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G

gdprint

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? oregon

My child is 14 and a freshman in high school... She has had an ongoing conflict with a girl who is now 16 and a sophomore in the same school... Both girls have played a part in this conflict... When I became aware of it about a year and a half ago I intercepted a phone call from the other girl in hopes of helping them find resolution... I am NOT one of those moms who thinks their child does no wrong... I acknowledge that it takes 2 to tango... When I attempted to talk to her she responded by calling me a b*tch... I then felt the next step was to go to her mom, which I did...my husband and I went over there... She was outside waiting for me but not eager to talk... i told her i felt we should help the girls find resolution and that my concern was that it would escalate into physical altercation and that someone would get hurt... Her response to me was "well, it won't be my child"... Now we did agree that neither of our girls would be calling the other... but she wasn't willing to help resolve it... BAD rumors continued against my daughter and I knew mine was getting more and more upset... because at the time they went to different schools, I hoped it would go away... well, my daughter started high school this year, the same school as the other girl... From the get go the name calling began and she was giving my daughter 'shoulder checks' in the hallways... my concern grew and I informed the asst. principal that there was an ongoing problem... my daughter thought talking to the other girl would make it worse... my feeling was the opposite... the school chose to listen to my daughter and didn't do anything preventative... I also spoke with the school counselor and he chose to do nothing either.. he told me to have my daughter come to him if it didn't stop... she set an appt. with him and he never got back to her... that is typical in a large public high school...

Well, it got worse and they got in a fight... The other girl got the worse end of it... I feel bad for them both.. it was a bad fight... well, my daughter was suspended for 5 days and the other girl for only 1 as far as I know (because my daughter swung first)... the campus cop proceeded to question my daughter in an intimidating way... my husband asked "is my daughter in any real trouble here?" The officer replied with a 'NO' and my husband said "the school can handle it from here then"...

That week (during her suspension) the campus cop called us accusing our daughter of stealing a cel phone (the phone was stolen during her suspension)... We felt he was harassing us and we went to the school the next day to speak to the principal... considering our daughter was suspended during the theft, how could she have stolen it? Ironically, the phone was recovered from another student WHILE WE WERE IN THE OFFICE... The police guy apologized to us and said he jumped the gun...

My daughter goes back to school... no further incidences in school but the girls ran into eachother 2x outside of school at the mall... the first time they called eachother a name and went in opposite directions... I sternly warned my daughter there will BE NO MORE PHYSICAL AGGRESSION... The 2nd meeting occured last week... My daughter called me from the store to pick her up... the girl and her mom were following my daughter and her friend around the store making snide comments... of course at least one point a name exchange happened... she called us to come pick her up, considerably upset about it, feeling harrassed... we went home... 2 days later we receive a call from the school... An officer was there to serve my daughter a stalking order...
In the stalking order the mom claims that my daughter followed them around taunting them and also refers to my daughter 'BEING ARRESTED AND CHARGED WITH ASSAULT 4 AND DISORDERLY CONDUCT' from the fight 2 weeks ago... she also stated that the school personnel told her that my daughter has had at least another conflict...

This was the FIRST TIME I HAD BEEN AWARE OF ANY ARREST... as far as we knew, my daughter wasn't in any real trouble... The officer said he thought he told us she was being arrested and released into our custody... the principal couldn't remember if we were told... we tried to obtain her 'arrest' record and they couldn't release it because she hadn't been formally charged but that it was sent to a supervisor just this day! So the other woman knew more about my child than I did...

Now I cannot let my daughter go back to school as the stalking order says she cannot be in visual contact with the other girl... the school says they will be careful to not jump the gun if any reports are made... but the other girl only needs one witness to say my daughter even glared at her... ugh! As of now, I have pulled her out as to not risk another 'arrest' or $20,000 fine...

my concerns:
1.We were not notified she was being arrested... therefore we did not take EXTRA precautions to make sure she wasn't anywhere unsupervised. (we did explain to her that it WAS OVER AND NO MORE ACTION WOULD BE TAKEN PERIOD or serious discipline by us) and she obeyed us...
2. harassment about he stolen cel phone from school during the week she was suspended .
3. now a stalking order against her when it was based on a lie... I feel this will make it worse WHEN and IF we ever get contacted by a juvenile 'counselor'????
4. Doesn't she have rights? Shouldn't she have been clearly told she was being arrested? Shouldn't a probation or juvy counselor have contacted us by now? (altercation happened on Oct. 14.)
5. Should the school be held accountable at all for not being preventative after multiple attempts at communication of my concerns?

Do I need legal counsel??
Should I file a stalking order against her as she feels she was stalked in the store?
Do I have any basis to file charges against the school for neglect, harassment, and/or discrimination?

