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Quitclaim Deed Problem

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2

2Mistakes

Senior Member
What is the name of your state? MS

I am really not sure where to post this, and if this is not the correct forum, please point me in the right direction. :D

* 1/4/04 - My ex-wife and I divorced. This is the date that the judgment was entered. Our divorce judgment gave me "exclusive use, possession, and ownership of the marital home." The judgment also ordered me to refinance the home within 1 year and pay my ex-wife her 1/2 of the equity that had accumulated during the marriage. The judgment ordered my ex-wife to execute a quitclaim deed upon receipt of the fund for her equity.

* 12/15/04 - I closed on my refinance. My ex-wife was present at the closing, and was given a check for $15,000, which was her 1/2 of the equity accumulated during the marriage. She executed a quitclaim deed releasing all of her interest in the property. The closing agent from the lender took all of our loan docs with her, including the quitclaim deed. I was advised by the closing agent that the lender would send the quitclaim deed to the courthouse for filing and recording.

* 8/29/05 – Hurricane Katrina hit. My home was flooded with 4 feet of water. I did not have flood insurance, as I did not live in a flood zone. I repaired the house myself completely.

* In early 2006, the MS Development Authority (MDA) announced a Homeowner’s Grant Assistance Program to help people financially whose homes were damaged or destroyed. This program was for people like me who did not have flood insurance because we did not live in a flood zone. I applied for the grant.

* April 2006 – During the processing of my grant application, the MDA informed me that they needed a copy of the quitclaim deed showing that my ex-wife no longer owned the house. I went to the courthouse to get a copy of the quitclaim deed my ex-wife executed on 12/15/04. The court clerk informed me that there was no such deed on record. At that time, my ex and I were on pretty friendly terms, so she executed another quitclaim deed dated 4/12/06. This deed is on file with the courthouse. The MDA accepted this deed and paid me a grant award.

* March 2008 – I was contacted by the MDA and informed that they had done an audit of my grant, and they determined that they had incorrectly assessed my damage, and that they had underpaid me by $17,000. The advised me of what I needed to do in order to re-open my grant and claim the additional $17,000 that I was owed under the grant guidelines. I followed these procedures.

* Today, I received some paperwork from the MDA stating that because the quitclaim deed my ex signed was not filed until April 2006, she would need to sign a waiver waiving all of her interest in any proceeds from the MDA before they could disburse the funds. This is because as of the date of the storm (8/29/05) she was still listed in the courthouse records as an owner of the property. This is because Chase (the lender for the refi in 2004) neglected to file the quitclaim deed taking her name off the property.

My ex and I are no longer on friendly terms. I contacted her today about this and requested her to sign the waiver. She basically told me to go “F” myself. That she isn’t signing anything.

I guess if she refuses to sign this waiver, I will need to take her to court to have a judge order her to sign it.

This is where my questions come in.

1. What type of action is this? What would I need to file asking the court to order her to sign it?

Thanks a bunch!
 


LdiJ

LdiJ

Senior Member
2Mistakes said:
What is the name of your state? MS

I am really not sure where to post this, and if this is not the correct forum, please point me in the right direction. :D

* 1/4/04 - My ex-wife and I divorced. This is the date that the judgment was entered. Our divorce judgment gave me "exclusive use, possession, and ownership of the marital home." The judgment also ordered me to refinance the home within 1 year and pay my ex-wife her 1/2 of the equity that had accumulated during the marriage. The judgment ordered my ex-wife to execute a quitclaim deed upon receipt of the fund for her equity.

* 12/15/04 - I closed on my refinance. My ex-wife was present at the closing, and was given a check for $15,000, which was her 1/2 of the equity accumulated during the marriage. She executed a quitclaim deed releasing all of her interest in the property. The closing agent from the lender took all of our loan docs with her, including the quitclaim deed. I was advised by the closing agent that the lender would send the quitclaim deed to the courthouse for filing and recording.

* 8/29/05 – Hurricane Katrina hit. My home was flooded with 4 feet of water. I did not have flood insurance, as I did not live in a flood zone. I repaired the house myself completely.

