17 year old - Questioned & DNA Taken (?)

What is the name of your state? California

I'm seeking some advice or knowledge from a person with experience on the below listed situation.

My son's bestfriend lives 2 hours east of us (same state).

1. He got into a fight at his school with a member of a known gang and was suspended from school for a week.
2. The next day someone from that gang supposedly was killed.
3. The cops came to his home and raided his house and took his DNA. They also questioned him and his other friend and took his friends DNA without that child's parent in attendance. They never read these boys their "rights". The cops made the boys hold up papers with their name and stats on them while the cops took their pictures (like mug shots you see of criminals).
4. The cops told this boys mother that they thought her son had something to do with the killing.

This all took place almost 4 weeks ago and they haven't heard anything from the police since then. The mother did call to find out what was going on and they wouldn't tell her anything except that they think her son knows more than he's telling and they alluded to him witnessing who killed that other person and that she should talk to her son and get it out of him. That was it.

When it was time for the boy to return to school, his mother called because she was thinking of changing his schools (because of all the issues) and the school told her that he was no longer welcomed back at their school and that the cops had been there and filled the school in on everything regarding her son.

I'm curious about a few things. First of all, the boy has now come to live with us and is now attending school with my son.

Can the police do all of those things without ever reading this young man his 'rights' and does this now mean he has a criminal record .. because that is what his mom is telling him. They never took his finger prints or booked him or even took him into the station. Everything they did was done in his home. They still have his shoes that they took.

Personally, I think they know he had nothing to do with it but they think he witnessed it and can ID the person who did do it. The young man is 17 by the way and has sworn to me that he had nothing to do with anything that happened. The kid he got in the fight with was a 17 year old classmate and the cops told his mom that a 17 year old was killed the next day but the only thing in the papers was about a 39 year old man being killed in that same area on that same night in question.

For the record, I firmly believe that this young man had nothing to do with it. But regardless I want to know what an expert thinks about the situation and how it has all played out.

I have no clue of what his rights are or what he should be expecting to happen in the future regarding this whole thing. For now, we're focused on him staying with us - getting his grades up - doing positive things and being around positive people. But it feels like there's a huge elephant in the room that we are ignoring but really shouldn't be.

Also - Can a public school just make the choice on their own that this boy can not return even though he was just suspended for the fight and he served his time? What happened to innocent until proven guilty? I don't care that he can't go back to that school - it was a crappy school to begin with and he's already doing better at the school here in our town but I find it alarming that a school can take the word of the police regarding the credibility of this young man without any just cause. The normal punishment at that school for being in a fight is to be suspended. He was and when he wants to come back, they up and decide "sorry, you can't come back now because the police came and told us you're trouble". I really do not "get it" at all.

I only skimmed your post 'cause it's late and I don't feel like reading a whole lot, but I did notice a misconception that you are intent on believing, so I shall correct it: being read your rights (I'm assuming you are referring to Miranda rights, which you may wish to Google) is only required AFTER arrest and PRIOR to interrogation. If rights are not read, all that means is that any statements made can be dismissed from court (what this boils down to is if they were arrested and then admitted to committing the crime, their admission could not be used against them in court if their rights were not read to them). I'm guessing no self-incriminating statements were made, so Miranda rights are not an issue.

Thank you for your response. Just to be clear - I am not intent on believing anything. I am open to all suggestions, advice, information etc. which is why I'm posting here because clearly I do not know anything regarding this type of situation.

I just thought, and I now realize I was wrong, that if the police start to question you and take your DNA, shoes and make you take a 'mug shot' type photo in your home - that they would need to read you some sort of rights before doing so. I'm guessing this means that anything these boys said can not be used against them since they were never arrested and never read their rights so the police were just asking to ask and nothing more.

We do not know what the police are trying to do in this case - get information out of the boys by scaring them into thinking they are suspects or what.

Thanks again for your response.

As for the school part, if the school believes that the student was part of a murder investigation, and therefore a possible murderer, and therefore a danger to other students, they might be able to stop him from returning. I don't think it is an expulsion, but that depends on the organization of the school, which varies from state to state.

2ndMom said:

Can the police do all of those things without ever reading this young man his 'rights' and does this now mean he has a criminal record .. because that is what his mom is telling him. They never took his finger prints or booked him or even took him into the station. Everything they did was done in his home. They still have his shoes that they took.

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Are any of the suspects on probation or parole? if so, they can enter and search with no real cause. Otherwise, I would presume they had a search warrant.

My experience with gangs is that most are on some form of supervised release.

Miranda is only required when someone is in custody or restrained with force equivalent to an arrest (such as in handcuffs) and they are being interrogated. If there was any potential Miranda the defense can raise this at a hearing to suppress any incriminating statements made.

Personally, I think they know he had nothing to do with it but they think he witnessed it and can ID the person who did do it. The young man is 17 by the way and has sworn to me that he had nothing to do with anything that happened.

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He may not have had anything to DO with it, but that does NOT mean he does not know what happened.

Also - Can a public school just make the choice on their own that this boy can not return even though he was just suspended for the fight and he served his time?

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The school operates under its own rules. There is a procedure in place for the child and his guardians to appeal any discipline. The appeal can be done through the school administration and/or at the district level.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty? I don't care that he can't go back to that school - it was a crappy school to begin with and he's already doing better at the school here in our town but I find it alarming that a school can take the word of the police regarding the credibility of this young man without any just cause.

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The school has an obligation to see to the safety of its students, and the law gives them a LOT of leeway in this regard. They can choose not to believe the police, and they can choose to actually believe them. It's up to the school. As I said, he can appeal this decision. But, I will guess that until the matter is resolved, they are going to err on the side of caution.

It sounds like your son's best friend may be hooked up with a local gang ... be careful that retaliation does not come your way.

- Carl