Pot pipe problem

CALIFORNIA
My son is 16 and in high school. On 12/3 in class a teacher noticed he had something in his hand and asked to see it. It was a smal,l empty, aluminum tube about 2 inches long made to smoke pot with, that a friend of his had just handed him. He was suspended for 5 days for having it. My wife was told that my son, with a parent, must attend a meeting on 12/12 and that he will be given a drug test. She was told that if he tests positive for anything he will be expelled.
In 2002 when he was 10 years old, his best friend gave him a "titty-twister" so my son "slapped him upside the head" in fun, and was sent to the office for it. On 2/1/07 he was sent to the office for sticking gum on the water machine. On 10/8/08 he was suspended for blowing up a condom in class and refusing to pick it up off of the floor, stating that he did not do it. On 10/21/08 he was suspended for writing the word "Gage" in the boys restroom with a felt marker.
I am sure he has smoked pot and I am sure that he dose not use any other kinds of drugs or alcohol. He is sorry that this has happened and very much dose not want to be expelled. He is well liked and a kind, soft spoken, friendly person.
I am considering telling the school that I am making my son refuse to take the drug test.
Please advise

So, you're going to teach Junior that he has no responsibility for his behaviour? What are you going to do when he rapes and/or murders someone?

What on earth has happened to 'do the crime, do the time'?

KID GLOVES said:

CALIFORNIA
My son is 16 and in high school. On 12/3 in class a teacher noticed he had something in his hand and asked to see it. It was a smal,l empty, aluminum tube about 2 inches long made to smoke pot with, that a friend of his had just handed him. He was suspended for 5 days for having it. My wife was told that my son, with a parent, must attend a meeting on 12/12 and that he will be given a drug test. She was told that if he tests positive for anything he will be expelled.

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The meeting you are going to have on 12/12 is probably an expulsion hearing, where the school administration is going to decide whether or not your son gets expelled from school.

In 2002 when he was 10 years old, his best friend gave him a "titty-twister" so my son "slapped him upside the head" in fun, and was sent to the office for it.

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Not self defense, therefore this could be considered battery.

On 2/1/07 he was sent to the office for sticking gum on the water machine. On 10/8/08 he was suspended for blowing up a condom in class and refusing to pick it up off of the floor, stating that he did not do it. On 10/21/08 he was suspended for writing the word "Gage" in the boys restroom with a felt marker.

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Your son seems to have a problem with following the rules. At 16, he should know better than blowing up a condom in school. He should also know better than to commit vandalism.

I am sure he has smoked pot

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Does that concern you? It should.

and I am sure that he dose not use any other kinds of drugs or alcohol.

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He is already exhibiting delinquent behavior, so I wouldn't be surprised at other substance usage.

He is sorry that this has happened and very much dose not want to be expelled.

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Since he continues to violate school rules, I don't believe it.

He is well liked and a kind, soft spoken, friendly person.

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Those kids also commit crimes. I have had some of the most popular kids in school as probation clients.

I am considering telling the school that I am making my son refuse to take the drug test.

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Your choice, but if he doesn't take the test, I can pretty much guarantee they will expel him from school.

Please advise

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Stop making excuses for your son's behavior, and stop trying to minimize his bad behavior. Enroll your son in therapy so that he can learn to follow rules. Have him submit to the drug test, and then get him into IOP (substance abuse counseling).

Considering the drug test can read THC in the system from use as much as two weeks before the test, you should probably tell sonny to stop the crap... or he is going to be expelled.

Even if he is King of the Winter Carnival.

How the DEVIL can you be okay with a 16 year old kid that smokes pot and gets caught with a pipe in school?

Expulsion should be the LEAST of his worries. Drugs or para. INSIDE a school should be a separate set of criminal charges.

Let me see if I understand what's going on here.
Your 16 year old son has been suspended twice in the last two months. First for blowing up a condom which he then refused to pick up from the floor, then after returning to school, it only took one or two weeks for him to receive a second suspension for scribbling graffiti on a bathroom wall in the school.

He is now, facing expulsion, for having a controlled substance and/or paraphernalia on school property.

These are the recent stunts which he has actually been caught for. No telling what he's been able to get away with in this same time period.

But you want people to believe that aside from these minor acts of mischief,

He is well liked and a kind, soft spoken, friendly person.

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Hence, you will instruct your son not to submit to a drug test, as you don't want to take any chances with this drug screen coming up positive and tarnishing his well liked, kind, soft, friendly reputation,,,,,

Is this a fair assessment of the situation?

If so, I think you need to let your wife attend this meeting with the school. But only if she doesn't have any nose or tongue piercings and is able to cover all of her visible tattoos.

Man, this kid is one lucky duck! I bet, once he's expelled, Daddy won't make him go to alternative school or get a job, either. Lucky boy! Mine would have a leash so tight, he'd have trouble getting in the bathroom alone.

Completely pathetic parenting. No wonder the kid's this side of a delinquent.

stealth2 said:

Man, this kid is one lucky duck! I bet, once he's expelled, Daddy won't make him go to alternative school or get a job, either. Lucky boy! Mine would have a leash so tight, he'd have trouble getting in the bathroom alone.

Completely pathetic parenting. No wonder the kid's this side of a delinquent.

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But this kid is so perfect!!!! Everyone likes him!!!

Sure, he vandalizes, smokes pot and is staring down the barrel of an expulsion for having a pot not only on school grounds BUT DURING CLASS... but mom sees past all that to his golden heart and angel's wings.

I wonder what Johnny here would have to do for mom to realize he is on a very bad path.

