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`Liquor Store - Underage Compliance Checks

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jsann

Junior Member
I currently run/own a liquor store out in Massachusetts. A few months back one of my cashier got caught selling to an underage individual, during a compliance check by the local PD. The underage individual was working with the local PD. After a hearing we were found responsible by the local board. Out of the 6 years in business, this would be the 2nd offense.

The 1st offense was 2 years ago, but under the circumstances, the board gave us, along with 15 other licensees, a warning. The reason for the warning was because the board agreed that the underage operative did not look his age, he was 20 but had looked about 35 years of age. The policy and guideline states that the operative must look his age, as identified on his valid I.D

After the hearing for the 2nd offense, we have been finding that the local PD have been consistently sending underage kids into our establishment. In this city, only one Officer is responsible for the compliance check. 2 days immediately after the hearing, for the 2nd offense, a compliance check occurred again, approximately 2 hours later another check. During this same week, again, 2 compliance check within a 1 days time frame. So far, there's a compliance check occurring nearly every 2 weeks, with the same scenario; they would drop in around 5pm, get no sales, and then come back around 7-8 and try again. Today, we had the same scenario ( a matter of fact as I was typing this, a 3rd attempt).

My question is, at what point does these or sting operation and routine compliance check become harassment? I have this question because statements that the officer made during the hearing makes me believe that this officer is out to get us. Statement such as "if it was up to him we would not be holding a license." He made it very clear that he wants us out of business. We never had any problems with this police department, other than these 2 offenses. He further made allegations that rumor around the high school was that we are the easiest location to purchase alcohol, and the school resource officer have been receiving several complaints from concern parents. What is ironic about this is that after the 1st offense, many compliance check occurred, but after passing all the checks we were given recognition, by local community action group and the police department for consistently carding patrons. These allegations have zero backbone, no formal complaint, reports or record of such complaints. As a resource officer, I would assume that he has a legal obligation to make his superior aware of these complaints. I feel as though the compliance check officer said what he had to just to make his case sounded good.

During this same hearing, 5 other establishments, mainly bars, were also brought upon the board for the same offense. 3 of the 5 bars have several violations on record, however, only received 3 days suspension but all 3 days were on abeyance for a period of 1 year. As for us, we were giving 3 days suspension but to serve all three days. A bit unfair, but it is what it is.


So 2 questions:

1)Would you consider the actions to be harassment? There's no way to find out whether the PD are performing these checks anywhere else, since there are no mandatory reports published.

2) If this indeed is borderline harassment, how should it be dealt with?
 
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sandyclaus

Senior Member
Are you kidding me? Harassment? Most definitely not.

Your establishment was busted for selling to minors, not once but twice. That's just the times you were caught, and almost certainly not the actual number of times your employees were actually selling to minors.

Either get used to the compliance checks, or train your employees better and enforce the expectation that there will be no more sales of alcohol to minors. Anything less is no one else's fault but yours.

Being caught twice should have already taught you a lesson.
 

ecmst12

Senior Member
Are you now indtructing your employees to card EVERYONE no matter how old they look? If so, you won't have a problem.
 

Just Blue

Senior Member
I currently run/own a liquor store out in Massachusetts. A few months back one of my cashier got caught selling to an underage individual, during a compliance check by the local PD. The underage individual was working with the local PD. After a hearing we were found responsible by the local board. Out of the 6 years in business, this would be the 2nd offense.

The 1st offense was 2 years ago, but under the circumstances, the board gave us, along with 15 other licensees, a warning. The reason for the warning was because the board agreed that the underage operative did not look his age, he was 20 but had looked about 35 years of age. The policy and guideline states that the operative must look his age, as identified on his valid I.D

After the hearing for the 2nd offense, we have been finding that the local PD have been consistently sending underage kids into our establishment. In this city, only one Officer is responsible for the compliance check. 2 days immediately after the hearing, for the 2nd offense, a compliance check occurred again, approximately 2 hours later another check. During this same week, again, 2 compliance check within a 1 days time frame. So far, there's a compliance check occurring nearly every 2 weeks, with the same scenario; they would drop in around 5pm, get no sales, and then come back around 7-8 and try again. Today, we had the same scenario ( a matter of fact as I was typing this, a 3rd attempt).

My question is, at what point does these or sting operation and routine compliance check become harassment? I have this question because statements that the officer made during the hearing makes me believe that this officer is out to get us. Statement such as "if it was up to him we would not be holding a license." He made it very clear that he wants us out of business. We never had any problems with this police department, other than these 2 offenses. He further made allegations that rumor around the high school was that we are the easiest location to purchase alcohol, and the school resource officer have been receiving several complaints from concern parents. What is ironic about this is that after the 1st offense, many compliance check occurred, but after passing all the checks we were given recognition, by local community action group and the police department for consistently carding patrons. These allegations have zero backbone, no formal complaint, reports or record of such complaints. As a resource officer, I would assume that he has a legal obligation to make his superior aware of these complaints. I feel as though the compliance check officer said what he had to just to make his case sounded good.