Sorry so long... Need to take action soon but don't know where to turn first... Of course I don't have $175/hr. for an attorney... :(
 


H

HomeGuru

Senior Member
gdprint said:
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? oregon

My child is 14 and a freshman in high school... She has had an ongoing conflict with a girl who is now 16 and a sophomore in the same school... Both girls have played a part in this conflict... When I became aware of it about a year and a half ago I intercepted a phone call from the other girl in hopes of helping them find resolution... I am NOT one of those moms who thinks their child does no wrong... I acknowledge that it takes 2 to tango... When I attempted to talk to her she responded by calling me a b*tch... I then felt the next step was to go to her mom, which I did...my husband and I went over there... She was outside waiting for me but not eager to talk... i told her i felt we should help the girls find resolution and that my concern was that it would escalate into physical altercation and that someone would get hurt... Her response to me was "well, it won't be my child"... Now we did agree that neither of our girls would be calling the other... but she wasn't willing to help resolve it... BAD rumors continued against my daughter and I knew mine was getting more and more upset... because at the time they went to different schools, I hoped it would go away... well, my daughter started high school this year, the same school as the other girl... From the get go the name calling began and she was giving my daughter 'shoulder checks' in the hallways... my concern grew and I informed the asst. principal that there was an ongoing problem... my daughter thought talking to the other girl would make it worse... my feeling was the opposite... the school chose to listen to my daughter and didn't do anything preventative... I also spoke with the school counselor and he chose to do nothing either.. he told me to have my daughter come to him if it didn't stop... she set an appt. with him and he never got back to her... that is typical in a large public high school...

Well, it got worse and they got in a fight... The other girl got the worse end of it... I feel bad for them both.. it was a bad fight... well, my daughter was suspended for 5 days and the other girl for only 1 as far as I know (because my daughter swung first)... the campus cop proceeded to question my daughter in an intimidating way... my husband asked "is my daughter in any real trouble here?" The officer replied with a 'NO' and my husband said "the school can handle it from here then"...

That week (during her suspension) the campus cop called us accusing our daughter of stealing a cel phone (the phone was stolen during her suspension)... We felt he was harassing us and we went to the school the next day to speak to the principal... considering our daughter was suspended during the theft, how could she have stolen it? Ironically, the phone was recovered from another student WHILE WE WERE IN THE OFFICE... The police guy apologized to us and said he jumped the gun...

My daughter goes back to school... no further incidences in school but the girls ran into eachother 2x outside of school at the mall... the first time they called eachother a name and went in opposite directions... I sternly warned my daughter there will BE NO MORE PHYSICAL AGGRESSION... The 2nd meeting occured last week... My daughter called me from the store to pick her up... the girl and her mom were following my daughter and her friend around the store making snide comments... of course at least one point a name exchange happened... she called us to come pick her up, considerably upset about it, feeling harrassed... we went home... 2 days later we receive a call from the school... An officer was there to serve my daughter a stalking order...
In the stalking order the mom claims that my daughter followed them around taunting them and also refers to my daughter 'BEING ARRESTED AND CHARGED WITH ASSAULT 4 AND DISORDERLY CONDUCT' from the fight 2 weeks ago... she also stated that the school personnel told her that my daughter has had at least another conflict...

This was the FIRST TIME I HAD BEEN AWARE OF ANY ARREST... as far as we knew, my daughter wasn't in any real trouble... The officer said he thought he told us she was being arrested and released into our custody... the principal couldn't remember if we were told... we tried to obtain her 'arrest' record and they couldn't release it because she hadn't been formally charged but that it was sent to a supervisor just this day! So the other woman knew more about my child than I did...

Now I cannot let my daughter go back to school as the stalking order says she cannot be in visual contact with the other girl... the school says they will be careful to not jump the gun if any reports are made... but the other girl only needs one witness to say my daughter even glared at her... ugh! As of now, I have pulled her out as to not risk another 'arrest' or $20,000 fine...

my concerns:
1.We were not notified she was being arrested... therefore we did not take EXTRA precautions to make sure she wasn't anywhere unsupervised. (we did explain to her that it WAS OVER AND NO MORE ACTION WOULD BE TAKEN PERIOD or serious discipline by us) and she obeyed us...
2. harassment about he stolen cel phone from school during the week she was suspended .
3. now a stalking order against her when it was based on a lie... I feel this will make it worse WHEN and IF we ever get contacted by a juvenile 'counselor'????
4. Doesn't she have rights? Shouldn't she have been clearly told she was being arrested? Shouldn't a probation or juvy counselor have contacted us by now? (altercation happened on Oct. 14.)
5. Should the school be held accountable at all for not being preventative after multiple attempts at communication of my concerns?

Do I need legal counsel??
Should I file a stalking order against her as she feels she was stalked in the store?
Do I have any basis to file charges against the school for neglect, harassment, and/or discrimination?