* In early 2006, the MS Development Authority (MDA) announced a Homeowner’s Grant Assistance Program to help people financially whose homes were damaged or destroyed. This program was for people like me who did not have flood insurance because we did not live in a flood zone. I applied for the grant.

* April 2006 – During the processing of my grant application, the MDA informed me that they needed a copy of the quitclaim deed showing that my ex-wife no longer owned the house. I went to the courthouse to get a copy of the quitclaim deed my ex-wife executed on 12/15/04. The court clerk informed me that there was no such deed on record. At that time, my ex and I were on pretty friendly terms, so she executed another quitclaim deed dated 4/12/06. This deed is on file with the courthouse. The MDA accepted this deed and paid me a grant award.

* March 2008 – I was contacted by the MDA and informed that they had done an audit of my grant, and they determined that they had incorrectly assessed my damage, and that they had underpaid me by $17,000. The advised me of what I needed to do in order to re-open my grant and claim the additional $17,000 that I was owed under the grant guidelines. I followed these procedures.

* Today, I received some paperwork from the MDA stating that because the quitclaim deed my ex signed was not filed until April 2006, she would need to sign a waiver waiving all of her interest in any proceeds from the MDA before they could disburse the funds. This is because as of the date of the storm (8/29/05) she was still listed in the courthouse records as an owner of the property. This is because Chase (the lender for the refi in 2004) neglected to file the quitclaim deed taking her name off the property.

My ex and I are no longer on friendly terms. I contacted her today about this and requested her to sign the waiver. She basically told me to go “F” myself. That she isn’t signing anything.

I guess if she refuses to sign this waiver, I will need to take her to court to have a judge order her to sign it.

This is where my questions come in.

1. What type of action is this? What would I need to file asking the court to order her to sign it?

Thanks a bunch!
Click to expand...
Your copy of the settlement documents from the 2004 refinance should have a copy of the original quit claim deed. Any chance you could locate that paperwork? The title company also might have a copy on file. Have you spoken to them?

If all else fails, you may have to try taking her to court try to get a judge to order her to sign the waiver. The only other alternative would be to sweeten the pot.
 
T

tve

Junior Member
Curious, what made the judge give you the house? What did she do not to gain exclusive use if it? I am going through the same thing right now.

Thanks!
 
2

2Mistakes

Senior Member
tve said:
Curious, what made the judge give you the house? What did she do not to gain exclusive use if it? I am going through the same thing right now.

Thanks!
Click to expand...
She and I agreed. She didn't want the house, and I was keeping the kids about 85% of the time, so we agreed that I would keep the house, refi, and pay her 1/2 of the equity that accumulated from the date of our marriage until the date of our divorce.
 
2

2Mistakes

Senior Member
LdiJ said:
Your copy of the settlement documents from the 2004 refinance should have a copy of the original quit claim deed. Any chance you could locate that paperwork? The title company also might have a copy on file. Have you spoken to them?

If all else fails, you may have to try taking her to court try to get a judge to order her to sign the waiver. The only other alternative would be to sweeten the pot.
Click to expand...
I lost my copy of the settlement docs from the 2004 refi in the storm. Stupid, I know. When I was evacuating, I thought I had taken all the important paperwork with me, but I missed 1 accordian file on the closet floor. :eek:

I left a message at Chase yesterday, and I just heard back from them . . . the original deed that my ex signed in 12/2004 is still sitting in their file. I have to send a request in writing along with a $10 research fee for them to send it to me. I am doing that right now.

I called the rep at the MDA who is handling my grant, and had to leave her a message. I also sent her an email explaining this whole fiasco. Hopefully I will hear back from her today.

I am crossing my fingers that giving the MDA the deed that my ex signed in 2004 will suffice. However, their letter to me does say that they go by what is on record at the courthouse. This deed isn't on record at the courthouse because Chase failed to file it.

So now I have a couple more questions. :D

1. When I receive the original of the quitclaim deed that was executed on 12/15/2004, can I file that with the courthouse? It's so old I'm afraid they wouldn't file it. Actually, I guess I just need to call the Chancery Clerk for that question and get an answer straight from the horses mouth.

2. Does anyone know if it's possible to nunc pro tunc a quitclaim deed? If the courthouse will not let me file the 2004 deed b/c too much time has passed, is it possible to file an addendum of some sort to the 2006 deed nunc pro tuncing it back to 2004 since that's when my ex originally signed over her interest in the house?

