License suspended after photo radar violation

[danotr]

I got a ticket by photo radar / speed camera in Tempe, AZ for going 11mph over. I decided to go the route of ignoring the ticket. So attempt was made to serve me, I wasn't home, a packet with the ticket was left by the server (which did not say "You have been served"). I ignored this. Yesterday I got a letter from the City of Tempe saying that my license is suspended. Now I am pretty nervous -- My understanding was that it works to just ignore it until it goes away. But driving on a suspended license. . .doesn't seem like a good idea. Any advice?

[seniorjudge]

You need to surrender; I suspect a warrant has been issued for your arrest.

[occharge]

Originally Posted by danotr

Yesterday I got a letter from the City of Tempe saying that my license is suspended.

Check the "status" of your license with the DMV as they are the "authority" on license suspensions.

[JustAPal00]

The only way it will go away is if you make it. Call the courts and find out how much you have to pay to make it go away, then pay it. You should have paid the ticket, it would have been no points, just a fine. If you get caught driving while suspended, it will really cost you and you will get a longer suspension.

[danotr]

Originally Posted by seniorjudge

You need to surrender; I suspect a warrant has been issued for your arrest.

The letter that I got didn't say anything about a warrant being issued, it just said that I need to send payment for the fine (which I can grumpily do) with a copy of the letter. In the end, I think I will do just that -- I don't need to have a driving under suspended license on my record.

Originally Posted by JustAPal00

The only way it will go away is if you make it. Call the courts and find out how much you have to pay to make it go away, then pay it. You should have paid the ticket, it would have been no points, just a fine. If you get caught driving while suspended, it will really cost you and you will get a longer suspension.

I don't think that this is true in AZ. They are trying to change the law (to make it easier for the government to make more money off of the cameras) so that it won't have points, but right now I think it is two points. Correct me if I'm wrong.

So they called my bluff and I'm scared enough to just pay it. But I'm still curious whether this is legal. My reading of Ariz.R.Civ.P. 4.1(c)(1), (2) and "Jeffrey J. TONNER, Plaintiff-Appellee, v. PARADISE VALLEY MAGISTRATE'S COURT and Hon. Lester Penterman, a magistrate thereof, Town of Paradise Valley, a municipal corporation, and the State of Arizona, Defendants-Appellants" is that I was never served so the court has no jurisdiction to do anything. Yes, I was speeding, albeit not in a way that I believe posed any danger to anyone, they used a law to fine me, and I thought that I was using another law to not pay the fine. I don't like the idea of them throwing out the law, which has now become inconvenient to them, to scare me into paying it.

[danotr]

So the end of the story. . .

I called Tempe Court, and they pulled the file and found that the process server had told them that I had been served. This was blatantly not true. He had given the papers to a man that lives in the same house, who had told them that he could not guarantee that I would ever get the papers, given that we often go weeks without seeing each other. He specifically refused service on my behalf. So the moral of the story is, unless you are willing to risk having your license suspended, don't trust the tactic of assuming that you are hard enough to find that you won't be served. They may just leave the packet on your doorstep so that they can collect their fee from the government. On the other hand, it's not so bad in the end: Cost me an extra $70 and a trip to the DMV.

[occharge]

Originally Posted by danotr

... He had given the papers to a man that lives in the same house....

Isn't that still "proper service"???

[danotr]

Originally Posted by occharge

Isn't that still "proper service"???

I'm no lawyer, but my understanding is that the person must accept service (i.e. state that he is willing to take responsibility for delivering the papers, and can reliably do so). Otherwise, I may not even be living in the same house. As it is, I can although I live with this man, I can literally go weeks without seeing him. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that was legal service, and I'm certain that the server was well aware that it wasn't. Now maybe I just want somewhat to be angry at because I'm stuck paying the fine I wanted to avoid. . .but still it does seem like a pretty important legal point that a process server is honest about service.

[mmmagique]

Nah, you were served. Especially since it's your (or your friend's) word against the process server's. And in many cases they only have to leave it on your door, or give it to an adult in the house.

If they couldn't find you, they could just send it to your last known address, and call you served. It's called constructive service when they do that. I call it pretend service. But it still gets the job done.

[danotr]

Well, you probably know better than I, but if what you say is true, than I don't see how the (widespread) practice here of avoiding traffic tickets by avoiding service works. People just don't answer their door for a few months after getting a ticket in the mail, and from everyone else that I heard, the tickets just get dropped.

Dan

[mmmagique]

It doesn't work that way here. If you don't contest or pay your fine, you lose your license and/or get a bench warrant!

[occharge]

Originally Posted by danotr

Well, you probably know better than I, but if what you say is true, than I don't see how the (widespread) practice here of avoiding traffic tickets by avoiding service works. People just don't answer their door for a few months after getting a ticket in the mail, and from everyone else that I heard, the tickets just get dropped.

Dan.

Rule 4.1 Process: Service of Process Within Arizona.
(d) Service of Summons Upon Individuals:
Service upon an individual from whom a waiver has not been obtained and filed, other than those specified in paragraphs (e), (f) and (g) of this Rule 4.1, shall be effected by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to that individual personally or by leaving copies thereof at that individual's dwelling house or usual place of abode with some person of suitable age and discretion then residing therein or by delivering a copy of the summons and of the pleading to an agent authorized by appointment or by law to receive service of process.

The good thing is that you took care of it before it escalated into something that would have turned out to be more exensive & time consuming than it should have been.
All's well that ends well!

[betrthnever]

From the research I've done it seems that the only legal way to truly receive a summons in Arizona is by being served. And also it seems to be illegal to leave a summons at the door (like in the screen) or even with a minor. Not sure about the legalities of leaving it with someone other then the person being summoned. There are many cases where photo radar tickets were dismissed because the process server left it where they shouldn't have. My friends husband is a lawyer and he ignored a ticket from Scottsdale, was never served, and the ticket was dismissed. He WAS served his ticket from Tempe.

That being said, in the case where the license is suspended that it itself could be fought and would be grounds for dismissal of the ticket. But taking the chances, I don't know if its worth it.

[danotr]

Originally Posted by betrthnever

That being said, in the case where the license is suspended that it itself could be fought and would be grounds for dismissal of the ticket. But taking the chances, I don't know if its worth it.

Not worth it. I can afford $70, I can't afford significant legal problems. So I paid the ticket over the phone, had them fax me the latter saying so, and I'll take it to the DMV tomorrow. And I'm VERY careful not to speed in the interim! I did fax them a letter saying that I don't think I was served and I shouldn't have to pay it, but I'm not willing to go to court to fight it.

Originally Posted by occharge

All's well that ends well!

Dan

[fairisfair]

He could probably fight the manner of service, in court, at which time, he would be served.

Pay the ticket.

Most of the tickets served up on the 101 are never actually given service. That is why so many people ignore them. The server handed the documents to an adult male at the address you provided to the MVD. You will be the one proving that it wasn't you.

My other advice. Cruise control...set it at 74. oh...oops, I mean 65..grin...

the fact is they are set to flash at 76. so where you decide to set it......well....that's up to you of course...