During this same hearing, 5 other establishments, mainly bars, were also brought upon the board for the same offense. 3 of the 5 bars have several violations on record, however, only received 3 days suspension but all 3 days were on abeyance for a period of 1 year. As for us, we were giving 3 days suspension but to serve all three days. A bit unfair, but it is what it is.


So 2 questions:

1)Would you consider the actions to be harassment? There's no way to find out whether the PD are performing these checks anywhere else, since there are no mandatory reports published.

2) If this indeed is borderline harassment, how should it be dealt with?
If you comply with the law then LPD checking up on you should not be an issue.;)
 

davew128

Senior Member
If you comply with the law then LPD checking up on you should not be an issue.;)
Were you aware that Mass laws governing ID reliance violate the constitution? As in, if you don't have a valid MASS ID, passport, or military ID, you can legally be refused.

Think about that for a second.

Ok, now consider the seasonal population makeup of Boston, surrounding cities, and what happens 81 times a year at the Fens, and roughly 100 times a year at the Garden, and 10 times a year in Foxboro. Tell me what's wrong with this law, and I refer you to the full faith and credit clause.
 

Just Blue

Senior Member
Were you aware that Mass laws governing ID reliance violate the constitution? As in, if you don't have a valid MASS ID, passport, or military ID, you can legally be refused.

Think about that for a second.

Ok, now consider the seasonal population makeup of Boston, surrounding cities, and what happens 81 times a year at the Fens, and roughly 100 times a year at the Garden, and 10 times a year in Foxboro. Tell me what's wrong with this law, and I refer you to the full faith and credit clause.
Sorry. Could you please point out where the purchase/selling of wine, beer or scotch is a constitutional right?:confused:

And I am 99.9999% certain that this is NOT about BPD. Hence my calling it LPD.
 
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jsann

Junior Member
I appreciate everyone's opinion, and I truly respect it. And yes we have changed our policy regarding identification requirements and the licensing board has been made aware of our policy changes.

We are human, we make mistakes, simple as that. But to make allegations that have no backbone is just something else. The PD portray our establishment as a place that deliberately hand out alcohol, which isn't the case at all. We are honest working people; my cashiers are my immediate family members. If anyone here is aware of the cost of a liquor license in Massachusetts, you would understand that no one in their right mind would put that investment in jeopardy. If our goal was to make money and intentionally distribute alcohol to minors, why would we allow the Masschusetts State Police BAT unit to utilize our parking lot for sobriety check point, every year? Does this sound like an establishment that would intentional break the law?

I don't have any problems, whatsoever, with compliance checks, I am only concern with compliance check that only occurs at targeted establishment. And if I recall correctly, the Massachusetts ABCC strictly prohibit targeting establishments because it does indeed constitute harassment. The only problem is that it's nearly impossible to prove because there's no mandate for police department or even ABCC investigators to public publish reports of how many stores and what stores were checked.
 

FarmerJ

Senior Member
If you do video record the register area , I would suggest noting times and dates for your own records every time underage come in , or do it another way , if you are able to have one person try to id as suspected young come in if they cannot produce then tell them they must leave before they even get chance to get into line and slow it down.
 

davew128

Senior Member
Sorry. Could you please point out where the purchase/selling of wine, beer or scotch is a constitutional right?:confused:

And I am 99.9999% certain that this is NOT about BPD. Hence my calling it LPD.
How tall are you? I wonder because this went right over your head.

Let me spell it out for you. Mass law refuses to allow merchants to recognize an out of state ID as valid for purposes of purchasing alcohol. It is the only state with a law like this. Yes, not recogizing the validity of an ID issued by another state is a constitutional violation.

Oh and BTW, the City of L has a single A affiliate of the team in B not to mention being near the border of another state so I think you'll be finding a decent number of people from out of state there as well.:rolleyes:
 

jsann

Junior Member
If you do video record the register area , I would suggest noting times and dates for your own records every time underage come in , or do it another way , if you are able to have one person try to id as suspected young come in if they cannot produce then tell them they must leave before they even get chance to get into line and slow it down.
Great suggestion.
 

ecmst12

Senior Member
Pretty sure that OP did not get cited for serving someone of age but with an out-of-state ID. And even MORE sure that OP has no interest in challenging the constitutionality of a law that he's not even been charged with violating. So quit hijacking.
 

davew128

Senior Member
Pretty sure that OP did not get cited for serving someone of age but with an out-of-state ID. And even MORE sure that OP has no interest in challenging the constitutionality of a law that he's not even been charged with violating. So quit hijacking.
Pretty sure you know nothing of the liquor laws in Mass, so butt out.
 

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