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Challenging Legality of a Drug Stop

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entrappedinVA

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? VA.

Please note: This posting is based on a hypothetical scenario and maybe subject to attorney client privlege.

here is the hypothetical scenario:

The cops posted a personnel ad on Craigslist pretending to be a female in the "Women who are seeking men" section of the site indicating that the pretend female was interested in hooking up with a MALE who enjoyed controlled substances and would bring some to her place. Someone was stupid enough to fall for it. Hypothetically speaking, this person might have gotten in his car driven to VA from DC after buying some around the corner from his apartment in dc. The fake girl asked him to come to a parking lot near her place and there the cops surrounded his car with guns drawn and searched him and found the controlled substance.

I have a very specific question: Does this person have an argument in this hypothetical scenario that he was profiled based on a federally protected class (gender) and hence had equal protection rights violated? If for example the ad solicited people on the basis of race or national origin that would clearly be illegal. Does the same argument work for Gender based targetting?
 


CdwJava

Senior Member
Short answer: No. You are not going to have a defense based on some sort of argument of gender bias.
 

tranquility

Senior Member
Not only that, but there is no such thing as attorney-client privilege regarding things you tell others. Sheesh.

My goodness, while I know a person accused of a crime will try and find any way to get out of taking responsibility (Or, of the government finding guilt.), if this is the best you've got, I suggest making the best deal you can.
 

entrappedinVA

Junior Member
blah...

May I ask why cops are allowed to target a gender group (men) but not a racial group (lets say white people for example)? In the eyes of the law aren't both race and gender protected similarly?

Re: Responsibility....ohhh I am taking it. Actions have consequences and I am accepting that. I am trying to avoid certain collateral consequence relating to a job loss. I don't expect this to go to trial. This is going to be a plea deal. But for negotiating purposes I need to have something in my back pocket beside entrapment (which is pretty weak) to imply to the DA that I got something even if it's grasping at straws.
 

Trickster

Member
I agree with most every other person here, the answer is NO. To break it down, have you ever watched Datelines Chris Hanson and those "sexual predator" stings? The perps drive to the location with an INTENT. Regardless if the "fake little girl or boy" is actually a 39 year old grandma with a non-smoker silky voice, the INTENT was this "hypothectical" person drove to have sex with a child. Isn't this correct?

The based upon your hypothetical, how can you possibly mount a defense because the person your "hypothetical" person wanted to "mount" was actually a big burly man-cop? Cut a deal and be careful on those chat rooms as you never know who is on the other side.
 

CJane

Senior Member
I'm curious what the controlled substance was... seems like a pretty intensive operation for a small time marijuana bust.

Also, what makes you think you can outsmart the DA by making him think you've "got something"? You were dumb enough to answer an ad on the internet to hook up with a "woman" and pay her for her services with drugs. I'm thinking that THEY have plenty.
 
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CdwJava

Senior Member
May I ask why cops are allowed to target a gender group (men) but not a racial group (lets say white people for example)? In the eyes of the law aren't both race and gender protected similarly?
They could have placed an ad looking for a white male, too. But, why narrow down your pool of not-so-bright suspects?

This is a non-starter. Consult legal counsel ASAP and try to work out a deal. Maybe they will offer a plea to possession and allow you to defer it with drug treatment if that is possible in your state.
 

The Occultist

Senior Member
May I ask why cops are allowed to target a gender group (men) but not a racial group (lets say white people for example)? In the eyes of the law aren't both race and gender protected similarly?
The ad could have been placed requesting a black person bring the dope, and the charges would remain the same. Your understanding of certain protections are largely misinformed.
 

entrappedinVA

Junior Member
ehh...

The controlled substance is pot. They charged me with PWID. I am hoping to negotiate down to a simple posession. It's my first time being arrested so I am hoping to DA will show some discretion. If I get PWID I loose my job. Anyway I already feel dumb that I was lured to another state and two counties over.

on a side note the previous comment really surprised me: can the cop put up an ad being like "looking for a black male to bring drugs"? Isn't that wrong on so many levels?
 

BOR

Senior Member
I have a very specific question: Does this person have an argument in this hypothetical scenario that he was profiled based on a federally protected class (gender) and hence had equal protection rights violated? If for example the ad solicited people on the basis of race or national origin that would clearly be illegal. Does the same argument work for Gender based targetting?
You seem to arguing either entrapment or selective enforcement of the laws based on gender.

They do not have merit, but a good try.

Laws protect sexes such as Title 7, etc., but here there is no disparity in "preventing crime".

If we look at the seminal Whren v. United States, an alleged pretextual stop, (SEIZURE) we see the internal quote:

....We think these cases foreclose any argument that the constitutional reasonableness of traffic stops depends on the actual motivations of the individual officers involved. We of course agree with petitioners that the Constitution prohibits selective enforcement of the law based on considerations such as race. But the constitutional basis for objecting to intentionally discriminatory application of laws is the Equal Protection Clause, not the Fourth Amendment. Subjective intentions play no role in ordinary, probable cause Fourth Amendment analysis....

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/95-5841.ZO.html

While the EP clause protects as described in the case was based on, as it states, "intentionally discriminatory application of the laws".

Here is where your argument would fail.
 

CJane

Senior Member
The controlled substance is pot. They charged me with PWID. I am hoping to negotiate down to a simple posession. It's my first time being arrested so I am hoping to DA will show some discretion. If I get PWID I loose my job. Anyway I already feel dumb that I was lured to another state and two counties over.

on a side note the previous comment really surprised me: can the cop put up an ad being like "looking for a black male to bring drugs"? Isn't that wrong on so many levels?
Why is it wrong? I mean, really. You put an ad up on CL that says "Seeking 420 friendly black man for hook up tonight. Bring your own - and enough to share."

Probably get 300 replies within 20 minutes. And at least a few men stupid enough to fall for it. In fact, they probably WERE running a similar ad. And several others. You're probably not the only bust that night. And they didn't even have to work for it. Just had to count on your ... libido ... controlling your brain.
 

carguy31

Member
Why is it wrong? I mean, really.
b/c it is deceitful.
while the right and wrong of drugs can be debated there is little debate that deceit is wrong. when you go to a court of law the law expects you to tell the truth, whole truth and nothing but the truth.
 

cyjeff

Senior Member
b/c it is deceitful.
while the right and wrong of drugs can be debated there is little debate that deceit is wrong. when you go to a court of law the law expects you to tell the truth, whole truth and nothing but the truth.
AH, the old "I should be allowed to buy drugs and break the law but they shouldn't be able to LIE" defense.

No, that doesn't work very well.

As long as we are on the subject, she also really wasn't into you.
 

CJane

Senior Member
b/c it is deceitful.
while the right and wrong of drugs can be debated there is little debate that deceit is wrong. when you go to a court of law the law expects you to tell the truth, whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Dude was meeting a woman off craigslist. I would hope he expected more than a little deceit.
 

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