3. I am REALLY hoping and praying that I don't have to go the route of asking the court to order her to sign the waiver. I'm hoping that one of my other options will suffice. BUT, if I do have to go the court route, what exactly do I file? And do I file it in the same court that heard the divorce since it deals with an asset that was settled in the divorce? My first thought is that I need to file a motion in the court that did the divorce, but I don't know what to call the motion. Motion to Order Defendant to Sign Waiver? :confused:

Thanks so much for all the help.
 
N

nextwife

Senior Member
tve said:
Curious, what made the judge give you the house? What did she do not to gain exclusive use if it? I am going through the same thing right now.

Thanks!
Click to expand...
One doesn't have to "do anything" to have the other party get possession of the house. Two owners, 50% rights to each. There are many factors involved, including the ability of one party to keep up the payments and to buy out the other's interest, Gender should not be a factor one way or the other.
 
2

2Mistakes

Senior Member
OK, this is where it stands right now.

I mailed my written request to Chase for them to send me the original deed signed in 2004 that was never filed.

I called the rep at the MDA. She is so wonderfully nice! :D Anyways, I explained everything to her about how a deed was signed prior to Katrina, but that Chase failed to have it recorded. I also told her that there was no way my ex was going to sign the waiver.

The MDA rep told me that I need to get that 2004 deed from Chase, which I am doing. Then she said I need to have it recorded at the courthouse. She says that it won't be a problem even though it's from 2004. Then she said that I need to have someone at Chase sign a statement saying that basically they screwed up in not filing the 2004 deed at the courthouse, and that said deed has been sitting in their file since that time. I don't quite know how that's going to work, but I'm not going to rock the boat with Chase until I have the 2004 deed in hand. Then I will call them about signing the statement.

While I was on the phone with the MDA rep, my wife's phone rang. It was my ex-wife calling my wife. My wife answered, and my ex told my wife that she will think about signing the waiver. She told my wife to email to her, and she will look at it tonight and decide whether she will sign it or not. BUT, she absolutely will not send anyone a photocopy of her driver's license. The letter from the MDA says that the waiver has to be signed by my ex-wife, notarized, and she has to attach a copy of her DL. This is so they know it isn't forged. But I agree with my ex. I don't think I would be comfortable sending a copy of my DL, either.

So, my wife then called our MDA rep back and explained to her that my ex MIGHT sign the waiver and have it notarized, but she will NOT send a copy of her DL. The MDA rep sent my wife a statment for my wife to send to my ex. It is a statement for the notary that my ex signs the waiver in front to sign stating that she actually saw my ex's DL. So my wife called my ex back, ex didn't answer, so wife left a voicemail explaining that if she has the notary attest that the notary saw my ex's DL, my ex doesn't have to send a copy of her DL.

So, hopefully my ex will sign the waiver, have it notarized, and have the notary sign the statement that he/she saw my ex’s DL. That will be the easiest way to end this whole thing.

The thing I’m worried about is my ex seeing $$ when she reads the waiver. She is waiving all interest in any proceeds from the grant. I could see her saying, “Give me $X and I’ll sign it.”

But she is NOT entitled to ANY of this grant money. She moved out of this house in Oct. 2003. We divorced in Jan. 2004, and in Dec. 2004, her name was removed from the mortgage and she was paid $15,000 for her equity in this house. At that point, she was done with this house.

When Katrina hit, I did not have flood insurance. Insurance paid $0 for my loss. My wife and I had to cash out our retirement accounts, and we spent $60,000 repairing this house, not to mention the blood, sweat, and tears. We did 80% of the repairs ourselves. We taught ourselves how to hang and finish drywall, we replaced all the floors, we painted the whole house. We used contractors when we absolutely had to, but we did almost all of the labor ourselves. I’m sorry, but my ex is not getting one red cent of this money. The point of this grant is to reimburse my wife and I for our uninsured losses.

I am really hoping that if this (God forbid) were to have to go to court, a judge would see that my ex is not entitled to this money. That he would see that the lender made an error by not filing the deed from 2004, but my ex was paid her equity, and anything that has happened with this house after that point has nothing to do with her.

