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Out of state court threat

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sdlegal

Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA

A technical repair shop offering mail-in service received a 5 year old media player and despite many months of effort and cost to find and replace parts (for which the customer was never charged), it was eventually deemed non-repairable and shipped back to the customer, who had been calling and harassing for an extended length of time. The nail in the coffin was the device's battery which had exploded while in the company's possession (normal for an aged device such as this).

The customer moved to a different address and claimed the company "lost" his property because he moved. He also claimed the company damaged his device which was originally working but only needed the cracked screen replaced. Now he has sent a demand letter for $900 (the cost of replacing the unit on eBay) with a threat to sue in small claims court. He lives in a completely different state.

When the customer submitted the on-line mail in repair form, he agreed to the terms and conditions as stated on the website, which include the fact that the company is only responsible for negligence and not any damage that it did not cause. Other than that, evidence from the repairing technician could be provided, but not much else.

Should the company take any action at this time? What case does the customer have, if any? What evidence would the repair shop need to provide to have the case dismissed?
 
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justalayman

Senior Member
so, was it returned to the owner or not? If so, what does the change of address have to do with anything?


He also claimed the company damaged his device which was originally working but only needed the cracked screen replaced.
was it? it should be noted in communications as to the condition of the unit prior to sending it to the repair company and if the repair company was smart they would have recorded the condition of the unit along with the requested work being purchased.

What evidence would the repair shop need to provide to have the case dismissed?
it isn't likely to get dismissed. The issues are fact to be weighed so that would require a trial. There is nothing outstanding that would allow for an summary dismissal that you posted.


Should the company take any action at this time?
nothing to do unless the guy actually files suit.
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
I don't think it's homework. I suspect the OP is just wording his post strangely in a misguided attempt to not allow bias to enter in to it.

With that said:

The other guy would need to sue in CA. If he chose to sue in CA, then the service company would need to hire an attorney to represent them. Frankly, this is more of a business question than a legal question. Is it worth $900 to avoid the cost of an attorney, etc.?

With THAT said:

I think the "customer" is blowing smoke.
 

sdlegal

Member
1. Device was returned to owner without the customer's approval or request. Customer claims property was "lost".

2. If customer sues in CA, company can represent themselves.

3. Repair company DOES have a written record of the condition of the unit as well as the entire history of the work performed, receipts and tracking numbers from parts ordered, etc. as well as emails sent to customer.

4. Provider did not damage device. Parts were replaced that didn't work and ultimately, as previously mentioned, the internal battery exploded, causing damage.
 

justalayman

Senior Member
sdlegal;3294709]1. Device was returned to owner without the customer's approval or request. Customer claims property was "lost".
well, I was not aware they required permission to return a customer's property to them so the lost issue is a moot point because the customer has his property back.

2. If customer sues in CA, company can represent themselves.
can they? I don't recall


3. Repair company DOES have a written record of the condition of the unit as well as the entire history of the work performed, receipts and tracking numbers from parts ordered, etc. as well as emails sent to customer.
but that doesn't answer my question


4. Provider did not damage device. Parts were replaced that didn't work and ultimately, as previously mentioned, the internal battery exploded, causing damage
that is a fact for a trier of facts to determine and that is one reason it would go all the way to court and but be tossed on a summary judgment or outright dismissal.
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
2. If customer sues in CA, company can represent themselves.
It depends on how the company is structured. Probably not.

4. Provider did not damage device. Parts were replaced that didn't work and ultimately, as previously mentioned, the internal battery exploded, causing damage.
How does the provider intend to show that it wasn't their improper replacement of parts that caused the battery to explode. Like maybe inadvertently shorting something out...
 

justalayman

Senior Member
I don't think it's homework. I suspect the OP is just wording his post strangely in a misguided attempt to not allow bias to enter in to it.

With that said:

The other guy would need to sue in CA. If he chose to sue in CA, then the service company would need to hire an attorney to represent them. Frankly, this is more of a business question than a legal question. Is it worth $900 to avoid the cost of an attorney, etc.?

With THAT said:

I think the "customer" is blowing smoke.
actually they may look at it a bit differently; is it worth $900 for the customer to go to California (several times if the defendant knows how to play the game) spending money that cannot be recovered to attempt to recover $900? I suspect the company has the stronger position here so they may simply wait to see what the customer does. If pushed they can hire a rent-a-lawyer for an hour to present to court for them.


4. Provider did not damage device. Parts were replaced that didn't work and ultimately, as previously mentioned, the internal battery exploded, causing damage.
so, what does the original work order say about services requested? If it worked other than a cracked screen, then the request for work would have a "replace screen" on it. If it did not work and the repair shop was hired to repair the device then there is going to be something more like; diagnose and provide estimate to customer for no work condition. Symptoms include:...
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
actually they may look at it a bit differently; is it worth $900 for the customer to go to California (several times if the defendant knows how to play the game) spending money that cannot be recovered to attempt to recover $900? I suspect the company has the stronger position here so they may simply wait to see what the customer does. If pushed they can hire a rent-a-lawyer for an hour to present to court for them.
That was addressed by my "blowing smoke" comment ;):cool:
 

sdlegal

Member
1. The company is an S-Corp but it's small claims. Why couldn't the business owner just go in and defend himself and bring his technician?
2. How could the company require the claimant to come to court multiple times?
3. The original work order says the screen was cracked and customer wants a replacement. He was quoted the repair and parts were ordered but did not work. In the process, other parts were ordered and eventually the entire repair snowballed in cost and parts. And again, the unit started to fail while in the repair labs (leaking battery). Yes, it could be argued by the customer that the device was "shorted" by a technician, but how could that be proven or disproven? Seems like an impossible argument to prove or disprove either way.
4. Customer does not claim that he has his property back because he moved to a different address (side note: both locations were $800,000 homes in very upscale, wealthy neighborhoods!).
5. Company did not damage the device and in fact did everything possible to get it working properly, at great expense to company. Customer was never charged for any work, only a small diagnosis fee.
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
1. The company is an S-Corp but it's small claims. Why couldn't the business owner just go in and defend himself and bring his technician?
A corporation must be represented by an attorney. Dem's the rules.

