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closing attorney lawsuit

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tarheel

Junior Member
What is the name of your state? NC

Our closing attorney assured us upon closing that we did not have to belong to the Property Owners Association [POA] when we closed on the property 7 years ago. We were badgered and threatened since 2001 from our POA saying that we are members by accepting the Deed which did have the R&R's on it. We were sued and the POA lost, the magistrate stating it was barred by the 3 year Statute of Limitations. They appealed and they won in part but going back only 3 years due to the Statute of Limitations and we were told by the judge that we are now members from that point forward. We settled and paid this small portion of the total to keep it from going futher, get more expensive and potentialy losing if they got a smarter attorney [see * below].

We would never had bought the property if we weren't assured that we did not have to join a POA, that it was a voluntary membership. Our attorney, after speaking with the POA pres at closing and being told it was voluntary membership, marked the closing paperwork by crossing out the R&R's on some closing doc's and the Deed copy which we and the attorney then initialed. The original Deed, as mailed to us about 2 months after closing, shows the R&R's on there but they were X'd out as well as the state [mistake on the state since we moved from out of state]. The Deed was filed apparently before being X'd out as the one on file shows the R&R's clearly.

Our closing attorney initialy helped us by appearing as a witness on our behalf in the original small claims suite brought against us by the POA and testified that the call was made to the POA president and he was told it was voluntary. We have the original copy of the scribbled out R&R's with our intials. Our closing attny also said that if it goes to District court then he would offer to pay the amount IF we agreed. He promised us that he would be there for the appeal, again as a witness, but he never showed. Based on his word I did not have him served to appear, just made notification of the date/time/location 3 weeks in advance to which he assured us he'd be there. All I can guess is that he either figured %$@#-!# or felt he may get himself in trouble. Who knows, he won't return my calls??

My question is, since the Deed is a sealed document [*under seal extends the SOL to 10 years ~ their attorney never even considered that and we rolled the dice :) ] , can I sue our closing attorney for fraud or ? We DON'T want to belong to a POA and were told we did not have to. It would likely be impossible to change the Deed now so I figure I'd sue him for the costs involved, costs of the POA dues for the years ahead and and potential special assessments that could and likely will occur [3 HIGH assessents in 7 years]. This should total less than the $5k limit of small claims.

Should I just file a suite or give him the opportunity to pay up/settle prior to IF he will talk to me. He knows what he did and offered at one time to pay the POA off IF it went to disrict court. This has been an ordeal for sure.

How do I proceed?
 


JETX

Senior Member
tarheel said:
can I sue our closing attorney for fraud or ?
Of course you can sue. After all, almost anyone can sue almost anyone else over almost anything.
However, based on your post, I don't see a chance of a case.
 

JETX

Senior Member
tarheel said:
Would you care to explain your reasoning?
Lots of reasons... some are:
1) You have not been damaged. In fact, a good claim could be made that the POA is protecting your investment, etc.
2) Depending on the full facts, you might have a hard time PROVING that the attorney 'advised' no POA.
3) And even if you can prove the 'no POA' statement, it is not a MATERIAL matter sufficient to warrant damages (even if you could prove them).
4) Attorneys, as much as the public sometimes wants to think, are not GODS who don't make mistakes.
5) A good argument could be made that YOU are responsible for your own due diligence in determining the POA status on the property you are looking at. Simply, POA requirement or not is NOT a legal issue. Sort of like blaming the attorney because you find you paid too much...
6) And as much as I am reluctant to admit it, the fact is, you would be 'playing' in OUR arena (court) with OUR rules against a person with a lot more 'weapons' than you have and the experience in using them.
 

tarheel

Junior Member
Oh, now I get it!

"4) Attorneys, as much as the public sometimes wants to think, are not GODS who don't make mistakes."

BUT......

"6) And as much as I am reluctant to admit it, the fact is, you would be 'playing' in OUR arena (court) with OUR rules against a person with a lot more 'weapons' than you have and the experience in using them."

You're not GOD's in one hand but are in another.

Talking out of both sides of your mouth, now that is an attorney!

I have plenty of proof, including the falsification of documents. Had the Deed been properly noted and recorded there would be no issue.

