Reckless driving charge in CA

[glolar]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California

While driving, I was reaching back for my iPod. When I looked up, I had drifted into the lane next to me (not even half way), and I quickly reacted by pulling the wheel left to get back into my lane. My 3 buddies (in the vehicle) were taken by surprise by this, and started hooting, so stupidly, I purposely did a quick "fishtail" (I know, stupid). Only did it twice (if you count the accidental one).

Pulled into a sandwich shop to get a sandwich, and a cop comes inside a few minutes later and shouts "Who drives the white Jeep?" He tells me that a WITNESS called them and reported someone "driving recklessly". He asked me what happened, and I was honest with him about the TWO fishtails. He was very polite, and so was I. He leaves the sandwich shop, and another cop comes in, confronts me VERY rudely, and starts loudly telling me "You are gonna pay! I am impounding your vehicle for 30 days and it is going to cost you $1400 to get it out!" (Remember, no copy saw anything. They came to the scene based on a phone call from another driver). Turns out, THREE cop cars showed up to the parking lot, and interviewed the "witness". Cop "claims" she told him I was "weaving in and out of traffic", and that people were "jumping in and out of the jeep, acting crazy". Total BS. It is a 50mph road where it occurred, and NO ONE got out of the jeep. The rude cop impounded my vehicle, and wrote me up for the following:

23103a - Reckless Driving (Cop cirled "I" for Infraction, rather than "M" for Misdemeanor)
16028a - No Proof of Insurance
4454 a - No Registration Card
5200 - No Front License Plate
27315 e - Allowing Passenger without seatbelt (no back seat in the Jeep)

He also wrote the estimated speed as 60 (not true), but did not cite me for speeding (Speed limit was 50).

I am 19, this is my father's vehicle, I AM and WAS insured to drive it (and have proof), and now have the Registration and front license plate. My father had the vehicle in for repair recently and had removed everything from the glove box (reg and proof of insurance). The front plate kept falling off (lost screw), and he had not yet replaced it.

I already know I can remedy the 16028a, 4454a and 5200 by presenting evidence, and that he's got me on the no-seat belt law, but I was not "driving with a willful and wanton disregard" for the safety of others (legal definition of reckless driving, according to the vehicle code).

Questions:

(1) Since the cop circled "I" for the 23103 a (reckless driving) could I still be charged with a misdemeanor? (2) Can I really be convicted (and possibly go to jail) based on what a "witness" says??? (3) What are the chances of me paying a fine for the seatbelt law and getting accepted for traffic school for the "reckless driving"? If I get TWO points, I will probably lose my insurance (and my job, cause I won't have transportation). If it counts for anything, I have NO prior record, get decent grades in college, don't drink or party, and work 30 hours a week to help pay rent and other costs at home. The only "good" news is that I "only" had to pay $500 to get the jeep out of impound, because I petitioned to get it out early, and based on the evidence, the police let me get it out after two days.

Sorry for the LONG post, but this has just been a nightmare for me and my family.

Thanks for any advice/help you can give. Note: (No, I cannot afford a lawyer).

Thanks again.What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

 

[CdwJava]

(1) Since the cop circled "I" for the 23103 a (reckless driving) could I still be charged with a misdemeanor?

Yes. The charge can be amended up until your court date.

(2) Can I really be convicted (and possibly go to jail) based on what a "witness" says???

Yes.

(3) What are the chances of me paying a fine for the seatbelt law and getting accepted for traffic school for the "reckless driving"?

CVC 23103 should cost you about $564 (per the California recommended bail and fee schedule) and add two points to your license. Also, per CVC 42005 this violation is NOT eligible for traffic school.

It might be possible to negotiate (plea) the offense down, but you might have to contact the DA's office and find out if they deal on traffic offenses.

The only "good" news is that I "only" had to pay $500 to get the jeep out of impound, because I petitioned to get it out early, and based on the evidence, the police let me get it out after two days.

I suspect they let it out because you were not the registered owner and your father did not admit to knowing you were driving recklessly (which means they essentially HAD to release it per the CVC).


- Carl

 

[glolar]

Carl,

Thanks for the answers. One other question. If the charge can be amended up until my court date, what if it doesn't come up UNTIL I get to court?

Thanks again.

 

[CdwJava]

Carl,

Thanks for the answers. One other question. If the charge can be amended up until my court date, what if it doesn't come up UNTIL I get to court?

Thanks again.

Once you appear before the court, they cannot generally amend the original charges. There are ways that can be done before trial, but it is extremely rare. If they intend to make this a misdemeanor, you will know before your court appearance because it would transfer your case from traffic court to superior court.