I’m still unsure what I would file and in what court, though. But I’m REALLY hoping that this won’t come to that. I am really holding out hope that my ex will do what is morally right and sign the waiver. She knows that morally, she shouldn’t get any of this money. But I’m afraid she might see it as she was on the deed at the time of the hurricane, so she was an owner and should get a share.

What are the legal ramifications of Chase not filing the deed in 2004? Legally, could my ex be entitled to a share of the grant proceeds since she was technically still an owner at the time of the storm?

Could Chase be held responsible since it was their mistake in not filing the deed? I’m not looking for the deep pockets here, but if I’m injured due to their mistake, do they not have some culpability here and a duty to make me whole?
 
M

mistoffolees

Senior Member
2Mistakes said:
OK, this is where it stands right now.

I mailed my written request to Chase for them to send me the original deed signed in 2004 that was never filed.

I called the rep at the MDA. She is so wonderfully nice! :D Anyways, I explained everything to her about how a deed was signed prior to Katrina, but that Chase failed to have it recorded. I also told her that there was no way my ex was going to sign the waiver.

The MDA rep told me that I need to get that 2004 deed from Chase, which I am doing. Then she said I need to have it recorded at the courthouse. She says that it won't be a problem even though it's from 2004. Then she said that I need to have someone at Chase sign a statement saying that basically they screwed up in not filing the 2004 deed at the courthouse, and that said deed has been sitting in their file since that time. I don't quite know how that's going to work, but I'm not going to rock the boat with Chase until I have the 2004 deed in hand. Then I will call them about signing the statement.

While I was on the phone with the MDA rep, my wife's phone rang. It was my ex-wife calling my wife. My wife answered, and my ex told my wife that she will think about signing the waiver. She told my wife to email to her, and she will look at it tonight and decide whether she will sign it or not. BUT, she absolutely will not send anyone a photocopy of her driver's license. The letter from the MDA says that the waiver has to be signed by my ex-wife, notarized, and she has to attach a copy of her DL. This is so they know it isn't forged. But I agree with my ex. I don't think I would be comfortable sending a copy of my DL, either.

So, my wife then called our MDA rep back and explained to her that my ex MIGHT sign the waiver and have it notarized, but she will NOT send a copy of her DL. The MDA rep sent my wife a statment for my wife to send to my ex. It is a statement for the notary that my ex signs the waiver in front to sign stating that she actually saw my ex's DL. So my wife called my ex back, ex didn't answer, so wife left a voicemail explaining that if she has the notary attest that the notary saw my ex's DL, my ex doesn't have to send a copy of her DL.

So, hopefully my ex will sign the waiver, have it notarized, and have the notary sign the statement that he/she saw my ex’s DL. That will be the easiest way to end this whole thing.

The thing I’m worried about is my ex seeing $$ when she reads the waiver. She is waiving all interest in any proceeds from the grant. I could see her saying, “Give me $X and I’ll sign it.”

But she is NOT entitled to ANY of this grant money. She moved out of this house in Oct. 2003. We divorced in Jan. 2004, and in Dec. 2004, her name was removed from the mortgage and she was paid $15,000 for her equity in this house. At that point, she was done with this house.

When Katrina hit, I did not have flood insurance. Insurance paid $0 for my loss. My wife and I had to cash out our retirement accounts, and we spent $60,000 repairing this house, not to mention the blood, sweat, and tears. We did 80% of the repairs ourselves. We taught ourselves how to hang and finish drywall, we replaced all the floors, we painted the whole house. We used contractors when we absolutely had to, but we did almost all of the labor ourselves. I’m sorry, but my ex is not getting one red cent of this money. The point of this grant is to reimburse my wife and I for our uninsured losses.

I am really hoping that if this (God forbid) were to have to go to court, a judge would see that my ex is not entitled to this money. That he would see that the lender made an error by not filing the deed from 2004, but my ex was paid her equity, and anything that has happened with this house after that point has nothing to do with her.

I’m still unsure what I would file and in what court, though. But I’m REALLY hoping that this won’t come to that. I am really holding out hope that my ex will do what is morally right and sign the waiver. She knows that morally, she shouldn’t get any of this money. But I’m afraid she might see it as she was on the deed at the time of the hurricane, so she was an owner and should get a share.

