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Importing data and Fair Use

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Jason12

Junior Member
I have a website that aggregates data from other websites for auto dealers. In order to pull the data, you have to be a member of the other websites and give me your user ID and password. My server will then login to the other websites on your behalf and pull the data into my website. This data is only visible to you within your account on my website (each dealer needs to request his own data).

One of the other websites, from which I pull data, has sent me a Cease and Desist letter. They claim I'm infringing their Visitor Agreement, I'm "framing" their content, and I'm creating "derivative works based on (the company's) copyrighted content."

Here are my thoughts:
  • Visitor Agreement: I didn't sign the agreement, which forbids exporting the data. My customer signed this agreement and they should contact him.
  • Framing Content: I'm loading this data at the specific request of my customer, who is athorized to view the data on the other website. I'm not claiming or implying ownership of the data.
  • Derivative Works: While I enable my customer to sort and rearrange the data, I'm not really creating a Derivative Work. It's just a list of vehicles that are for sale on the other website.

Your thoughts?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?
 


quincy

Senior Member
I have read your post over a couple of times now, and I am still unclear what it is your website does.

If you are pulling data from another website using a customer's access code to that website, and then making it available for this customer to view on your website, why can't the customer skip your website entirely and just access the same data himself from the originating website?

At any rate, from what I understand of your post, it sure sounds to me like you are infringing on the copyrights of the other website's data. You cannot "pull" someone else's copyrighted material for your own site without permission from the holder of the rights in the material. To do so is not a fair use of the material but infringement.

I think you should, as advised in the cease and desist letter you received, cease and desist your activity until you can have an attorney review exactly what it is you are doing.
 

Jason12

Junior Member
Thanks for the response.

"If you are pulling data from another website using a customer's access code to that website, and then making it available for this customer to view on your website, why can't the customer skip your website entirely and just access the same data himself from the originating website?"

The company in question is an auto auction. I'm pulling a list of vehicles for sale along with the VIN's. Once the dealer has this list in my website, he can click on any vehicle and instantly get a pricing guide value (e.g., NADA) or history report (e.g., CARFAX). This saves him the trouble of trying to copy the VIN and paste it into my website...which is a bit difficult on a typical mobile phone.
 

quincy

Senior Member
I am still not 100% sure I understand what you are doing with your website, Jason12, but I am not comfortable with the legality of it all. And, more importantly, the owner of the other website is not comfortable with the legality of it all.

You can safely take facts and use them. Facts are not copyrightable. How these facts are expressed is copyrightable, however, and to take someone else's expression of the facts to use as your own would be copyright infringement.

If certain cars are up for auction, that is a fact, and you can list the cars that are up for auction. That would not be a problem. And you can add to this list of cars that are up for auction whatever information about these cars that you want - pricing guides, car histories, whatever. That would not be a problem.

However, if the list of cars that are up for auction are listed exclusively for sale through this one website, and this list is accessible only to members who have agreed through a visitor agreement not to export the data found on the website, then you run into trouble. In addition, how the cars are listed and what is said about the cars and even how the cars are pictured would all be expressions of the facts on the website and, therefore, copyrightable material. This can also create a problem.

So, even with the extra details you provided about your site, it still sounds to me like you are reproducing what is exclusively found on the other site for use on your own website. In the process, you are circumventing the visitor agreement set up by the other website, which prohibits the exporting of data.

It is better to know now where you stand legally than to have to learn later by way of a summons and complaint. Because it is impossible to tell without a personal review of all sites in question how likely a suit could be or how successful one would be if pursued, I suggest you have your site and the other sites reviewed by an attorney in your area.

The cease and desist letter you received is a warning. The other website owner may not go past this warning letter even if you do not heed it, but he could.

Good luck.
 
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KaymaXX

Junior Member
I don’t mean to criticize anybody here but how is transferring or sharing one’s account info and password(s) is not a violation of Service Terms? I don’t know the particulars here of course, but as for your regular web service, it should be. OP, you are saying that those other web site people are barking at the wrong tree, and you may be right here, but how does it help your, entirely based on those web service terms violations, business?
 

quincy

Senior Member
Kayma, you are probably correct that it would not help Jason's business any if he told the auction website that their mutual customers provided him access to the auction site. Also, if there is copyright infringement liability, it would more than likely be shared liability between Jason and his customers, so legally it does him no good from that aspect either.

The best advice for Jason is to have his business operations reviewed by an attorney in his area, to get a better idea of his risk of a lawsuit.
 

KaymaXX

Junior Member
Thank you, quincy: I was just commenting on what I thought was one obviously overlooked aspect of the problem. Copyright - I don't know that much about, but I'm trying...

:)
 

quincy

Senior Member
It was overlooked so it was good that you mentioned it. :)

If Jason thought it was a defense to copyright infringement that his customers were the ones who violated the terms of their agreement and not him, it would not be looked at by the courts as a terrific defense. Even "innocent" copyright infringement is still copyright infringement (although if shown to be innocent this can help to mitigate any damages that are awarded).

But, since Jason knew his customers were members of a site that had this Visitor Agreement that prohibited the export of data, it might be a bit difficult for him to argue the infringement as innocent. ;)
 

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