ENRADD in PA

[camcheck]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? PA
I was stopped for doing 56 in a 35 zone. The problem is that I was doing 40. The officer pulled over another car that was in front of me, and then pulled me over. This was 2 cars in one ENRADD stop. I know I don't have a chance in heck of beating this by simply stating the truth, which is that I had cruise control set at 40, and that's how fast I was going. I am sure the cop read his ENRADD device properly. It's just that a million cars look just like mine, and from the distance he was sitting, he saw a silver SUV, period. He pulled over the other car about 2 miles up the road, and then flagged me down. He stated that I was ahead of the other car when he clocked me. Simply false. There may have been another silver SUV, but by the time he caught up to the 1st violator, the 2nd violator was probably gone, and he mistook me for the 2nd violator. How else did the other guy get so far ahead of me? Other than going through all the steps of calibration, etc., what can I do here? Why isn't there a photo taken of the vehicle that is clocked above the limit. It seems that, on a busy roadway, officers parked so far from the road can easily mistake one vehicle for another. I can't afford a ticket or the points. And it really sucks that I am going to suffer the effects of an honest mistake by the cop. But, mistake or not, I am innocent. I've been driving over 30 years and never had a ticket. Simply put, I don't speed. Please help!!What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? PAWhat is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

 

[bolo]

ENRADD accuracy issues

ENRADD can have VERY large speed errors. This may have happened to you.

Team 4 Investigates Pa. Speed Traps - Pittsburgh News Story - WTAE Pittsburgh

Cases have been won in court based on this argument, and if you speak to the officer and discuss the flaw he/she may be willing to reduce the speed.

 

[bolo]

Also, SUV's may be more susceptible to bad ENRADD readings due to their higher bumper. This may well have been what happened to you.

 

[bolo]

YouTube Story on ENRADD accuracy issues

YouTube - Team 4 Investigates Pa. Speed Traps

 

[FlyingRon]

Also, SUV's may be more susceptible to bad ENRADD readings due to their higher bumper. This may well have been what happened to you.

You lost me there. What does the bumper have to do with this glorified stop watch?

 

[bolo]

Check out the story and especially the video. It has diagrams which show the problem.

 

[Kiawah]

by simply stating the truth, which is that I had cruise control set at 40,

I think you'd get some eyebrows raised with that statement. I would suspect that there are very few drivers who would set a cruise control when driving at 40 mph.

55/60/65/70 on highways...sure.

 

[cyjeff]

Not to mention that 40 is still speeding.

 

[Maestro64]

Not to mention that 40 is still speeding.

Not in PA, you not allowed to be stopped unless you 10 over the limit.

 

[Maestro64]

You lost me there. What does the bumper have to do with this glorified stop watch?

FlyingRon,

It used two beams of light to measure time over distance, and if the second beam is set higher then the first the second beam can be broken by a different part of the car than broke the first beam thus shorting the time period and calculating a higher speed.

I developed this defense about 2 yrs ago long before this guy in this video and it has helped a number of people win their case.

What most people fail to understand about measuring someone speed is just because the device says an object was going a specific speed does not make it true and factual. There is no device known to man that measures speeds. Speed is calculated and used other measured data to calculate it. If any of those measurements are off then the speed is wrong. So you are convicting base on bad information.

 

[Maestro64]

camcheck,

Are you saying that from the location that the ENRADD was set up to where the stop was made there was a 2 mile different. With that alone you have lots of reasonable doubt.

Many time ENRADD is used with more than one officer so the officer who made the measurement was not the one who wrote the ticket. That means both must show in court. They usually do not unless they both happen to be at the court at the same time for unrelated tickets.

Besides what is in the video there is actually the second reason for getting a higher speed, a vehicle heading in the opposite direction could have trip the unit and the officer saw your car and assumed it was your car that caused the speed.

Lastly and many times in PA the officer will approach you in court and offer you 5 over and no points if the only reason you are fighting the ticket is to keep form getting points. Considering you said you were 5 over this might be a viable option. However, you know in court you do not have to say how fast you were going the officer has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt you it was your car and that exact speed, you do not have to lie since you not required to testify.

 

[bolo]

ENRADD defense

You may want to check your memory on which ENRADD defenses you came up with, Maestro. I posted a message describing the beam height issue a couple years back (as Area_Man) here:

https://forum.freeadvice.com/speeding-other-moving-violations-13/citation-missing-relevant-information-434053.html

and only afterward did you post some diagrams based on my analysis on this and other boards. Prior to that you were focused on other cars passing from the opposite direction, but not on beam height/alignment, as can be seen from your posts above. In particular your first post in the thread says "The only real error that can occur with this unit is if another car coming the other direction triggers the unit or broke the second beam before your car cross it." Only after I explained the misalignment issue did you start talking about that.

Just trying to keep history accurate and not have it rewritten.

 

[area_man]

ENRADD Defense

Re: the comment from me (bolo) about your memory, maestro, it refers to the comment about you coming up with the bumper/tire trigger defense two years ago...

Again, just trying to keep the record straight.

 

[Maestro64]

Re: the comment from me (bolo) about your memory, maestro, it refers to the comment about you coming up with the bumper/tire trigger defense two years ago...

Again, just trying to keep the record straight.

Actually, I was using this long before your statement and posted them to the other sites since I helped a friend beat his ticket using this technical information, I believe it was fall of 2006. I only shared openly about 2 yrs ago once it became public knowledge by others and the site had locked down the defense area from prying eyes since sharing technical information like this only helps the other side win its case. Now with the news video out the police will change their operating procedures, and this most likely will not be a viable defense.

As you, there were others who came to the same conclusion and there was another guy who file a discovery request and freedom of information request with PennDOT for the testing and set up procedure on ENRADD to demonstrate this fact in court and PA supreme court would not allow the discovery or freedom of information request to go through and they claimed it had no relevance on the case on how it was approved for use. As it turned out it is the same guy in the video and he finally won on this principle. So yeah I am not the first per say but I have been providing this technical information for a long time and know a number of people who use this to win.

The second car one still works unless the officer is right there or YIS changes its design but I doubt they will since it a nice feature to catch speeders in both directions.

 

[camcheck]

Also, SUV's may be more susceptible to bad ENRADD readings due to their higher bumper. This may well have been what happened to you.

Bolo - Thank you. I took pictures of the devices, albeit from a distance. I will see if I can tell whether the infrared eyes are set level. I can certainly ask the cop if he used a level or measured to verify the height. I'll bet he didn't. The devices were not on the road - they were either on the curb or on the grass. So it is definitely possible that they were not level. I will also look at whether the road is level at that point. I just wish I didn't have to deal with all this. But I guess I will do what I gotta do.