ATT: I am always liable

Hi

Thanks for your reply to the evidence thread had a followup in regards to your reply. I called the clerk at the courthouse and they said for small claims court this is not possible what you suggested which is below just to refresh as I noticed you post alot.

"Go to the court clerk and get a form Subpoena. Fill it out completely, describing the documents EXACTLY, or as best you can, to compel them to bring the documents to court."

Would there be any other way to force them to produce this document? Basically I want to see what the other half of it says as I was told by a couple of their employees that we recieved the wrong half the other half may have had the instructions needed to have avoided this and if the driver screwed up then it makes my chances of winning easier. Any help would be much appriciated. Thanks again for your suggestion.

Wallace784

wallace784 said:

Hi

Thanks for your reply to the evidence thread had a followup in regards to your reply. I called the clerk at the courthouse and they said for small claims court this is not possible what you suggested which is below just to refresh as I noticed you post alot.

"Go to the court clerk and get a form Subpoena. Fill it out completely, describing the documents EXACTLY, or as best you can, to compel them to bring the documents to court."

Would there be any other way to force them to produce this document? Basically I want to see what the other half of it says as I was told by a couple of their employees that we recieved the wrong half the other half may have had the instructions needed to have avoided this and if the driver screwed up then it makes my chances of winning easier. Any help would be much appriciated. Thanks again for your suggestion.

Wallace784

Click to expand...

My response:

This seems incomprehensible to me. It is rediculous to me that if someone has evidence that you need for your case, that there is no "mechanism" in South Carolina to compel that evidence. In California, for example - - as in most States - - a subpoena is the method of choice.

There must be some method mentioned in the book you bought. You know what, even if there isn't (which would be dumb), I would go ahead and mail the opponent a "Notice to Produce Documents" letter. That would be the title, at the top of the letter.

In that letter, I would reference the case name, case number, and the date, time and address of the appearance. Then, I would start a paragraph this way: "You are required to bring with you, to the hearing in the above-entitled matter, the following documents: (Then, list the documents with specificity). Remember, even if it's not allowed, you can't get into any trouble for doing it, and your opponent may not know it's not allowed. But, if you don't ask, you won't get. And, there's a better than even shot that you will get him to comply with the letter by bringing the documents to court.

I tried looking up this information on the Net, but the site for your State makes no mention whatsoever concerning this procedure for Small Claims court. Very odd, indeed.

There must be some sort of method ! Read through your book.

Good luck my friend.

IAAL

[Edited by I AM ALWAYS LIABLE on 05-17-2001 at 09:25 AM]

The even weirder part is you can suboenas wittnesses to appear yet they don't do it for forms so it is odd indeed. Weird part about this book and I got it from the library so...but the part about requesting documents is missing they say Pg 157 yet Pg 157 is blank like it was put in by mistake. Have a letter to the publishers to see if they can send me a copy of what should have been on that page as it was supposedly talking about discovery and how to get documents to be produced for use as evidence.

Thanks also for the suggestion about sending a letter as soon as I get the complaint filed and get a case number will send them a letter. Thanks again.

Wallace784

My response:

My suggestion was merely a "last ditch effort" method. If page 157 is missing, that means that there must be an acceptable method to compel documents - - there has to be !

So, go to a bookstore, and look in their "legal section" and get an up-to-date book on the subject of Small Claims procedures. God only knows how old that "library book" is that you have, and may very well have old information - - which could be misleading, and get you INTO trouble or cause more confusion.

Get to a bookstore.

IAAL

Well it was published in 1995 so isn't to old when you consider how old law is but I suppose it is possible things have changed and obviously he does state throughout the book that while what he says is accurate in most cases best to check with the courts in your area to make sure as different states have different procedures and rules though most are fairly uniform state to state they can vary but will see what my local book stores have though believe it or not I actually found on a recent trip to Japan that one book store there that had a foreign book section (in this case English and other languages other then Japanese) but that they had a better selection then I have seen at my local Barnes & Nobles. Hard to believe I can get a better selection abroad then right here at home. But will see what they have anyways. Thanks.

