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Can you steal from your own home?

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daytripper72

Junior Member
Michigan

Not sure where to put this, so here goes.

A friend of mine is involved in a messy divorce, whereas his wife was allowed to stay at the residence and he moved out. Still, his things were there and she would'nt let him have anything until the settlement. The settlement came and went, and she refused to give him his things per the court order.

So Saturday, we and five others go over to the residence (a house, which was owned by him and his wife) to get his things. She had changed the locks so we kicked the door in. Remember, this is his house, too. The house is in the process of being foreclosed upon and she had not physically lived there in months. The water has even been turned off.

To make matters more confusing, his mother-in-law had been staying there also some months prior and left a lot of her things there. She states it is her physical address but it is not, and the house will be foreclosed on any day. Yet she states her things were not abandoned.

So, in the process of moving his things, people are in a hurry and we are running around trying to grab everything in the court order, as well as some other community property type things that she had left but did not state she would get in the divorce. In the confusion, some of the mother-in-law's things were put into the truck. Guys were helping that had no knowledge of those who lived there, and accidents happened. A box of her papers got in there, and perhaps a few other things of very little value. I doubt she can prove much of it was hers, and even some of things she is claiming was specifically mentioned in the court papers as belonging to my friend.

So she of course is yelling "Theft!" This is woman who has felony fraud convictions, one for social security fraud and other for stealing money from an old lady whom she was supposed to be her caregiver. But of course she points the finger at someone else every chance she gets.

So the trailer was impounded and everything catalogued. So is there any chance the lot of us are gonna face criminal charges, because (maybe) a few of her things got mixed in with the move of my friends stuff from my friend's house. And when is something considered abandoned? And if she leaves it there, in his house, isn't it community property too?

I'm trying to figure out how they would prosecute us. Yes, it's pretty obvious the papers were hers, but they are worthless to us. It was grabbed purely by accident and we didn't intend to take anything that was hers. If we did take other things of hers, they weren't of much value. And also, how do we know who accidentally grabbed what? How would *they* know? Would they prosecute us individually or as a group? I mean this is crazy.

My friend thinks it's gonna go to civil court if anything, and I hope he's right. I can't imagine being convincted of larceny when I alone did not grab anything that was hers. She can have her box of papers back, who cares, we don't want it. But the ownership of the most of the rest of property is in dispute and I'm not sure what could prove who's was who's one way or the other.
 


Isis1

Senior Member
Michigan

Not sure where to put this, so here goes.

A friend of mine is involved in a messy divorce, whereas his wife was allowed to stay at the residence and he moved out. Still, his things were there and she would'nt let him have anything until the settlement. The settlement came and went, and she refused to give him his things per the court order.

So Saturday, we and five others go over to the residence (a house, which was owned by him and his wife) to get his things. She had changed the locks so we kicked the door in. Remember, this is his house, too. The house is in the process of being foreclosed upon and she had not physically lived there in months. The water has even been turned off.

To make matters more confusing, his mother-in-law had been staying there also some months prior and left a lot of her things there. She states it is her physical address but it is not, and the house will be foreclosed on any day. Yet she states her things were not abandoned.

So, in the process of moving his things, people are in a hurry and we are running around trying to grab everything in the court order, as well as some other community property type things that she had left but did not state she would get in the divorce. In the confusion, some of the mother-in-law's things were put into the truck. Guys were helping that had no knowledge of those who lived there, and accidents happened. A box of her papers got in there, and perhaps a few other things of very little value. I doubt she can prove much of it was hers, and even some of things she is claiming was specifically mentioned in the court papers as belonging to my friend.

So she of course is yelling "Theft!" This is woman who has felony fraud convictions, one for social security fraud and other for stealing money from an old lady whom she was supposed to be her caregiver. But of course she points the finger at someone else every chance she gets.

So the trailer was impounded and everything catalogued. So is there any chance the lot of us are gonna face criminal charges, because (maybe) a few of her things got mixed in with the move of my friends stuff from my friend's house. And when is something considered abandoned? And if she leaves it there, in his house, isn't it community property too?

I'm trying to figure out how they would prosecute us. Yes, it's pretty obvious the papers were hers, but they are worthless to us. It was grabbed purely by accident and we didn't intend to take anything that was hers. If we did take other things of hers, they weren't of much value. And also, how do we know who accidentally grabbed what? How would *they* know? Would they prosecute us individually or as a group? I mean this is crazy.