Small claims is not that formal and we the Plaintiff [is this case] are not expected to be an attorney. We won the first time and did quite well I might add. It was the appeal [hense more formal] that we stumbled a bit but we still won [paid a measely $283 of a $3300 suite].

If you knew this POA, their arrogant attitudes, their actions showing preference to board members and overspending you wouldn't want to belong either. I assure you, this POA is well known for not being a positive influence so it does not protect our investment.

Had we known we must belong to the POA we would have walked right out at closing! This is where our closing attorney messed up. He called the POA president and was assured it was a voluntary membership. He marked the papers as such by crossing out the R&R's, initialed it and also X'd off the R&R's on the Deed apparently after it was filed. It was filed on the date of closing but we did not get it until 2 months later, don't know why. I was at the Deed recorder yesterday and she seemed to remember our closing attorney trying to re-submit a Deed, probably ours [her own words].

It will be heard and I will gladly post the outcome.

I understand your position to protect your own but also remember I bet you have little to no experience in my profession, which I don't expect you to.
 

seniorjudge

Senior Member
tarheel said:
Oh, now I get it!

"4) Attorneys, as much as the public sometimes wants to think, are not GODS who don't make mistakes."

BUT......

"6) And as much as I am reluctant to admit it, the fact is, you would be 'playing' in OUR arena (court) with OUR rules against a person with a lot more 'weapons' than you have and the experience in using them."

You're not GOD's in one hand but are in another.

Talking out of both sides of your mouth, now that is an attorney!

I have plenty of proof, including the falsification of documents. Had the Deed been properly noted and recorded there would be no issue.

Small claims is not that formal and we the Plaintiff [is this case] are not expected to be an attorney. We won the first time and did quite well I might add. It was the appeal [hense more formal] that we stumbled a bit but we still won [paid a measely $283 of a $3300 suite].

If you knew this POA, their arrogant attitudes, their actions showing preference to board members and overspending you wouldn't want to belong either. I assure you, this POA is well known for not being a positive influence so it does not protect our investment.

Had we known we must belong to the POA we would have walked right out at closing! This is where our closing attorney messed up. He called the POA president and was assured it was a voluntary membership. He marked the papers as such by crossing out the R&R's, initialed it and also X'd off the R&R's on the Deed apparently after it was filed. It was filed on the date of closing but we did not get it until 2 months later, don't know why. I was at the Deed recorder yesterday and she seemed to remember our closing attorney trying to re-submit a Deed, probably ours [her own words].

It will be heard and I will gladly post the outcome.

I understand your position to protect your own but also remember I bet you have little to no experience in my profession, which I don't expect you to.


Your main problem is that you have no evidence. Evidence in cases involving real property must be in writing.

JETX is 100% correct here.

I will stand by for your results. Let us know.
 

tarheel

Junior Member
It is in writing, I qoute myself:

"He marked the papers as such by crossing out the R&R's, initialed it and also X'd off the R&R's on the Deed apparently after it was filed."

If that's not wrtitten evidence I don't know what is.

The magistrate in the original suite said, in our closing attorneys presence, "I'd sue your closing attorney for manipulation of closing documents and monetary damages of such resulting action"

I think that's why he's lying low.

I will let you know how it turns out.
 

tarheel

Junior Member
I filed a small claims suit, naming our closing attorney and the then POA president as defendants.

After speaking to another attorney, he says it would be viewed as a contract between us and the POA president as a special stipulation of closing with the attorney witnessing and responsible for recording it as such.

The POA ByLaws state that any "self-dealing" by any board member would constitute a breach or failure to perform duties resulting in willful misconduct or recklessness not falling under the POA's indemnification protection policy.

In other words, the POA president acted alone not per the ByLaws which require a board meeting to change any part of the POA's R&R's.

Our closing attorney still wont respond to our calls and of course the then POA president denies any such agreement. Our closing attorney previously testified under oath that she did make that statement as well as we heard it on speakerphone ourselves. He also previously testified that he did cross out and initial the R&R's and did X out the Deed per her statements.

I'll go after them both, whomever can't convince a judge otherwise will be responsible.
 

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