Cop wrote backdated ticket!!!

[Neocode]

What is the name of your state? New Jersey

I am posting this question on behalf of my 19 yr old brother. This situation starts approximately 1 month ago. My brother drives a 2002 Ford Mustang, Black in color. He was driving on a two-lane road in the left hand lane. He switched to the right-hand lane lane to approach a jughandle, u-turn he needed to make.

However, there was construction in that lane and so he switched back to the left. There were two officers there, and one gave him and his friend riding with him a dirty look. This was approx. 8/10/2002.

Flash forward to 8/24/2002, a rainy Saturday afternoon. My brother is stopped at a light on a highway entrance, in the right lane. He has a friend with him. He makes the left turn when the light turns green and turns into the slow lane of this three lane highway. He notices a police cruiser pull out of a parking lot in traffic behind him, so he is cautious. The cruiser makes the left, into the fast lane. He then flies across the highway, to get behind my brother. He pulls him over. My brother was doing 40 mph in a 55 mph zone.

First thing he says to my brother when the window is opened is, "Remember me?" My brother said, "No officer." The cop then says to him, "Well, I remember you. I saw you that day, and even though I didn't get your plate, I knew I'd see you again. I recognized your car."

So he makes my brother get out of the car, and sit on the hood of the cruiser, in the rain, for a half hour. When he took my brothers paperwork, he noticed the PBA card we all have from the Passaic County Sheriff (the county we live in and the Sheriff is a friend of the family) and took it from him. He asked my brother how he got it. When my brother explained the Sheriff is a friend of the family, the cop told him he was keeping the card, and said, "and if Jerry (the sheriff) has a problem with it, you can tell him to come and see me!"

The cop wrote out three tickets, with sequential numbering. One was for reckless driving, dated 8/10/02, then written over that, 9/10/02. It was listed as a dry weather day. This was the backdated ticket, which I thought it was illegal for them to do. The tail # on this ticket was #18. By tail number I mean the last two digits in the 5 or 6 digit tracking number on the top of the ticket.

The second ticket was for careless driving, dated 8/24/02, a rainy weather day. This ticket's # was #19.

He also gave him a ticket for his exhaust being too loud, although he has special mufflers on there that are legal modifications. This ticket # was #20.

The cop told him repeatedly that he was an "a$$hole" and that he "drove like an a$$hole". He also told him that he would be looking out for him and he would make sure he would take his license from him.

What I want to know is what legal recourse we have for this cop threatening and harassing him? Is there anything we can do to get this cop off his back?

 

[JETX]

Ticket #1:
Though I certainly question the officers tactics (iin what you say that he said), but his 'backdating' a ticket is not improper. The point being that is the day that he witnessed the 'violation' (I presume for driving on the wrong side of the road).

Ticket #2:
You don't offer anything controverting the issuance of ticket #2, so I assume that one is not challenged.

Ticket #3:
The officer felt (rightly or wrongly) that the mufflers are in violation. If they aren't, your brother only has to take his receipts and paperwork (showing legal) to the court and the ticket should be dismissed.

Bottom line... if these tickets (any or all) were issued improperly, your brother needs to gather his evidence and go to court. He might also consider filing a complaint with the local police over the officers 'conduct'.

 

[Bravo8]

Do you have any idea how many times I have heard lies told about my conduct toward people on stops? Your brother tells you how the officer acted, and you tell us. So now it's 4th hand. I'm not saying your brother is lying, just that every story has two sides.....mine, yours, and the truth.

As for the citations..........

Officer witnesses violation. At that point in time, is busy and cannot take any action. He doesn't know the driver, but gets a good look at him and recognizes car as a local.

A few days later, Officer sees same car, same driver. Officer initiates traffic stop and cites driver for previous infraction.

Completely legal.

Additionally, I sincerely doubt that the modifications made to the exhaust system are legal. Not being familiar with NJ law, I can only say that certain laws (especially dealing with vehicle equipment) are generally the same state to state.