My friend thinks it's gonna go to civil court if anything, and I hope he's right. I can't imagine being convincted of larceny when I alone did not grab anything that was hers. She can have her box of papers back, who cares, we don't want it. But the ownership of the most of the rest of property is in dispute and I'm not sure what could prove who's was who's one way or the other.

that was one of the most stupidest things you could have done.

husband had recourse to take ex to court for items not given per the court order. you are not an officer of the peace to take this type of action. even THEY need probable cause.


wow. next time. stay out of it.
 

daytripper72

Junior Member
Can I add that his attorney said that it was all set that we could do it? Also, it was not the entering of the house that was the problem, we didn't need probable cause. It's his house, he was there, and we had his permission. It was the accidental taking of her things that was the problem.
 
Last edited:

Antigone*

Senior Member
Can I add that his attorney said that it was all set that we could do it? Also, it was not the entering of the house that was the problem, we didn't need probable cause. It's his house, he was there, and we had his permission. It was the accidental taking of her things that was the problem.
Add all you want partner...add all you want...but just remember, you aren't the one that needs convincing:rolleyes:
 

Isis1

Senior Member
Yes, over the phone. As I said, he was there (the friend), we had his permission, and we didn't need probable cause. The problem was the accidental taking of her things.
so the attorney actually said directly to YOU, that since the locks are changed you can break down the door and help yourself?
 

CdwJava

Senior Member
The laws in MI may be different than out here, but anything of hers that was taken and not subject to the court order COULD be considered stolen.

All because he still OWNS the house does not mean he has a right to enter the house. If he had given up his possession of the property, he may be seen as having no legal right to enter. Thus, his forced entry could be a criminal act.

What he SHOULD have done was ask the court to enforce the order, or grant him permission to enter and retrieve his property.

As it is, he could be charged with a crime ...maybe. The police will probably want to shrug it off and say it is a civil issue, but the laws in your state may not allow them to do so with ease.

I would recommend each of you retain their own legal counsel if you are charged with a crime. I would think it unlikely that any crime will be pursued all the way to court, but it IS a possibility.
 

daytripper72

Junior Member
so the attorney actually said directly to YOU, that since the locks are changed you can break down the door and help yourself?
No. He said to go get the stuff. The homeowner said to break the door down. It's his house. Look, I didn't do it!
 

daytripper72

Junior Member
The laws in MI may be different than out here, but anything of hers that was taken and not subject to the court order COULD be considered stolen.

All because he still OWNS the house does not mean he has a right to enter the house. If he had given up his possession of the property, he may be seen as having no legal right to enter. Thus, his forced entry could be a criminal act.

What he SHOULD have done was ask the court to enforce the order, or grant him permission to enter and retrieve his property.

As it is, he could be charged with a crime ...maybe. The police will probably want to shrug it off and say it is a civil issue, but the laws in your state may not allow them to do so with ease.

I would recommend each of you retain their own legal counsel if you are charged with a crime. I would think it unlikely that any crime will be pursued all the way to court, but it IS a possibility.
Thank you! An informative response! If he can be charged, then assuredly, she could be charged as well? The mother-in-law has been going into the "abandoned" house and taking items of questionable ownership and fencing them. She doesn't even own the house.
 

Proserpina

Senior Member
I suggest y'all chip in and hire some rootin' tootin' attorneys.

At least two parties mentioned in this thread will need 'em...
 

Proserpina

Senior Member
Yes, over the phone. As I said, he was there (the friend), we had his permission, and we didn't need probable cause. The problem was the accidental taking of her things.
I'm not buying that. And if a group of strangers on an internet message board are doubtful....
 

CdwJava

Senior Member
Thank you! An informative response! If he can be charged, then assuredly, she could be charged as well? The mother-in-law has been going into the "abandoned" house and taking items of questionable ownership and fencing them. She doesn't even own the house.
But, if the ex wife was the last one to have the house, the ex wife changed the locks and still had maintained control of the property, then the ex wife could theoretically give permission for her mother to go in and out taking what she wished. If she took something that was granted to the hubbie by court order, she might be subject to criminal charges.

In this instance, I would have to say that your friend - the ex hubbie - is the one that face the most likely criminal charges here... provided any are to be had.
 

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