2. How could the company require the claimant to come to court multiple times?
Very fact-specific.

3. The original work order says the screen was cracked and customer wants a replacement. He was quoted the repair and parts were ordered but did not work. In the process, other parts were ordered and eventually the entire repair snowballed in cost and parts. And again, the unit started to fail while in the repair labs (leaking battery). Yes, it could be argued by the customer that the device was "shorted" by a technician, but how could that be proven or disproven? Seems like an impossible argument to prove or disprove either way.
The standard of proof is just (basically) "more likely than not." The other party sent in a unit that only had a cracked screen. By the time you finished with it, the battery exploded.

4. Customer does not claim that he has his property back because he moved to a different address (side note: both locations were $800,000 homes in very upscale, wealthy neighborhoods!).
How does the repair company intend to prove that the other party actually got the item?

5. Company did not damage the device and in fact did everything possible to get it working properly,...
That is for the court to decide.

... at great expense to company. Customer was never charged for any work, only a small diagnosis fee.
Irrelevant.
 

justalayman

Senior Member
sdlegal;3294719]1. The company is an S-Corp but it's small claims. Why couldn't the business owner just go in and defend himself and bring his technician?
the rules of court determine if they can represent the company. Offhand I don't know the rules and don't have the time to researcfh it at the moment.

uire the claimant to come to court multiple times?
last minute rescheduling. If you know how to play the game you can get an extension or two. If the company is represented by a lawyer, the lawyer could show up with an excuse why the company principals cant. Its a game

3. The original work order says the screen was cracked and customer wants a replacement. He was quoted the repair and parts were ordered but did not work. In the process, other parts were ordered and eventually the entire repair snowballed in cost and parts. And again, the unit started to fail while in the repair labs (leaking battery). Yes, it could be argued by the customer that the device was "shorted" by a technician, but how could that be proven or disproven? Seems like an impossible argument to prove or disprove either way.
so why didn't they stop after performing the authorized work?

4. Customer does not claim that he has his property back because he moved to a different address (side note: both locations were $800,000 homes in very upscale, wealthy neighborhoods!).
but does he have it back? That is all that matters.
5. Company did not damage the device and in fact did everything possible to get it working properly, at great expense to company. Customer was never charged for any work, only a small diagnosis fee.
well, we have a problem. Unless the customer authorized the additional work, all they had permission to do was replace the screen. They should have done that and at that point contacted the customer for further directions as to what they customer wanted to do. Since they took it upon themselves to play with the thing, I suspect they could lose a suit.
 

sdlegal

Member
1. Small Claims court doesn't allow lawyers and requires principals to represent business entities, even if it's a corporation. Correct?
2. "Very fact-specific" means?
3. The other party sent in a unit that only had a cracked screen and was non-usable at the end. That is true. But remember, this is a deprecated, obsolete 5+ year old device, not a new iPad.
4. There is no proof that customer received his property back, only that it was delivered to the address of record. But isn't it the customer's responsibility to forward his address or go collect his property?
5. Customer claims he didn't get his property back and that the provider lost it.
6. Customer WAS told that the screen replacement didn't work and authorized other work. Customer even took it upon himself to purchase an additional part and have it shipped to the repair company in an attempt to get the device working!
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
1. Small Claims court doesn't allow lawyers and requires principals to represent business entities, even if it's a corporation. Correct?
Exactly 100% incorrect. A corporation MUST be represented by an attorney.

2. "Very fact-specific" means?
It means that it depends on the facts. In other words, we can't speculate.

3. The other party sent in a unit that only had a cracked screen and was non-usable at the end. That is true. But remember, this is a deprecated, obsolete 5+ year old device, not a new iPad.
Apparently the customer has determined that the depreciated value of this device is $900. It's up to the court to determine who's correct.

4. There is no proof that customer received his property back, only that it was delivered to the address of record. But isn't it the customer's responsibility to forward his address or go collect his property?
That's a defense that can be raised.


Now, is this a situation YOU are involved in?
 

justalayman

Senior Member
2. "Very fact-specific" means?
it means without the actual facts an answer cannot be provided

3. The other party sent in a unit that only had a cracked screen and was non-usable at the end. That is true. But remember, this is a deprecated, obsolete 5+ year old device, not a new iPad.
irrelevent. What matters is what the established value of the device is at the time of the loss. The value is what it is.
4. There is no proof that customer received his property back, only that it was delivered to the address of record. But isn't it the customer's responsibility to forward his address or go collect his property?
so,how does the guy make this claim if he has not received his equipment:

He also claimed the company damaged his device which was originally working but only needed the cracked screen replaced.
 

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