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NYS speeding ticket I-90 West bound: wrong vehicle

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vjr1976

Junior Member
What is the name of your state? New York

This past weekend my wife and I were traveling on I-90, West bound headed toward the Utica area. There was a NYS Trooper on the right shoulder of the road who had pulled a vehicle over. The Trooper was inside his vehicle writing a ticket for the vehicle he had pulled over.
I proceeded to change lanes and enter the passing lane as did the rest of the vehicles in front and behind me. Directly in front of me was a station wagon with NH plates and in front of the station wagon was a tractor trailer. Once I passed the Trooper, I changed lanes and proceeded to head West. Ten miles later, the Trooper pulls up behind me and pulls me over. The Trooper introduced himself, “State police” and proceeded to ask me if I knew why he pulled me over. I simply stated “no” and then the Trooper stated that he had clocked me, while writing his ticket for the previous vehicle, going past him at a speed of 81 miles per hour (speed limit is 65). The trooper also stated that although there were vehicles behind me, there were no vehicles ahead of me. The ticket issued was for speeding, 1180D, at a speed of 80 miles per hour, direct observation made using Stalker Dual radar.
When I entered the passing lane on I-90 West bound, before I passed the Trooper as he was writing a ticket for the other vehicle, I glanced at my speedometer and noticed that my speed was less than 75 miles per hour. My wife also glanced at the speedometer and noticed that my speed was approximately 71 miles per hour. We were also traveling with two dogs who were asleep on the back seat of the car as we were traveling. The Trooper asked me if I knew how he identified my car and I stated I did not know. The Trooper stated that he saw my dogs in the vehicle as we passed him in the passing lane heading West bound on I-90. As stated, both dogs were fast asleep on the back seat until I pulled over at mile marker 184.3.
I documented the entire conversation, as this is part of my job (I am an Investigator for the DHHS), and documented the inconsistencies with the Troopers observations. Initially I thought that this would be adequate to refute the ticket, and also with a witness in the vehicle, but I realize now that it is my word (and my wife’s) against the Troopers.
I submitted the ticket and plead not guilty but once again it is my word against the Trooper. I intended to explain the inconsistencies to the DA at Town Court, but realized it would be irrational to think that I could have the ticket dismissed based on the documented conversation alone. This is my fist speeding ticket since I have been driving (13 years). Is there any way to plead to a lesser charge? If so, how to I go about doing so?
 


lwpat

Senior Member
Start by requesting a deposition. Next check your speedometer. This is easy to do on an interstate between the milemarkers. Once you have the troopers statement and know if your speedometer is correct you will have a better idea on how to proceed.

Normally there will be an opportunity to discuss your case at a pretrial hearing and negotiate for a lesser fine/points. Don't be surprised that it takes some time for the court to set a date for the trial. In some places in NY it is now taking up to a year. Be sure to contact the court clerk and verify that you request for a trial has been received.
 

vjr1976

Junior Member
lwpat, thanks for responding. The speedometer is ok. How do I make a request for a deposition (where, to whom, etc)? I assume the deposition will be a form of FOI? The trooper supplied me with "Supporting Deposition /CPL 710.301(1)(A) Notice to support simplified Traffic Information Local Crimminal Court". There are no comments listed under the "Additional Information" section, but is it the same form I would request as stated above (FOI able form) or a different version with the officer's notes?

Originally I thought that if I plead not guilty, I would be "advised" by a DA. After reading a few posts here, I guess it is straight to trial? I was conducting an investigation in the area and drove by the town court that was listed on my "violation"and it looks like a red barn.
 

qcxlvr1

Member
The 710.30 that you were provided with is the supporting deposition. State Police are now giving violators supporting depositions in the field.
 

snostar

Senior Member
qcxlvr1 said:
State Police are now giving violators supporting depositions in the field.
Really? Is that because people were getting tickets dismissed because the request for a deposition was not answered by the officer?
 

qcxlvr1

Member
snostar said:
Really? Is that because people were getting tickets dismissed because the request for a deposition was not answered by the officer?
Yes, thats exactly the reason.

There is one court in New York where you will never receive a supporting deposition even if you request it and can basicially get out of any ticket, but I won't say where.

Most people don't understand or know what a supporting deposition is, and if they do, they don't understand the CPL or how to word a motion to dismiss. None of this applies in DMV run traffic courts though
 

snostar

Senior Member
qcxlvr1 said:
Yes, thats exactly the reason.

There is one court in New York where you will never receive a supporting deposition even if you request it and can basicially get out of any ticket, but I won't say where.

Most people don't understand or know what a supporting deposition is, and if they do, they don't understand the CPL or how to word a motion to dismiss. None of this applies in DMV run traffic courts though
I had a few tickets dismissed this way, a long time ago....back when I was a speedster. :D

Do you know if this has cascaded down to the local level anywhere, or does it just apply to tickets issued by State Police?
 

vjr1976

Junior Member
Most people don't understand or know what a supporting deposition is, and if they do, they don't understand the CPL or how to word a motion to dismiss. None of this applies in DMV run traffic courts though


From what I gather, the deposition is a statement that I made to the officer on the date I was issued the violation. Although I stated nothing, and the page is blank.

