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Joining a practice with 2 older attorneys - need advice

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wvlawyer304

Junior Member
Hi there. Long time lurkers first time poster. I'm looking for some advice on how to make my situation work well. I think I can help make it happen with some input from others.

A little background on me: I live in the capital city of West Virginia. I just finished school with graduate degrees in both law and business. I've run a small company that I started in high school seven years ago. The bar exam is over, but I won't have the results for a couple more weeks.

And the firm: they do a lot of personal injury, criminal defense, and family law.

I interned for this firm a couple summers ago and they seem to like me. They think I have great attorney and management potential so they've put me in charge of the office in addition to giving me some cases. So far I've made some small adjustments like switching to a cheaper internet/phone company, reducing some phone lines (they had a ton which were never used,) and getting some of the IT infrastructure worked on (two weeks ago most of the computers didn't even work, some weren't connected to the network, etc.)

One of the partners is especially worried about the costs of these changes. Hiring IT people to overhaul the network system, clean up the loads of spyware on the computer, and get our software licenses up to date is expensive.

Productivity at the firm is VERY low because paralegals and secretaries can't use the computers properly, and we have big problems with document management. Once everything is fixed and our processes are made more efficient, I know that productivity will be up our bottom line will go up too. Just switching the cable company the way we did will save us $2000/year.

Receiving payments from customers is another HUGE issue. Right now, we quote a customer an approximate price based on what we think they can pay. Then we discount that price from 25-50% based on the customer's situation and how they were referred to us. After that, we generally tell them that they owe nothing up front and they can send periodic payments. Everything is flat fee, there is no hourly billing. This is something I hope to change once our software is working properly.

So what happens is that something that would normally cost $5,000 is discounted to $3,500, with nothing or maybe half ($1,750) required up front. The end result is that the firm receives half or a third of what the "cost" is. We are doing work for free constantly. Last week I was at a hearing with a client from over two years ago who had paid us a total of $170. Our software said he owed over $3k. We probably have a year's worth of firm revenue that is owed and will never be paid.

Does anyone have advice on managing a firm with older, more skilled attorneys? (Of course, I believe they are less skilled businesspeople!) Also perhaps advice on IT management, legal software (we use Practice Master,) managing much older paralegals/receptionists at my age, and most of all, how on earth can we get paid from these people? Should we require everything up front?

I know it's long, thanks for reading and I appreciate any help.
 


justalayman

Senior Member
First, if you want to be an attorney, be an attorney. It sounds like you are an office manager in your current position. Doing both will be problematic.

Then, I believe you should look for a firm that values their time enough to actually charge for it. These guys have been in business for quite awhile and either they do not have a need for any more money than they currently have or don't really have a desire to do what it takes to earn more. In either case, I believe you would constantly be arguing for changes in a place that has decided long ago what they want out of their business.

It is obvious by the state of affairs you are walking into they do not really care about their business. I think you should take that as a warning sign of things to come.


While you want to blame the computer system for the status of the billing, it ultimately lies in the partners currently running the firm. They could have made things better long ago if they wanted to. I just see what is happening as this is how they wish to run the business rather than being the result of not maintaining the system for some other reason. You don't simply refuse to collect on billings because your computer is not up to par. You refuse to collect on them because you just don't care.
 

ecmst12

Senior Member
After reading your post again, you don't have any questions about LAW at all. Maybe you need a business forum.
 

Mass_Shyster

Senior Member
you're mean
As a 'long time lurker', you should have known that already :D

First: Congratulations on your J.D, and good luck with your bar exam results.

Second: You cannot use a computer to solve a problem unless you can first solve it by hand. The first mistake many people make is trying to change something that they do not fully understand.

Start with paper files. Send out bills, and put copies in the 'unpaid bills' file. When a payment comes in, deposit the check in the appropriate account, and put a copy of the check and the the invoice in the 'paid bills' file. If it's only a partial payment, put them in a 'to be rebilled' file.

Only AFTER you have figured out how to handle the paperwork can you begin to implement an automated system. Since the automated system is not working properly, you'll need to do both for a while.

I see no issue with having an attorney as an office manager. In fact, you'll avoid many of the pitfalls in the Model Rules if you are an attorney and can share fees, where an office manager cannot. It will also give you an intimate knowledge of the inner-workings of a law office that you would never get in a large firm.

Once you have that knowledge, you will me better equipped to open your own office, or take over after your older attorneys retire.
 

justalayman

Senior Member
I see no issue with having an attorney as an office manager. In fact, you'll avoid many of the pitfalls in the Model Rules if you are an attorney and can share fees, where an office manager cannot. It will also give you an intimate knowledge of the inner-workings of a law office that you would never get in a large firm..
It's not that I have a problem with a lawyer being an office manager. I cannot see a person that is beginning their practice wanting to get tied down to having to be the office manager as well as trying to gain experience as an attorney. While there may be something to be gained by acting as manager, that knowledge will come at the expense of fewer gains in the attorney side of the job.
 

wvlawyer304

Junior Member
It's not that I have a problem with a lawyer being an office manager. I cannot see a person that is beginning their practice wanting to get tied down to having to be the office manager as well as trying to gain experience as an attorney. While there may be something to be gained by acting as manager, that knowledge will come at the expense of fewer gains in the attorney side of the job.
well, to be honest, i don't think it will take up a lot of my time. maybe a few hours a week.
 

HighwayMan

Super Secret Senior Member
OP you are wasting everyone's time here. As was politely pointed out to you this question has nothing to do with law. Even if it did it doesn't belong here.
 

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