37 in a 25 PA

[RG11389]

What is the name of your state: PA
I am a young driver in Pennsylvania. I got my first citation doing 72 in a 55 which was lowered to 70 and I got 3 points on my license, which would go away in one year from the citation date without any more citations on the license. Thinking that I wouldn't have any trouble with making a year, I took the bargain.
A week after my hearing for that ticket, I was driving to school on a 25 and I was in a line of cars all going the same speed, and in front of me was a school bus, to which many of my peers can act as witnesses. I wasn't looking at my spedometer, I was going with the flow of traffic. I get up around 50 yards and behind me I see car after car pulling over. A local officer was coming up towards me and not thinking it was after me, I pulled over. He clocked me at 12 over: 37 in a 25 with ENRADD over 3 feet. First of all, the minimum over that he can convict me of is 10 according to 3368 I think. I am 2 over, ouch. Why didn't anyone else get pulled over? He also spelled the first name of the insurance holder wrong. I have adult witnesses agreeing with me that it wasn't a fair ticket and also that I was singled out(but I doubt that it will help me). Because I am a minor, my license would be suspended for 90 days and I will have to do traffic school.

I was only 2 over the minimum, behind a bus, and have many character references including my 4.1 gpa

Is there anything that can help me out here, and does anyone think that I have a good chance? I just need advice.

 

[sukharev]

My advice is: stop making excuses, and focus on how to fight the ticket.

1) Read all you can on techniques to fight (specifically, start with finding everything you can about ENRADD), either on this forum or on the web. For example, I could not find any judicial notice discussion for that particular system. Maybe in PA you don't need one, but certainly worthwhile checking if device itself or its accuracy can be challenged. Calibration is a key. Here is a sample link: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=615995

2) Find out how to testify and how to call witnesses in your favor. Specifically, the key issue would be that the witness can estimate speed visually (similar to officer's testimony to same matter).

Good luck.

 

[HappyHusband]

I was only 2 over the minimum, behind a bus, and have many character references including my 4.1 gpa

4.1 GPA? Case dismissed, with apologies from the Court!

 

[sukharev]

4.1 GPA? Case dismissed, with apologies from the Court!

If it's European system (1-5, 5 being an A), that score sucks

 

[poohmantbb]

A week after my hearing for that ticket, I was driving...

Apparently you learned nothing from the first ticket.

I wasn't looking at my spedometer,

Might be a good thing to start doing...

He clocked me at 12 over: 37 in a 25 with ENRADD over 3 feet. First of all, the minimum over that he can convict me of is 10 according to 3368 I think. I am 2 over, ouch.

You are 12 over, not 2.

Why didn't anyone else get pulled over?

One officer..... "line of cars"... you do the math. Or maybe he was picking on you.

I have adult witnesses agreeing with me that it wasn't a fair ticket.

BFD... they are not the police or the judge.

Because I am a minor, my license would be suspended for 90 days and I will have to do traffic school.

Should of thought about that before....

Ask for a reduction and slow down.

 

[RG11389]

I appreciate the mature advice, but mainly the advice of sukharev; thank you for the insight. Are most people on here cops or judges? They seem biased.

 

[poohmantbb]

I appreciate the mature advice, but mainly the advice of sukharev; thank you for the insight.

(clap, clap, clap, clap**************....) Woo hoo for Sukharev!!!!!!!!

 

[loulblades]

Originally Posted by sukharev
...I could not find any judicial notice discussion for that particular system. Maybe in PA you don't need one...

For future reference, in PA judicial notice is required to be provided by the prosecution (which in PA is usually the officer) at the hearing for speed timing devices (Comm. v Kittelberger) and the calibration station (Comm. v Denny and Comm. v Kaufman). You can request dismissal on these grounds if the officer doesn't offer these as basis for the evidence, i.e. the reading on the device. (Now just getting the magistrate to listen...)

I did get "wacked" with ENRADD and received a citation for doing 51 in a 35. I don't believe I was going that fast (just pulled out on the road etc) but that is irrelevant. I met with the officers before the hearing and they showed me all their paperwork including judicial notice, original cal certificate, etc and offered a lower speed (since I said I didn't mind paying the fine, just didn't want the points) and I took it. I realized after I left that I had choked because there was a piece missing, but it was too late.

So since these are locals, I am guessing since ENRADD was used, they come to the hearing much more prepared than the state guys do but also seem to be more willing to negotiate.

Good luck.