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05-21-2008, 03:15 PM
| | Junior Member | | Join Date: May 2008
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| | | Motorcycle right of way next to parked cars?
Traveling south in the District of Columbia and turning left at a lighted intersection. Two opposing traffic lanes. Outside curb lanes used for parking at that time. (Curb lane open for traffic in rush hour.) Northbound traffic congested and virtually stopped. Northbound car entering intersection stopped to permit my left turn. Motorcycle passing him on right hit me at speed. Officer gave me a ticket for failure to yield right-of-way.
It was impossible for me to see the motorcyclist approaching behind the stopped line of traffic or for him to see me. My contention is that the ticket was improper because motorcyclist did not have the right of way, not operating in a lane. Under that condition, the following regulations make his passing illegal:
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2202.5 The driver of a vehicle may overtake and pass upon the right of another vehicle only under the following conditions:
(a) When the vehicle overtaken is making or about to make a left turn;
(b) On a street or highway with unobstructed pavement not occupied by parked vehicles and of sufficient width for two (2) or more lines of moving vehicles in each direction; and
(c) On a one-way street or upon any roadway upon which traffic is restricted to one direction of movement; where the roadway is free from obstructions and of sufficient width for two (2) or more lines of moving vehicles.
2202.6 The driver of a vehicle may overtake and pass another vehicle on the right only under conditions permitting such movement in safety. In no event shall the
passing movement be made by driving off the pavement or main-traveled portion of the roadway.
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05-21-2008, 03:21 PM
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| | | You are wrong...
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05-21-2008, 04:18 PM
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| | | Could you please explain? How did he acquire the right of way? The regulations say
A person operating a bicycle may overtake and pass other vehicles on the left or right side, staying in the same lane as the overtaken vehicle, or changing to a different lane, or riding off the roadway, as necessary to pass with safety.
but motorcycles don't have those rights. |
05-21-2008, 08:54 PM
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| | | If you had a red light and he had a green light, every thing else is irrelevant.
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05-21-2008, 10:24 PM
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| | | Was I unclear? I was going south, turning left on a green light. He was going north, entering the intersection on a green light. If there had been two northbound traffic lanes, I would have been clearly at fault, since he would have been proceeding legally. What I asked was whether the fact that he was operating in the space next to parked cars, passing to the right, outside the northbound lane, invalidated his presumptive right-of-way. |
05-22-2008, 12:07 AM
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| | | You may not make a left-hand turn without first ensuring that it is safe for you to do so, regardless of whether or not somebody else was breaking the law (this includes if somebody was running a red light across the intersection and you made a left hand turn and caused a collision; you would be at fault).
Question: if the motorcycle was operating in a lane on the other side of parking, then would you have hit a pedestrian due to lack of observation, since any pedestrians would also have been on the other side of parking?
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05-22-2008, 08:31 AM
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| | | Not that this is terribly unusual but I disagree with the others, to a point.
Since the motorcycle was driving illegally and if that placed him in a position that you were not able to see him, I do believe this would remove some of the fault, at a minimum, maybe. I believe the exact situation is needed to determine the fault.
Why did the driver stop to let you turn? That in itself is an odd action. If that driver was far enough into the intersection to make the motorcyclist believe he was turning left, then the motorcycle simply went around the car; your fault.
If the car that hesitated was not into the intersection and the motorcycle was illegally passing the car, then I support your position.
The exact dynamics of the situation are too critical to allow this to be settled here. If you want to contest it, simply go to court and present your reasoning for your defense. Never know; you may get lucky and have a judge with a sympathetic ear.
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05-22-2008, 10:44 AM
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| | | those going straight have the right away over those turning left in front of them, period. |
05-22-2008, 11:20 AM
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| | Quote:
Originally Posted by VeronicaLodge  those going straight have the right away over those turning left in front of them, period. | AMEN!!!  |
05-22-2008, 06:10 PM
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| | | I will admit that most likely the OP is at fault but there are situations that would place that fault on the shoulders of others. Unlikely, but possible.
In occultists description of the green light red light, he is just plain not right. Anybody running a red light is at fault, especially if they hit a person with a green light. I don't care if I was doing donuts in the intersection. As long as I have a green light and a guy with a red light disregards its' direction, they are at fault.
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05-23-2008, 06:01 AM
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Originally Posted by justalayman Anybody running a red light is at fault, especially if they hit a person with a green light. I don't care if I was doing donuts in the intersection. As long as I have a green light and a guy with a red light disregards its' direction, they are at fault. | I will have to claim ignorance for the rules in the OP's state, and I was [incorrectly] basing my answer on the statutes in mine, which are set to to specifically explain that you may not turn if it is not safe to do so; if somebody is approaching the intersection too fast despite their red light status, you still may not make the turn until you "know" that it is safe for you to do so. That's how I've seen it go down watching traffic court, but again, I should not have ignorantly applied this to the OP's situation 
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05-23-2008, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by The Occultist I will have to claim ignorance for the rules in the OP's state, and I was [incorrectly] basing my answer on the statutes in mine, which are set to to specifically explain that you may not turn if it is not safe to do so; if somebody is approaching the intersection too fast despite their red light status, you still may not make the turn until you "know" that it is safe for you to do so. That's how I've seen it go down watching traffic court, but again, I should not have ignorantly applied this to the OP's situation | what state are you in O? Not inferring you are lieing, just would like to read it for myself.
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05-24-2008, 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by justalayman what state are you in O? Not inferring you are lieing, just would like to read it for myself. | Arizona. I'll also admit to not having read any statutes, but this is based on court rulings of the traffic courts I have sat in on. If you find relevant statutes, whether they support or disagree with me, I will definitely be more than interested in reading them!
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05-29-2008, 09:40 AM
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| | | Justalayman wrote:
"Why did the driver stop to let you turn? That in itself is an odd action."
Not under the circumstances. Since his lane was congested, he couldn't have gone far beyond the intersection in any case. He might even have been concerned that he would not have been able to clear the intersection before the light changed. |
05-29-2008, 05:04 PM
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| | | A similar situation happened in a neighborhood where I live. A motorcycle was traveling around 100mph (according to the police) in a 25mph zone. Someone made a left turn in front of him and he hit the car broadside and died. The driver of the car was not cited because the motorcycle was breaking the law.
This situation is similar just replace the speeding with driving on the shoulder. I think the OP has it right, motorcycle was not operating in an approved lane of travel and was therefore breaking the law and caused an accident. If the motorcycle had gone straight from a right turn lane he would be at fault, wouldn't this fall under the same category?
Does DC allow lane sharing (that's what they call it in CA)? If so, it could change things. | |
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