Chances are ANY external modification to the exhaust to increase noise output is illegal. Yes, it is illegal even the the idiot behind the auto parts store counter said it was ok, and the package said "50 State Legal". Funny.....I don't ask my attorney for medical advice......don't quite understand why anyone wouls accept legal advice from the auto parts clerk......

But I digress............

I agree that if the cop was a jerk as you have posted, your brother may want to speak with his supervisor. Just remember, chances are damn good that your brother's story is a bit embellished.

 

[Neocode]

Bravo,

Obviously you are an officer, and just as obviously, you are looking at this from a jaded viewpoint. You came across as very defensive.

I will clarify this point. The officer said that he recognized the car and not the driver. I don't know about you, but I see an awful lot of black Mustangs on the road. I believed it to be illegal to issue a backdated ticket due to the fact that he had no plate from the previous time, and didn't recognize the driver. It could have been someone else entirely...

The modifications made were installing MagnaFlow replacement mufflers. They meet state requirements for emissions, and are bolt on to the existing exhaust system. So as for noise emissions legality, I would assume that the manufacturer would meet those requirements also. I could be wrong.

And no one asked an auto parts clerk for law advice...

And might I ask why there is a damn good chance my brother has embellished the story? Especially when his friend with him has the exact same story?? Is it because you are an officer and insist on believing that every officer is simply misunderstood, and that there are no arrogant SOB's thinking they are above the law, simply because they enforce the law with a gun and badge?

I respect the brotherhood of police, but I firmly believe that some of the cops I have known do not deserve the badge they wear.

Thank you for your advice.

 

[Bravo8]

Admittedly, I become defensive in situations like this. I try to keep an open mind when someone makes a claim against an officers conduct, but often times it is quite difficult.

As I said, I have heard numerous similar claims against myself and other officers. Complaints about their demeanor, attitude, use of profanity, rudeness, etc. Complaints that I know to be complete bull****.

Also, I frequent quite a few boards similar to this....many police-related. Inevitably once or twice a week, some punk kid who's pissed off becuase the cops won't let him drive like a moron, comes on the board and starts spewing this type of stuff. Let's be realistic, you and I both know that these people are most likely full of ****.

I mean none of the above as a reflection upon you or your brother, so please don't take it as such. I am just attempting to expalin why it is so hard for me to swallow these stories sometimes.

As to your story, I said there is a good chance that your brother embellished the story. Why? Because it's human nature. Do you honestly believe the version your brother related to you is 100% accurate and truthful? Is it not reasonable to believe that your brother will automatically be biased toward his side of the story? Is it not also reasonable to believe that he will likely alter the story (even if ever so slightly) so as to convince others that he is correct? Maybe this isn't the case here, but statistically it would be very likely.

The comment about the auto parts store clerk was just an expression of frustration. That's the excuse I often get when stopping young kids for equipment violations. "The guy at the store said it was legal." is all too common. You yourself stated you assume that it is legal because it meets emission standards. Unfortunately the officer made no mention of emission standards, he said it was too loud.

I know plenty of arrogant officers. That's beside the point. This officer acted out of line if your story is accurate. I am rarely rude toward people, even when they are total jerks. Now I may be out of line here myself, but a young kid and his friend driving a Mustang.........most likely was a litle cocky toward the officer. You may not like my stereotype, but that stereotype exists for a reason. Should the officer have responded in a rude manner even if your brother was a jerk toward him? No, not in my opinion. You remind me of those parents who think their children do nothing wrong.....even though I have arrested them for everything under the sun. Realize that maybe your brother did something to cause the officer to have a nasty attitude. Or maybe the officer was just a jerk.

I misuderstood your inital post. I thought the officer recognized him and the car. He may have a case in court. The officer is going to have to prove that he knows absolutely that your brother is the one he saw driving the first day. Even if he recognizes the car, but not the driver, he'll lose the hearing. The two citations issued on the day of the stop are legit, though (obviously only if the exhaust WAS illegal). I would look into the exhaust law. There may be a law stating that any modifications are illegal. That's the way it is in most states.