Sorry so long... Need to take action soon but don't know where to turn first... Of course I don't have $175/hr. for an attorney... :(
Click to expand...
**A: then find a $165/hr attorney.
 
S

stmfitr636

Member
No legal advice but some first hand "insight" as requested:

Your daughter will continue to have fights with this girl... to the point that she will be obsessed with it. Her grades will take a nose dive and after many suspensions, she will eventually be expelled for good, either by her failing grades or multiple fights.

You will then drive her a half hour out of your way, twice a day, to a school of choice where she will eventually find trouble or trouble will find her (as in friends of other girl). There will be more fighting and more suspensions and lack of education... costing her admission to college of choice, at the very least.

Your daughter will probably get a part time job that she loves until the girl finds out where she works... then that will be short lived when the girl call the manager and complains. Your daughter will lose her job.

But your daughter will find another job and enjoy it more than the first. Then the girl will find out where, get a job there herself and then your daughter will be fired again based on information from the girl. True or not, your daughter will be out of work... again.

She'll find work again and will enjoy it. Only it will be less pay and 45 mins out of town so to avoid the girl. Then the girl will have a cousin that comes to work at the same place. And there will be more drama and your daughter will recieve another work reprimand... only this time a weeks suspension and a warning that another incident will cost her her job.

Oh wait... that's not your kid I'm talking about. It's my gf's. A bit of "insight" nonetheless.
 
O

Ozark_Sophist

Senior Member
The order was likely based on the facts presented by the other girl and girl's mother. There should be a hearing on the order during which your daughter's side may be heard.

Protective orders have gotten out of hand nationwide. It is really an effective tool when it is needed, but the process is broken. The petitioner can put anything on the form that goes before the judge who can then grant a temporary order based only on the information provided by one side. The system sets aside the rights of the respondent until the hearing.

A lawyer would be a benefit here as s/he would have knowledge of your local courts to faciliate the process in a more timely manner. Your daughter should not have her rights to an education impaired without due process.
 
H

HomeGuru

Senior Member
stmfitr636 said:
No legal advice but some first hand "insight" as requested:

Your daughter will continue to have fights with this girl... to the point that she will be obsessed with it. Her grades will take a nose dive and after many suspensions, she will eventually be expelled for good, either by her failing grades or multiple fights.

You will then drive her a half hour out of your way, twice a day, to a school of choice where she will eventually find trouble or trouble will find her (as in friends of other girl). There will be more fighting and more suspensions and lack of education... costing her admission to college of choice, at the very least.

Your daughter will probably get a part time job that she loves until the girl finds out where she works... then that will be short lived when the girl call the manager and complains. Your daughter will lose her job.

But your daughter will find another job and enjoy it more than the first. Then the girl will find out where, get a job there herself and then your daughter will be fired again based on information from the girl. True or not, your daughter will be out of work... again.

She'll find work again and will enjoy it. Only it will be less pay and 45 mins out of town so to avoid the girl. Then the girl will have a cousin that comes to work at the same place. And there will be more drama and your daughter will recieve another work reprimand... only this time a weeks suspension and a warning that another incident will cost her her job.

Oh wait... that's not your kid I'm talking about. It's my gf's. A bit of "insight" nonetheless.
Click to expand...
**A: now that's good stuff.
 
Indiana Filer

Indiana Filer

Senior Member
Well, it got worse and they got in a fight... The other girl got the worse end of it... I feel bad for them both.. it was a bad fight... well, my daughter was suspended for 5 days and the other girl for only 1 as far as I know (because my daughter swung first)...
Click to expand...
Since the OP's daughter hit the other child first in the physical fight, in my experience as a juvenile probation officer, I think it was justified for the OP's daughter to be charged with Assault and Disorderly Conduct. The person who hits first is the aggressor.

I recommend an attorney, and I'd also look for placement of the daughter at an alternative or private school.
 
G

gdprint

Junior Member
Indiana Filer said:
Since the OP's daughter hit the other child first in the physical fight, in my experience as a juvenile probation officer, I think it was justified for the OP's daughter to be charged with Assault and Disorderly Conduct. The person who hits first is the aggressor.

I recommend an attorney, and I'd also look for placement of the daughter at an alternative or private school.
Click to expand...
This is the problem with the system... Where are the charges for verbal, emotional, and mental abuse on my daughter? I tried to intervene... If we, as adults, cannot help the children find ways of resolving conflict, then we have a harsh world ahead of us... My concern??? The other parent has not and is not willing to find resolution... Then or Now... Our problem with the juvenile system and those that enforce it is that it is strictly disciplinary on the final act of the conflict, not the ongoing torment that led to it... This is why kids take things into their own hands... :(

From a private school we came and to a charter/alternative school we return...

