Failure To Stop At The Traffic Light

[shadowu0083]

Here's the situation. I am in CA, one day I was in a 25 miles zone, came to a traffic light, as soon as I almost arrived at the traffic light, I saw the light changed to yellow, so I hit the break, slow down to about 6-8 miles and made the right turn. I was still slowing down while I was making the right turn. Traffic light turned red while I was making right turn and the car on the other side of the traffic light came at full acceleration, so I had to pull over to let him pass, as soon as he pass me, a cop came from behind to pull me over, said I didn't make a stop making a right turn at a red light and gave me a ticket. I tried to explain to him but of course, he did not listen. About 3 weeks later, I got the notice from the Superior Court, this ticket will cost me $365.00!!! This is outrageous, so I am planning to apear at the court to dispute this. Can you help me? Do I have any chance to win this one or at least any better way to make them think I was right? By the way, I took the traffic class less than 18 month ago, so paying this ticket and go to traffic school to remove 3 points in not an option. Thanks a lot!!!

 

[CdwJava]

If you were almost hit by a car coming through the intersection in the lane that you had just turned in to, that would indicate that the other guy's light was green, OR he blew a red light. Depending on the speed at the intersection, if the light turned red while you were in mid-right turn, you should have had more than 4 seconds to finish the turn and control the lane - this is ample time to get within the lane and start to accelerate. When you factor in the time it takes for the other driver to cross the intersection from a dead start, you at LEAST double that time.

Unless you can successfully claim that the other driver blew a red light, the circumstances as you describe them would seem to imply that you conducted your turn on the red light ... or, you were proceeding at an incredibly slow pace.

It's your call as to what to do to defend yourself, but it seems you have little choice but to give it a go. I think the best you can hope for is the officer not showing up in court.

Oh - exactly what was the section you were cited for violating?

- Carl

 

[shadowu0083]

Hi Carl,

Thank you for your reply. One thing I don't understand was I was making a right turn when the light was yellow, I saw it by my own eye. Once I completed the turn, I saw the car came close to me rapidly through the mirror, so I pull it over in order to let that fast car drive pass me and then I started driving again. As soon as I started to drive again, the police officer pull me over. If I was clearly making a red light right turn, I would not made the right turn at 5-10 mph, and I would not pull over to let the car drive by me. Remember, he was not close to me from behind, I saw him came close to me rapidly and that's why I pull over to let him pass. The cop saw me pull over to let that car drove by me and then pull me over. I was making a right turn at the intersection of bellew drive and barber lane. This is a very small intersection, so car speed isn't that fast. I think the speed limit is about 25 mph. I was driving at a very slow pace, approxmitely 10-15 after I made the right turn. The reason I was drive this slow is because after I made the right turn, about 400 feet, I will have to make a left turn to turn into this shopping mall at the left. So do you think I still should plea guilty and pay $365.00 plus the insurance gain? Or do I have any chance?

Thank you very much!

Willis

 

[CdwJava]

A lot will depend upon the vantage point of the officer - what he saw and where he saw it from. The size of the intersection, span covered, and related information will play a part as well.

What section were you cited for?

- Carl

 

[shadowu0083]

Hi Carl,

It was at Milpitas, CA. Intersection of Bellew drive and Barber lane. The cop saw me from behind while I was making the right turn and pull me over after the right turn. The intersection is very small, two lanes each on both roads of the intersection. That was one of the reason I want to dispute this because both lanes are small, so the intersection is small. If the car came behind me at full accerlation, he could hit me even if I made the turn at the yellow light. Like I said, after I made the right turn, about 100 feet later I pull over to let that car drove by me and then less than 25 feet I was pull over. So I think I made a mistake that I made the turn on yellow light, but I definately did not make the turn on red, and my ticket was fail to make a stop at the red light, which is not true. By the way, the code name and section was 21453(a).

Thank you,

Willis

 

[CdwJava]

Yes, that's the section for a red light.

Okay, it will likely come down to vantage points. If the officer was in a position to observe both the light AND your crossing the limit line into the intersection, then he will probably prevail. If he was tangent to the light (i.e. did not see your light because he was at a right angle) then you might have a chance because he was likely basing his presumption of you running the red on the timing of the light in front of him turning green.

However, I am only guessing. And while I am vaguely familiar with the intersection of which you speak, I am not familiar enough with it to picture it in my mind at all.

I'm still trying to picture HOW a car came up on you so fast that you had to pull over, however. So it would seem that you might have to argue that the other driver ran the red light to have come upon you so fast, or, he weas speeding excessively, or, you were traveling at a snail's pace. On the face of it - if the other vehicle was not ripping along at 50+ - then it might appear that you did indeed run the light .. unless the timing on the lights are off (i.e. no delay between red in your direction adn the green in the direction the other car came from).

It's not going to be an easy sell.

- Carl

 

[shadowu0083]

Hi Carl,

Thank you for your reply. I don't know how fast the driver was doing, and like I said, the cop was behind me before I made the turn, and then followed me after the turn. After I made the turn, I was still driving at 10-15 mph. I am also sure that the other driver did not run the red light, but he's fast. It is an orange Pontiac Grand Prix. I can even remember the color and what kind of car because he's coming closer to me through the mirror so fast. Nobody can tell how fast he was driving, but since I had to make the left turn in about 400 feet, so I was only driving at 10-15 mph. That's probably why he's so close to me. Also I am sure he's doing full acceration after green light at the light, but nobody can tell. I think according to what you said, this will come down to the winning point. Since this won't make anybody believe, even at the court, then I guess I really don't have a point winning this battle.

So now what I need to do is to show up at the court, try to explain to the judge, and hope he will listen to me. If not, then plea guilty and pay the fine and the points if I don't what any further trouble. Or, plea not guilty, setup another date with the officer and see who wins. If he didn't show, then that's my only chance. If he did, then its all on God's hands. Is this procedure right?

Thank you,

Willis

 

[CdwJava]

Okay - I missed the part where the officer had been behind you when you made your turn.

Apparently one of you misjudged the light or the limit line.

The best chance you have is if the officer doesn't show at the trial. If he does show you can ask to plead no contest and ask for traffic school. Or, you can try to argue it out. But, usually, unless the officer admits to having a bad vantage point on cross, his word will generally prevail.

The other option is to plead not guilty, ask for a trial by written declaration, and if THAT fails THEN ask for a new trial (trial de novo) and see what happens. The problem with the declaration and new trial is that very often traffic school is no longer an option there.

If it were me, I'd go to court and ask for traffic school if the officer showed.

Your other option is to see if you can get a free consultation with an attorney that specializes in traffic matters. There might be some long term ramifications to insurance rates that may make this worthwhile.

- Carl

 

[shadowu0083]

Hi Carl,

Thank you very much for your advise. I guess traffic school is not my option because I tool one about 13 month ago. Unless the court judge says I can, otherwise I don't think I can. I will try to explain to the judge at the court, like you said, somebody misjudge the traffic light, and it is 50/50 chance. If the judge thinks I am wrong, which I am 100% positive, then forget it. That's all I can do anyways.

Thanks for your advise and all your help,

Willis