"Please take notice that pursuant to section 710.30(1)(A) of the crimminal procedure law, the people intend to offer at a trial of the above entitled action of evidence of a statement made by you (this section blank) on (date, time and location), To (Officer) a public servant, in which you substantially stated as follows (blank).

Sounds to me that the deposition alrerady presumes guilt without admission, so therefore plead guilty and fork over the dough.
 

qcxlvr1

Member
vjr1976 said:
Most people don't understand or know what a supporting deposition is, and if they do, they don't understand the CPL or how to word a motion to dismiss. None of this applies in DMV run traffic courts though


From what I gather, the deposition is a statement that I made to the officer on the date I was issued the violation. Although I stated nothing, and the page is blank.

"Please take notice that pursuant to section 710.30(1)(A) of the crimminal procedure law, the people intend to offer at a trial of the above entitled action of evidence of a statement made by you (this section blank) on (date, time and location), To (Officer) a public servant, in which you substantially stated as follows (blank).

Sounds to me that the deposition alrerady presumes guilt without admission, so therefore plead guilty and fork over the dough.
Well, its not a statement that you made. The officer, when completing the statement, is the deponent, so it's a statement he is making and this can include admissions that you may have made at the time of the stop.

Its your right to request and have the deposition. A ticket is only a simplified information which must be supported by the deposition, requested upon demand. Just because you have it does not mean you can't still plea bargain with the local court.
 

qcxlvr1

Member
snostar said:
I had a few tickets dismissed this way, a long time ago....back when I was a speedster. :D

Do you know if this has cascaded down to the local level anywhere, or does it just apply to tickets issued by State Police?
It's a system called "TRA-CS" or something that a number of State Police cars are being equipped with. I think some of the Sheriff's Offices upstate have them. The software is free--the agency just needs to provide hardware. So, I'd imagine we will see it in other agencies across the state eventually.
 

vjr1976

Junior Member
Its your right to request and have the deposition. A ticket is only a simplified information which must be supported by the deposition, requested upon demand.

Please correct me if I misunderstood, but above you stated that NYS Troopers already provide depositions, therefore, there is no need to request them.


Just because you have it does not mean you can't still plea bargain with the local court.

I heard the NYS Courts are decreasing plea bargains for traffic tickets. Making the fines higher and points almost certain.
 

qcxlvr1

Member
vjr1976 said:
Its your right to request and have the deposition. A ticket is only a simplified information which must be supported by the deposition, requested upon demand.

Please correct me if I misunderstood, but above you stated that NYS Troopers already provide depositions, therefore, there is no need to request them.


Just because you have it does not mean you can't still plea bargain with the local court.

I heard the NYS Courts are decreasing plea bargains for traffic tickets. Making the fines higher and points almost certain.
If you were already supplied the supporting deposition, then no, there is no need to request it. That doesn't mean go ahead and pay the thing unless of course you want to plead guilty.

I'm not sure where you heard that you can't plea bargain or that it is decreasing. No one has the authority to tell a local court they can't conduct plea bargains. Pataki had introduced some sort of legislation that would require the state get a bulk of the money on some tickets, but that was quickly squashed after local courts complained. Plea bargaining is not conducted in DMV run courts.
 

vjr1976

Junior Member
qcxlvr1.I appreciate your insight with this matter. I would definately prefer to plea bargain and have the ticket reduced if possible. I just don't want the whole matter to go to trial because I can't win. Hopefully the DA will be understanding, but doesn't the Trooper have a say in the reduction of a ticket as well? especially if he does show up at court.

As this is my first time in court, what are some keys to plea bargaining? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks to anyone who can help.
 

snostar

Senior Member
While you are waiting to be called, the DA will present a plea to a public defender. The public defender will then present you with the plea offered. It is basically a take-it or leave-it deal. The public defender will be able to tell you what fine and/or points will result from accepting the plea and what fine and/or points would result from the ticket as it stands. Dress appropriately.
 

qcxlvr1

Member
vjr1976 said:
qcxlvr1.I appreciate your insight with this matter. I would definately prefer to plea bargain and have the ticket reduced if possible. I just don't want the whole matter to go to trial because I can't win. Hopefully the DA will be understanding, but doesn't the Trooper have a say in the reduction of a ticket as well? especially if he does show up at court.

As this is my first time in court, what are some keys to plea bargaining? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks to anyone who can help.
I am not familiar with the courts upstate, but I will tell you if it is a tiny little court, the trooper will probably be the prosecutor. They will often deal just like a prosecutor does. If I understand your post correctly, your ticket is for 80 in a 65, making it 25 over, which is 6 points.

I believe you're probably looking at an 1110(a), fail to observe traffic control device which is two points and a $100 something fine. If they're REALLY generous, you might get something like "parked on highway" which carries no points, but I'm not sure if they'll offer you that.
 

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