Discovery (and Subpeona of Records) is covered in South Carolina Rules of Civil Procedures, Rule 26, which says in part:
"(3) Trial Preparation: Materials. Subject to the provisions of subdivision (b)(4) of this rule, a party may obtain discovery of documents and tangible things otherwise discoverable under subdivision (b)(1) of this rule and prepared in anticipation of litigation or for the trial by or for another party or by or for that other party's representative (including his attorney, consultant, surety, indemnitor, insurer, or agent) only upon a showing that the party seeking discovery has substantial need of the materials in the preparation of his case and that he is unable without undue hardship to obtain the substantial equivalent of the materials by other means. In ordering discovery of such materials when the required showing has been made, the court shall protect against disclosure of the mental impressions, conclusions, opinions, or legal theories of an attorney or other representative of a party concerning the litigation."

A copy of the full rule can be seen at:
http://www.judicial.state.sc.us/register/civil/RULE26.html


[Edited by Halket on 05-17-2001 at 11:20 AM]

My response:

Steve, the information that you have given is, I'm sure, very much appreciated by our writer - - as well as myself.

However, I think that the procedures you have outlined for our writer are for courts of greater jurisdiction.

Our writer has already mentioned :

"I called the clerk at the courthouse and they said for small claims court this is not possible . . . "

So, since our writer was missing a page from his book concerning this subject, I wanted our writer to obtain a newer book to see if there's something he can do in this regard for Small Claims court. There has got to be a method, and I'm hoping that the clerk may have been mistaken (although, it's unlikely - - they know their courts very well, for the most part).

Thanks for your assistance.

IAAL

IAAL

You are most likely correct. To give you an idea od how much I do know about law I have been do personal study on the tax laws and constitutional issues for last 2 years so am fairly familar with alot of the common terms and issues surround bringing a case. But of course reading it and doing it are two separate issues that's why i have been asking questions being this is the first time I will be in court for other then minor traffic infractions. So I am familar with the rules of the court whether it be on evidence or procedure and I think your right that it is for a higher jurisdiction court though I do thank the writer for offering the suggestion.

Now last year I was at my libraries homeless magazine rack and managed to get a copy of "Your guide to Magistrate court" put out by the SC Bar Association it's mainly for kids but I have found it very valuable as it gave me alot of the info I needed to get as far as I have and I did notice today in the back they had a list of numbers including one for free legal advice and Plan to call this PM (hours of operation) to as a lawyer from SC what he thinks as he will most likely be more familar with the actual laws the pertain to South carolina. Will let you know what turns up in case anyone asks a similar question in the future. If you want the numbers let me know.

Thanks
wallace784

IAAL, I realized when I posted them that the original poster (Wallace784) had said "they said for small claims court this is not possible" (apparently referring to pre-trial discovery), but we both recognize that it would be unusual to 'handcuff' the Small Claim (Magistrate Court) parties in their case development.

Accordingly, with all due respect to Wallace784, I felt that there must be some error in communication or confusion about this question. That is why I tried to research the issue in both the statutes and Rules and was not able to find any statement that pre-trial discovery was barred at the Small Claims level.

So, in order to help, I offered citations to the Rules governing the process of Discovery. And in those rules, again there is no preclusion of any court.

In summary, I would go back and confirm with the court staff to see if in fact, the discovery process is not available at this level.

ATT: I am always liable & Halket

Just so you know I called the number I mentioned and talked to a lawyer here in SC on the ask-a-lawyer free advice line and he said based on what I mentioned he thought it might be possible the clerk thought I was trying to exercise discovery which at least in SC is not allowed but he did say that I could subpoena documents as well as wittnesses to compell them to bring them to court with them so I will ask her again when I drop off the complaint first part of next week. I'll let you know what turns up on it so you are familar with this here in SC as I know your both from other states.

My response:

That's got to be where the hang-up is. It just doesn't make sense that a subpoena couldn't be issued.

Remember, with some Clerks, you have to be completely specific, by saying something like, "I want to Subpoena documents at my hearing. Where can I get a Subpoena ? "

You know, say the "magic word", Subpoena, two or three times.

IAAL