Lastly, tell your brother to drive a legal car and not violate any traffic laws. He could probably avoid this problem then.

 

[Neocode]

I can understand where you are coming from 100% Bravo, as far as understanding that you probably do hear quite a lot of garbage from people who are trying to escape responsibilities for their actions.

Obviously, neither of us truly know each other. So with that in mind, I hope you realize I was not insinuating that you are the type of officer I am complaining about.

One thing I will say, is I trust my brother to tell me the truth, whether he did right or wrong. I fully believe him in this. My brother is not at all arrogant when faced with authority. He tends to be a bit of a coward. I am not saying that my brother has always been an angel as far as driving the car is concerned, I'm sure he's not. I know when I was his age, I sped, etc. I however, do believe him that in this situation he did exactly as he said, which is nothing wrong. Overall he is a good kid. As for being 100% accurate, I'm sure some details may have changed, but I believe he got the overtone of the situation 100% correct.

As for the stereotype, I do agree, they are there for a reason. However, like I said, while my brother probably meets the stereotype in general, when it comes to facing trouble, he's not at all arrogant or cocky... he gets frightened.

One other thing, is that I am a parent, but your assessment is incorrect. I firmly believe in taking responsibility for your actions. I have a 9 yr old son, and when he is in trouble in school, if it is for something he did wrong, he suffers the punishment they designate. He knows I will defend him if he is in the right, but if he is wrong, then he pays the price for his actions. And he is aware that as he gets older, if he were to break a law, and be arrested, he'd be spending the night in the cell. I will not protect him or my 2 yr old son from their actions. I can't stand parents that are like you described. By protecting them from their actions, you teach them that it's ok to do wrong, and Mommy and Daddy will always fix your mistakes. However, life is not like that.

It seems that you are a decent officer, and I am sure you have to tolerate a lot of bull with some people when you stop them. I commend you if you are capable of restraining your normal urges to be rude in return. However, not all police officers have that restraint. I have known many, and dealt with many officers. 90% of them are decent people, who do not get enough respect for the work they do. However, that remaining 10% do give the other 90% a bad reputation. They abuse the position they are in, and the authority they are given. That I am sure you will agree with me on.

One last question for you though... regarding the careless driving issued on the day of the stop. How can the officer justify careless driving if my brother told the truth, and he made a left turn from the right lane, into the slow lane of traffic and was traveling at 40 mph in a 55 mph zone? I don't think he can.

And also, as for the muffler system installed on the car, if the manufacturer claims them to be legal, and you purchase them, should you be held responsible? How is the noise level measured for legality anyway? His car is not very loud, I have heard many louder.

Thanks again for your point of view.

 

[Bravo8]

I too can understand your point of view, and I hope I did not insult you with my "parent" comment. I did not intend to insinuate that you were that type of person, only that the impression I was getting from you was the same - that your brother wouldn't do any wrong. I stand corrected as that is obviously not the case here. Now on to the questions..........

I don't know how the "Careless Driving" law reads in NJ. In Pa, the law reads "did drive with careless disregard for persons or property." Pretty ambiguous, huh?

Now if I understand correctly, your brother could not make the turn into the jughandle (man you guys have a lot of those....) from the right lane, so he entered the left lane and made the turn. Is that correct? The construction was right to the edge of the turn? If that's the case, how could he have possibly made the turn from the right lane? Something just doesn't fit. If that's the case, I don't see how he did anything wrong. Was he traveling too fast for the turn?

Mufflers................

Well, Pa law has two separate sections. One says the decieble level cannot exceed a certain level (depending on vehicle). One says no external mods to increase noise output.

In my opinion, if the store sells them (after all, they are only illegal if operated on public streets.....not completely illegal) and you choose to use them, you are still liable.

Same with all those little lights that are appearing on cars lately. The packages say they are legal. And they are....as long as they are not on while you are driving on a public road.

Ignorance is no excuse.