- Carl

 

[I_Got_Banned]

Once you appear before the court, they cannot generally amend the original charges. There are ways that can be done before trial, but it is extremely rare. If they intend to make this a misdemeanor, you will know before your court appearance because it would transfer your case from traffic court to superior court.

- Carl

Additionally, you are entitled to knowing what charges you're defending yourself against beforehand so that you are fully prepared to defend yourself accordingly.

Chances are, if its gonna be amended, you will hear about it within the next week or two after the incident.

Since this is an Infraction and since a D.A. Will more likely not be involved, (and Carl can correct me on this) a charge is usually amended when the citing officer consults with a supervisor who will typically advise him/her whether he/she should amend up or down based on evidence, circumstances, statements... etc.

 

[CdwJava]

Since this is an Infraction and since a D.A. Will more likely not be involved, (and Carl can correct me on this) a charge is usually amended when the citing officer consults with a supervisor who will typically advise him/her whether he/she should amend up or down based on evidence, circumstances, statements... etc.

Typically, yes.


- Carl

 

[I_Got_Banned]

But wait, I had a couple more things to say. But before I do, let me preface my comments by stating that I am neither an attorney nor am I in law enforcement. Just a big mouth, as I'm sure some people on here will say. Anyway. . .

he's got me on the no-seat belt law, but I was not "driving with a willful and wanton disregard" for the safety of others (legal definition of reckless driving, according to the vehicle code).

I disagree, I think he's got you on both! Here, let me tell you who & how:

One:

While driving

Two:

(no back seat in the Jeep)

Three:

My 3 buddies (in the vehicle)

Four(a):

Allowing Passenger without seatbelt (no back seat in the Jeep)

And another:
Four(b):

Allowing Passenger without seatbelt (no back seat in the Jeep)

(2 passengers without a seat/seatbelt)

five:

estimated speed as 60

Six:

I was reaching back for my iPod.

Seven:

I had drifted into the lane next to me

Eight:

I quickly reacted by pulling the wheel left

- - -

My 3 buddies (in the vehicle). . . . started hooting, so stupidly,

Nine:

I purposely did a quick "fishtail"

Your "driving with a wilful & wanton disregard for the safety of others" started with #s "Two" & "Three". <mainly disregarding the safety of your 2 buddies sitting in the back seat... Oops, sorry, no back seat/no back seatbelt, in a Jeep that can flip over so easily I would never drive one>.

Now, that was exasperated by (#s Four thru Nine) the fact that while you were driving at (let's say) 50 to 60mph, you decided to reach back (where you had 2 people who could have handed you your iPod) long enough for you to drift into the next lane.

At this point, and just by deciding it was OK for you to take your eyes off the road long enough for you to drift, you are not only acting with a wilful disregard for your own safety as well as that of your 3 passengers, now you are also disregarding the safety of other drivers on the road.

Fishtail once, quickly swing back into your own lane & "purposely" albeit stupidly fishtail a second time, and you've totally fulfilled the definition of reckless driving (by my definition at least. Which may be wrong)..

You can argue that, you can disagree with it. . . It is just my opinion. In fact, if I had seen someone do that, sorry, but I would have called it in too!

I also think you lucked out by the fact that it was a witness who reported it as opposed to having been seen by a cop. If that were the case, there's a pretty good chance that it would have been an "M" instead of an "I" because it is "erratic driving combined with excess speed as well as other elements such as the no seatbelt, the intentional 2nd fishtail... etc"!

I'm sorry that it has created a "stressful situation" for you family & you but under the circumstances, its not as bad an outcome considering the alternative (example: a Misdemeanor charge with a speeding violation, or even worse, an accident where either you or any of your buddies were injured).

Chalk it up for "a lesson learned" and think before you do anything similar again.

Good luck!!!

 

[JIMinCA]

Dude... simply do a discovery request. Find out who the witnesses for the prosecution will be. If the little old lady who reported you will not be on the list, then the cop cannot use any evidence of your driving since the things she told him would be hearsay. As for the seatbelt things, you can simply plead not guilty and then not testify. You can cross examine the cop by asking him if he saw anyone in the back of the jeep. Just remember, no one can ask you anything if you don't testify.

 

[glolar]

To I Got Banned - Are you saying that a cop has the option to write up a 23103(a) as a misdemeanor OR simply an infraction ??? If so, then maybe the cop knowingly wrote it up as an infraction rather than a misdemeanor. That being the case, I should be able to do a Trial By Declaration, from what it says on the back of the ticket.

Also, you're right ... I don't feel bad enough for what's happened ... I should just "chalk it up as a lesson learned" and forget about trying to minimize the damage by defending myself It has already cost me over $500, two days of lost pay cause I couldn't drive to work, and inconvenienced my parents ... so yeah, I will "think before I do anything similar again". Pretty sure I've learned my lesson here. Doesn't mean I'm just gonna roll over and throw myself on the mercy of the court.