What are the legal ramifications of Chase not filing the deed in 2004? Legally, could my ex be entitled to a share of the grant proceeds since she was technically still an owner at the time of the storm?

Could Chase be held responsible since it was their mistake in not filing the deed? I’m not looking for the deep pockets here, but if I’m injured due to their mistake, do they not have some culpability here and a duty to make me whole?
Click to expand...
1. Can you prove that you paid her $15 K?
2. Was that payment and her surrender of the house exactly as spelled out in your divorce decree?

If so, you should be OK. It is generally understood that if the court orders something in a divorce that the parties have to do the appropriate paperwork to make it happen.

As for Chase, in principle, you might be able to sue them for negligence, but how do you prove it? How do you know, for example, that they didn't sent the paperwork in and the court house lost it (I've seen it happen)? If you can prove that they were negligent, you might be able to collect, but they have an army of lawyers, so don't expect it to be cheap or easy. Go with the first route.
 
2

2Mistakes

Senior Member
nextwife said:
Have you checked with the local closing agent/ title company that handled the refi closing?
Click to expand...
The refi closing occured at my house. Chase contracts people to handle the closings. I do not know who that was, and unfortunately, all of the documents I had relating to the refi were lost in the storm.

I know that somehow, someway a local atty or title co. had to be involved. The woman who came to the house was really just a notary. My ex and I signed everything we needed to sign, this woman notarized everything, and my ex-wife was given a check from Chase for $15,000 for her equity.

Maybe I need to go to courthouse and look at everything that was filed in relation to this refi. I can pull up some records online, and I'm seeing that 1/11/2005, a new Deed of Trust was filed. Maybe there would be an atty name/name of a title co. on that somewhere. I can't see the actual document online. I will have to go to the courthouse for that.
 
N

nextwife

Senior Member
2Mistakes said:
The refi closing occured at my house. Chase contracts people to handle the closings. I do not know who that was, and unfortunately, all of the documents I had relating to the refi were lost in the storm.

I know that somehow, someway a local atty or title co. had to be involved. The woman who came to the house was really just a notary. My ex and I signed everything we needed to sign, this woman notarized everything, and my ex-wife was given a check from Chase for $15,000 for her equity.

Maybe I need to go to courthouse and look at everything that was filed in relation to this refi. I can pull up some records online, and I'm seeing that 1/11/2005, a new Deed of Trust was filed. Maybe there would be an atty name/name of a title co. on that somewhere. I can't see the actual document online. I will have to go to the courthouse for that.
Click to expand...
Very smart. Obtain copies of all the docs. The local title companies will probably know who the closer is. Additionally, there is often a title company case/file number referenced on the docs somehwere. Chase should also know who the title company was, as their loan was "insured" as to priority by that title company.
 
2

2Mistakes

Senior Member
mistoffolees said:
1. Can you prove that you paid her $15 K?
Click to expand...
I think so. The check was made out from Chase to my ex-wife. I no longer have a copy of the check b/c it was lost in the hurricane, but I would assume Chase would still have a copy of it.

2. Was that payment and her surrender of the house exactly as spelled out in your divorce decree?
Click to expand...
Yes. The divorce judgment reads as follows: "By agreement of the parties, the Husband shall be and hereby is awarded the exclusive use, possession, and ownership of the marital home located at (ADDRESS). Before January 1, 2005, the Husband shall refinance the home, removing Wife's name from said Deed of Trust. Upon refinancing said home, Wife shall be awarded 50% of the equity in said home as of the date of Divorce Judgment herein. Upon payment od said equity to Wife, Wife shall execute a quitclaim deed to said real property conveying all her right, title, and interest in said property to Husband."

That was followed to a T.

If so, you should be OK. It is generally understood that if the court orders something in a divorce that the parties have to do the appropriate paperwork to make it happen.

