow groove...
On my mind

I want a man with a slow hand
I want a lover with an easy touch
I want somebody who will spend some time
Not come and go in a heated rush
I want somebody who will understand
When it comes to love, I want a slow hand...
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How are you at lassoing?