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San Diego Speed Survey required in last 5 years or 7 years?

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goddess747

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA

I was recently pulled over and received a speeding ticket for CVC 22350. I did some research and obtained a copy of the speed survey for the road I was driving on. I received the violation (he used a laser gun and showed me the result) on 02/23/10 and the date of the last speed survey conducted is 01/26/2005, about a month over 5 years from my violation date. I am confused by CVC 40802 as it states the definition of a "speed trap" twice where in one paragraph it states that a speed survey needs to be conducted within 5 years prior to the violation date, and another paragraph states 7 years. Which is correct? I would like to know whether I am in the clear since it was just over 5 years! I have verified that it is not a local road. Thanks :eek:
 


HighwayMan

Super Secret Senior Member
While I have no clue as to what the answer to your question is (I'll leave it to the California experts), I just wanted to say congratulations on being one of the few people who post here who actually is intelligent enough to look up statutes online and to read them!

It's not rocket science but it seems to escape most people.
 

I_Got_Banned

Senior Member
You're not in the clear... At least not yet... Since the survey is over 5 years old/but less than 7 years old, then the criteria listed under CVC 40802(c)(1) (subdivisions (A), (B), (C ) and (D)) must be met by the prosecution to establish that a speed trap did not exist.

If it is at all possible, you should scan the survey (all pages) upload/host it somewhere and post a link to it here and we'll try to establish whether the speed limit (on the segment of the road where you were cited) is justified or not.
 

goddess747

Junior Member
The speed limit was 30 and I was going 44. According to the speed survey I was definitely speeding! I have posted all the pages I obtained of the speed survey below (I guess I can't embed here so I linked the 2 pages below, let me know if it doesn't work).

Although, I noticed that the MUTCD 2003 California Supplement (from May 20, 2004 which I believe was the document in effect at the time of the survey) which I found here http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/traffops/signtech/mutcdsupp/pdf/MUTCD2003CASupp.pdf shows example pages of a speed zone survey (pg 2B-56 & 57) which are not included in mine. Are these pages required and if they do not exist does this mean the speed survey is incomplete?

PG1 - http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/69b68378.jpg

PG2 - http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/602ff4e2.jpg

Either way, I am guessing it is worth the odds that the cop will either not show up or that he will not meet all the requirements of CVC 40802(c)(1). He used a laser gun. Is it common for cops to have met all these requirements? I don't know if there is an answer to that question really!

Thanks for all your help!
 
Last edited:

goddess747

Junior Member
The speed limit was 30 and I was going 44. According to the speed survey I was definitely speeding! I have posted all the pages I obtained of the speed survey below (2 pgs, hope it works).

Although, I noticed that the MUTCD 2003 California Supplement (from May 20, 2004 which I believe was the document in effect at the time of the survey) which I found here http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/traffops/signtech/mutcdsupp/pdf/MUTCD2003CASupp.pdf shows example pages of a speed zone survey (pg 2B-56 & 57) which are not included in mine. Are these pages required and if they do not exist does this mean the speed survey is incomplete?

<a href="http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/?action=view&current=69b68378.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/69b68378.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket Pictures, Images and Photos" /></a>

<a href="http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/?action=view&current=602ff4e2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/602ff4e2.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket Pictures, Images and Photos" /></a>

Either way, I am guessing it is worth the odds that the cop will either not show up or that he will not meet all the requirements of CVC 40802(c)(1). He used a laser gun. Is it common for cops to have met all these requirements? I don't know if there is an answer to that question really!
 

I_Got_Banned

Senior Member
Although, I noticed that the MUTCD 2003 California Supplement (from May 20, 2004 which I believe was the document in effect at the time of the survey) which I found here http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/traffops/signtech/mutcdsupp/pdf/MUTCD2003CASupp.pdf shows example pages of a speed zone survey (pg 2B-56 & 57) which are not included in mine. Are these pages required and if they do not exist does this mean the speed survey is incomplete?
It looks to me that the survey is complete despite the fact that it does not include a map/chartmap of the speed zone

<a href="http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/?action=view&current=69b68378.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/69b68378.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket Pictures, Images and Photos" /></a>

<a href="http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/?action=view&current=602ff4e2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f338/goddess747/602ff4e2.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket Pictures, Images and Photos" /></a>
That looks like a good survey...

85th percentile Speed: 33mph.
Nearest 5mph increment is 35mph.
A 5mph reduction in the speed limit from the 35mph speed is valid by virtue of the high accident rate of 2.17 Accidents/Million Vehicle Miles (more that twice the rate for the same road classification 1.03 Accidents/MVM).

A posted limit of 30mph is indeed JUSTIFIED.

Is it common for cops to have met all these requirements?
Well, I am sure he is aware of the requirements, so it would be safe to assume that he will meet all the requirements. Only way to find out for sure would be to plead not guilty, request a trial (or a TBD)... And see what he does or does not bring.

Under the circumstances, I would normally say "buy the guaranteed dismissal by taking traffic school" but ultimately, the decision is your to make.

Good luck!
 

goddess747

Junior Member
Thanks so much for the clarification! My only last question is, if I go to court and plead not guilty but the officer shows and meets all the requirements of CVC 40802(c)(1), can I still take traffic school since I am eligible, or does this become a request that is up to the judge at that point?
 

I_Got_Banned

Senior Member
can I still take traffic school since I am eligible, or does this become a request that is up to the judge at that point?
While a judge cannot simply decline your request for traffic school simply because you opted to go to trial (or do a TBD), he/she is under no obligation to grant your request nor is he/she required to state a reason for his/her refusal. In other words, it is up to the judge.

So the only way to ensure that you can get a dismissal by way of the traffic school option would be to plead guilty and make that election at your arraignment (or online/by phone).
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
And, it would be bad to bet on the officer not showing up...it's OT for them ;)
 

goddess747

Junior Member
thanks for the advice! I really appreciate it. I decided to go the smart route and just suck it up and pay the fine so I can do traffic school. It was worth the research tho! :)
 

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