KID GLOVES said:

CALIFORNIA
My son is 16 and in high school. On 12/3 in class a teacher noticed he had something in his hand and asked to see it. It was a smal,l empty, aluminum tube about 2 inches long made to smoke pot with, that a friend of his had just handed him. He was suspended for 5 days for having it.

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The police could have been notified as well ... fortunately for him, they were not.

Note that this friend handed him the foil pipe for a reason - to smoke dope. He did not hand it to him to throw away, he handed it to him so that it could be used.

My wife was told that my son, with a parent, must attend a meeting on 12/12 and that he will be given a drug test. She was told that if he tests positive for anything he will be expelled.

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That sounds reasonable. Given the late date, and assuming he has not been smoking any dope in the last three weeks, he may test negative.

In 2002 when he was 10 years old, his best friend gave him a "titty-twister" so my son "slapped him upside the head" in fun, and was sent to the office for it. On 2/1/07 he was sent to the office for sticking gum on the water machine. On 10/8/08 he was suspended for blowing up a condom in class and refusing to pick it up off of the floor, stating that he did not do it. On 10/21/08 he was suspended for writing the word "Gage" in the boys restroom with a felt marker.

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Okay ... so he has a mild history of discipline. Two incidents in October can be bad, and the marker incident could also have been reported as a crime.

I am sure he has smoked pot and I am sure that he dose not use any other kinds of drugs or alcohol.

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Unless you were condoning or permitting this activity, how do you "know" the answer to EITHER of those? You do not. You suspect he has not used other drugs or alcohol, but you can not know.

He is sorry that this has happened and very much dose not want to be expelled. He is well liked and a kind, soft spoken, friendly person.

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If he comes across as contrite and apologetic at the expulsion hearing, and mom and dad come in with an action plan to prevent this from happening again (how he will be punished at home, restricted and disciplined) then the school might go for a shorter suspension as opposed to the expulsion. But, this might depend on the rules in the district.

I am considering telling the school that I am making my son refuse to take the drug test. Please advise

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Yes, you can refuse. Expect him to be expelled if that is the case.

Now, if this had been MY son, the expulsion would be the LEAST of his worries because what would happen to him at home would be far worse than any expulsion ... heck, after the vandalism, he would have been subject to serious punishment! And Heaven help them if they ever get caught with drugs or paraphernalia.

- Carl

Legal answer:

The school can and probably will expel your son whatever the drug test results.

You as a parent can and should refuse to allow the drug test.

I do not see what the advantage would be, as you and the school bioth know son has used pot.

Do you really want it in sons government file that he tested for pot? No, depsite what the moralists think it will not help your son, nor will it save him from expulsion.

None of this distracts from the fact that son needs a major clue-slap up side of his head.

That's a valid point.

If he is going to drop dirty, there is no reason to have him take the test. The results will create a really large black mark on his record.

Of course, that means that alternative schooling is in his immediate future.

I wonder how much the OTHER druggies will like him?

Actually, the test CAN help him. Having been involved in these expulsion hearings as a member of school staff (the SRO), I know that cooperation and accepting responsibility CAN sway the school's decision making process. They can choose to require the student receive counseling for his drug use as a condition of his remaining in school (usually after a suspension period). Unless they are stuck in a mandatory expulsion situation based upon school or district policy, the school wants to see the child's situation improve.

Certainly, mom and dad can refuse the test. But, the expulsion can be accomplished by the possession of the pipe - they likely don't need the test to expel. And no mater the test result, the possession of the pipe will be in the school file and anyone who managed to find a way to legally review the school file would be able to reasonably infer the pot use anyway. A negative test would provide some measure of defense against that ... a record of NO test will infer guilt.

Plus, even the police rarely look into school disciplinary records in an employment background, and they are almost impossible to review in an investigation ... it can be far too difficult to obtain those records, so they don't try. So, as to who you think might view this disciplinary record years down the road, I could not say.

- Carl

CdwJava said:

So, as to who you think might view this disciplinary record years down the road, I could not say.

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I was not thinking in terms of a far of distant 'in your PERMANENT file' sense.

More that adding to a thick discipline file with a positive pee test (as it is admited kick would fail...) is not going to help place him in another school.

xylene said:

I was not thinking in terms of a far of distant 'in your PERMANENT file' sense.

More that adding to a thick discipline file with a positive pee test (as it is admited kick would fail...) is not going to help place him in another school.

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The expulsion won't help much, anyway. The positive test would simply be part of the expulsion package.

Besides, in any expulsion process, there is the school hearing and then there is an appeal process to the Superintendent's office. After that, any and all expulsions may be appealed to the school board as they have to approve of these expulsions ... depending on the size of the district it may be pretty routine and rubber stamped, but in smaller districts, they are taken up individually (and the district I worked in as an SRO had about 20,000 students).

The positive test is legally nil as there is no crime associated with it. The pipe really says it all. At this point, the parents need to take actions that they can to try and keep their child in school or find placement in an alternative program pending an appeal or pending new placement. It could be that he will be made to stay out of the mainstream schools until the next school year. But, again, it falls back on school and district policy.

- Carl

If he pees clean, it might help the parent's side of the story that "It was just handed to him, it wasn't his"

Go to your local drug store and purchase a home drug test kit. If he pees clean, go ahead and let him take the test. If he pees dirty, refuse it. (If you are that worried about the consequences of dirty pee, that is)

cracker said:

If he pees clean, it might help the parent's side of the story that "It was just handed to him, it wasn't his"

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And, of course, the expulsion hearing panel (and the appeals panel) is not required to believe this. Simply being in possession is sufficient to justify the disciplinary action - they do not have to show use at all.

And anyone who believes he did NOT know what it was for, and did NOT intend to either use ot or pass it on to someone else who wanted to use it is deluding themselves.


- Carl