As for Chase, in principle, you might be able to sue them for negligence, but how do you prove it? How do you know, for example, that they didn't sent the paperwork in and the court house lost it (I've seen it happen)? If you can prove that they were negligent, you might be able to collect, but they have an army of lawyers, so don't expect it to be cheap or easy. Go with the first route.
Click to expand...
I don't even want to sue Chase. I don't need that headache. I just want whatever needs to be done in order for me to receive the rest of the grant. I am ticked with Chase right now, b/c you can not imagine the massive headache I have right now from this, and had they just done what they were supposed to do (file the damn 2004 quitclaim deed) none of this would be going on.

I have sent the request to Chase for them to mail me the original 2004 quitclaim deed. They have told me that the original is still in their file, which proves they never sent it to the court for recording. But again, I'm not rocking the boat with Chase until I have that original 2004 quitclaim deed in my hands.

And as long as I am able to finish this with the MDA and get the balance of the grant proceeds, I have no intention of anything with Chase. I guess I'm just looking ahead at the worst-case scenario of if I lose money because of their mistake in not filing the 2004 quitclaim deed, do I have recourse against them?
 
LdiJ

LdiJ

Senior Member
2Mistakes said:
I think so. The check was made out from Chase to my ex-wife. I no longer have a copy of the check b/c it was lost in the hurricane, but I would assume Chase would still have a copy of it.



Yes. The divorce judgment reads as follows: "By agreement of the parties, the Husband shall be and hereby is awarded the exclusive use, possession, and ownership of the marital home located at (ADDRESS). Before January 1, 2005, the Husband shall refinance the home, removing Wife's name from said Deed of Trust. Upon refinancing said home, Wife shall be awarded 50% of the equity in said home as of the date of Divorce Judgment herein. Upon payment od said equity to Wife, Wife shall execute a quitclaim deed to said real property conveying all her right, title, and interest in said property to Husband."

That was followed to a T.



I don't even want to sue Chase. I don't need that headache. I just want whatever needs to be done in order for me to receive the rest of the grant. I am ticked with Chase right now, b/c you can not imagine the massive headache I have right now from this, and had they just done what they were supposed to do (file the damn 2004 quitclaim deed) none of this would be going on.

I have sent the request to Chase for them to mail me the original 2004 quitclaim deed. They have told me that the original is still in their file, which proves they never sent it to the court for recording. But again, I'm not rocking the boat with Chase until I have that original 2004 quitclaim deed in my hands.

And as long as I am able to finish this with the MDA and get the balance of the grant proceeds, I have no intention of anything with Chase. I guess I'm just looking ahead at the worst-case scenario of if I lose money because of their mistake in not filing the 2004 quitclaim deed, do I have recourse against them?
Click to expand...
No, because you still can drag the ex into court to try to get her ordered to sign the waiver. If that doesn't fly, THEN you might have recourse against Chase.
 
2

2Mistakes

Senior Member
LdiJ said:
No, because you still can drag the ex into court to try to get her ordered to sign the waiver. If that doesn't fly, THEN you might have recourse against Chase.
Click to expand...
That was kind of what I figured. Which is fine. I don't want any legal dealings with Chase. They are a big co. and would eat me for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. LOL

I spoke to the MDA rep again, and she said that if we could get a court order stating that my ex isn't entitled to any of the grant proceeds, that would work as well.

I'm thinking that would be an easier order to get than to try and get an order for her to sign the waiver and then actually have her sign it.

I still have no clue of what I would need to file and in what court, if it comes to that. Any ideas of what type of action this is? The MDA rep mentioned a modification of the original divorce judgment, but the divorce happened pre-Katrina. At the time of the divorce, we couldn't have known that Katrina was going to happen. So could a judge go back and modify a judgment when no one could have known at the time of the judgment that something was going to happen in the future?

OMG, is this even making any sense?!?!

I am going to keep hoping that my ex will do the right thing and sign the flipping waiver. That would put this whole thing to rest.

My wife wants me to offer my ex $1000 of the grant money in exchange for my ex signing the waiver. I may just have to do that. But I'm sorry, it's BS. She was done with this house when she got her $15,000 equity, and I just don't feel that she should get even a penny of the grant money.
 
T

tuffbrk

Senior Member
Just as an FYI about your comments on the mortgage company - they do not record releases or quit claims in MO. That was the responsibility of your settlement agent. Thus, if you're looking for recourse, that is the party with whom you need to enter into discussions....
 
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