To JIMinCA - I fully plan on doing a discovery request when the time comes. I am pretty sure I have to wait until after my arraignment (and I have a court date) to do that, though.

 

[I_Got_Banned]

To I Got Banned - Are you saying that a cop has the option to write up a 23103(a) as a misdemeanor OR simply an infraction ???

Nope, that's not what I'm saying... What I'm saying is both, a 23103(a) or (b) "ARE" misdemeanors. You stated that the officer marked your citation with an "I" instead of an "M". Whether that has any bearing on how it will be entered into the system or how the court will treat it, who knows!

If so, then maybe the cop knowingly wrote it up as an infraction rather than a misdemeanor.

I couldn't tell you what the cop was thinking...

That being the case, I should be able to do a Trial By Declaration, from what it says on the back of the ticket.

According to the California Uniform Bail Schedule a court appearance is required for any violation where the penalty is more than strictly a fine. Since the penalty for a 23103 might involve a license restriction and/or jail time, you are required to appear in court at least for the first step that your case goes through, at which time you will be asked to enter your plea (Guilty, Not Guilty or No Contest). You can most certainly plead "Not Guilty" and ask the Judge if you can do a TBD. Rather than open up a can of worms here, let me just say that the Judge will let you know of you can or cannot do a TBD.

Also, you're right ... I don't feel bad enough for what's happened ... I should just "chalk it up as a lesson learned" and forget about trying to minimize the damage by defending myself It has already cost me over $500, two days of lost pay cause I couldn't drive to work, and inconvenienced my parents ... so yeah, I will "think before I do anything similar again". Pretty sure I've learned my lesson here. Doesn't mean I'm just gonna roll over and throw myself on the mercy of the court.

I sense a bit of sarcasm in your commentary… Am I right? Either that or you’re contradicting yourself.
Where in my post did I suggest that you shouldn’t do whatever you wanna do to “defend yourself”?
Where in my post did I ever mention that you should “roll over and throw yourself at the mercy of the court”?
Frankly, I know you don’t feel bad enough… And by the way, it’s not “WHAT’S HAPPENNED” like you state, it’s “WHAT YOU DID”. Deny it all you want… But when it comes down to it you screwed up.
If you happen to get a break when you go to court, count your blessings and be thankful. I’ll leave it at that… Again, Good Luck!!!

 

[glolar]

Oh, sorry for the sarcasm, but the following:

"I'm sorry that it has created a "stressful situation" for you family & you but under the circumstances, its not as bad an outcome considering the alternative (example: a Misdemeanor charge with a speeding violation, or even worse, an accident where either you or any of your buddies were injured)."

and

"Chalk it up for "a lesson learned" and think before you do anything similar again."

sure sounded like a lecture, which is not what I came on this board for. I came on here for advice and help. Nobody feels worse than I do right now. And I HAVE learned my lesson. Thank you for your comments anyway.

 

[patstew]

...sure sounded like a lecture, which is not what I came on this board for. I came on here for advice and help.

You posts in public, you takes your chances. It's clear that you didn't come here for a lecture -- you came for validation -- but you don't get to choose the answers you get.

Looking back at the responses, it appears you did get help and advice. Snark isn't helping you. Let it go.

 

[I_Got_Banned]

Dude... simply do a discovery request. Find out who the witnesses for the prosecution will be. If the little old lady who reported you will not be on the list, then the cop cannot use any evidence of your driving since the things she told him would be hearsay. As for the seatbelt things, you can simply plead not guilty and then not testify. You can cross examine the cop by asking him if he saw anyone in the back of the jeep. Just remember, no one can ask you anything if you don't testify.

Its not hearsay if he sang the entire story to 2 different officers! I think it was officer "Good Cop" & officer "Bad Cop"!

 

[CdwJava]

Well, a confession alone is not likely to result in a conviction. Only the offenses observed by the officer are likely to be upheld if no independent witness is available regardless of the confession. Relying solely on the suspect's confession can also be problematic on a number of fronts ... arguments of coercion or even Miranda might be made thus complicating an issue that could EASILY be resolved with the presence of the complaining witness.

- Carl

 

[glolar]

Carl,

I am reading different things regarding Miranda. I read somewhere that Miranda is only required if one is arrested, but somewhere else, I read that the officer must give Miranda, even if questioning someone for a possible traffic misdemeanor (no arrest involved). Can you shed any more light on this? (None of the three officers ever told me I had a right NOT to answer their questions). Also, if I had chosen not to say anything other than "I am not guilty of reckless driving.", could they have arrested me?

Thank you for your help. You have been great.