We went to the juvenile detention center today to look for some answers... She was just assigned a counselor today... Interesting... He was very receptive and glad to see us... I have to say that I DON'T have much faith in the system but he agreed this seemed extreme and gave us some sort of hope even if she's formerly charged... Typically there is SOME room for the kids to act out... This WASN'T a violent crime... although some of you don't care to READ my novel, there IS alot to the story that does add to the issues at hand... I HAVE TO BELIEVE that we will be HEARD...

I wonder - -- do some of you say I need an attorney because the school dropped the ball??? I would assume if she gets formerly charged she will be given a court appointed attorney???

And in response (since I don't want to keep quoting everyone individually) to finding an attorney for $165/hr. - Thanks for the GREAT advice... So helpful some of you are... As a small business owner, barely staying afloat, I don't have THAT either right now... I am NOT Joe the Plumber barely making over a 1/4 of a million and I am certainly not carrying the earnings of many of the attorneys who are living high on the hog and can afford to make smart ass remarks to a parent obviously in distress...

thanks to the respectful replies though... I AM listening... And whether I have the money this minute or not, I will obviously make sure she is in the best hands I can get her... Where there is a will, there is a way... PRO BONO ANYONE??? :)

My intentions are to
1. Make sure she doesn't have a record that follows her or gets her into more trouble and
2. To help these kids find some sort of way to deal with issues like this... I can only HOPE they make the girls go through mediation!!!! Perhaps they can bring the boy in that antagonizes them both! I have compassion for the level of naivety teen girls have in regards to boys... You can talk til you're blue in the face and they still think the pimply faced boys really care about them... :(
 
Last edited:
G

gdprint

Junior Member
stmfitr636 said:
No legal advice but some first hand "insight" as requested:

Your daughter will continue to have fights with this girl... to the point that she will be obsessed with it. Her grades will take a nose dive and after many suspensions, she will eventually be expelled for good, either by her failing grades or multiple fights.

You will then drive her a half hour out of your way, twice a day, to a school of choice where she will eventually find trouble or trouble will find her (as in friends of other girl). There will be more fighting and more suspensions and lack of education... costing her admission to college of choice, at the very least.

Your daughter will probably get a part time job that she loves until the girl finds out where she works... then that will be short lived when the girl call the manager and complains. Your daughter will lose her job.

But your daughter will find another job and enjoy it more than the first. Then the girl will find out where, get a job there herself and then your daughter will be fired again based on information from the girl. True or not, your daughter will be out of work... again.

She'll find work again and will enjoy it. Only it will be less pay and 45 mins out of town so to avoid the girl. Then the girl will have a cousin that comes to work at the same place. And there will be more drama and your daughter will recieve another work reprimand... only this time a weeks suspension and a warning that another incident will cost her her job.

Oh wait... that's not your kid I'm talking about. It's my gf's. A bit of "insight" nonetheless.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the cheery insight... Abit of optimism is always good for the spirit... Its interesting that this is probably as common as you make it sound and as a society we still haven't found a solution... I feel sad for the kids... You are right, though, I'll go back to driving my daughter to and from school just like I did for 7 years... The problems didn't begin until entering the public school system.... I suppose if she was totally conforming and didn't think for herself, she'd be getting along just fine**************....
 
D

Distressed Mom

Junior Member
gdprint said:
My intentions are to
1. Make sure she doesn't have a record that follows her or gets her into more trouble and
2. To help these kids find some sort of way to deal with issues like this... I can only HOPE they make the girls go through mediation!!!! Perhaps they can bring the boy in that antagonizes them both! I have compassion for the level of naivety teen girls have in regards to boys... You can talk til you're blue in the face and they still think the pimply faced boys really care about them... :(
Click to expand...
Just a little friendly advice. A parent (or anyone else for that matter) cannot change or control someone else's kid. Nor can you rely on someone else to resolve this matter between these two girls. Focus on your daughter. Teach her how to resolve conflicts as you would or have in the past. Keep a close eye on her and whom she chooses as friends. Personally, I wouldn't let her go to the mall unsupervised since she is only 14. Set many boundaries and stick to them. Try not to tell her what she is doing wrong. She won't listen. Tell her what to do right.
Hopes this helps. I've been there.
 
stealth2

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
gdprint said:
I wonder - -- do some of you say I need an attorney because the school dropped the ball??? I would assume if she gets formerly charged she will be given a court appointed attorney???

<snip>

My intentions are to
1. Make sure she doesn't have a record that follows her or gets her into more trouble and
Click to expand...
The bolded is why your daughter needs an attorney.

gdprint said:
I suppose if she was totally conforming and didn't think for herself, she'd be getting along just fine
Click to expand...
Gee... so you think all kids in public schools are sheep, with no minds of their own? Nice. And totally wrong. You obviously don't know a lot of public HSers. Funny, though... most of the free-thinking kids I know from our local HS aren't getting arrested or having POs taken out against them, as opposed to your hot-housed, special angel. :rolleyes:
 
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