Speeding Ticket in PA

[drive2fast]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? PA
I got a citation for doing 54 in a 35 zone. Ticket has the following information:

Clocked by Robic
Miles Timed: .0189
Seconds Timed: 1.25
Date Equipment Tested: 10/1/09
Station Equipment Tested: W60
Device Serial Number : 12191

I am going to fight it but what can I use to do that? I mean, what is the cop REQUIRED to bring? And what can I say about this device?

I appreciate any help you guys can give.

 

[Maestro64]

First your speed was measured with a stopwatch, and that stopwatch only allows 3 digits to be enter for the distance which would make the distance the stopwatch measure you over .018 if he did not round up or .019 if he did which effectively change the distance he actually measured your speed over so the stopwatch thinks your distance was 95 feet or 100 ft. Hard to know but it was not 0.0189. Which can make a difference in the speed, that is the science behind the measurement.

The officer is requires to bring a number of things to court and all these items must be the original no copies allowed which was upheld by PA supreme court. The first item is the cal cert from the correct W60 test station with the correct serial number on the cal cert. He also have to show via of PennDot Bulletin that the test states was approved by PennDOT. They must all so show the device is approved by the PennDot for use, again their is PennDOT bulletin that shows this.

The police will tell you they do not need this stuff or say copies are okay. They other thing they must show is the distance was in fact measured and show proof of that distance. Many times they will say they were told the distance or they paced it off or they measured it many years ago, but can not show any proof of that distance other than saying it was 100ft if in fact that is the true length.

 

[drive2fast]

To Maestro and anyone else who can help

Thanks for the info - is there any law I can cite for this when I appear? I want to be totally ready.

The ticket does say .0189 - are you sure there is not one model that does 4 decimal places because I agree that it's a whole different ballgame from 3 to 4 decimals.

Anything else I need or any strategy you can recommend?

 

[Maestro64]

There is no PA law on what the officer is required to present in court, there is a number of PA case law on the subject. But Local police and Judges tent to ignore this fact unless you know what you are doing and force the issue in court. It all falls under rules of evidence.

Here is the manual for the stopwatch most all PA police use since it is the only device that calculates speed based on a inputted distance.

http://www.robictimers.com/images/instructions/SC-808 Instruction Guide.pdf

the 808 is the older version and the new one is 888 and it too have the same 3 decimal limitation. From what I have seen most department are using the 808.

This device was not meant to measure speed over very short distance by the mere fact it only allow 3 decimal places. Also the officer got the 0.0189 because he took the supposed 100ft and divided it by 5280 ft since the stop watch only allows distances to be entered in by fraction of mile not feet.

 

[drive2fast]

Ticket in Pa

I checked the Robic site and looked at all the ones used for speed checking. The 888, 848, and 554 all can be used. It didn't even list the 808 but I saw that in some other posts. I have to go take pictures at the place where he "clocked" me. I don't think there are any lines on the road so I am wondering what he used.

Your help is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

 

[Maestro64]

if there is no line on the road, that mean he used a land mark like phone poles or peoples mail boxes or sometime they put cones on the road, I have seen that done, Which means they had to go out and measure the distance. Most police carry one of those measurement wheels in the car for measuring skid marks from an accident. Did the officer use that or something else like pacing it off, which I have heard them doing. If they used a measurement wheel, was it calibrate as requires by section 3368 of the vehicle code.

 

[drive2fast]

More on Ticket

Found the lines. Don't know the distance between them but I see them, cleverly disguised as some fancy road painting for a new development entrance.

This is not going to be easy.

 

[drive2fast]

Paging Maestro or anyone who might know

He used a 4-place distance - if that is improper, is there a way to get his Robic to the hearing? I am trying to find a way to show that it was not accurate. If he was correct (.0189 distance), it would be 54 mph, but if not (.018), it's 51 mph. Is the discrepancy together with the timing of his pressing the start and stop enough for the judge to wonder?

What think ye?

 

[Maestro64]

The issue you have is what number he actually enter in to the stopwatch, obviously you now know it was not the 4 digits he wrote on the ticket, it was either 0.018 or 0.019, one will cause the faster speed to be calculated and the other is almost right on.

If the officer claim he entered 0.0189 ask him how he did that since the stopwatch does not allow that. All this does is calls into question his ability to operating the device and his attention to details if he got this wrong what else did he get wrong. Keep in mind there is no tape measure or measuring wheel that measures in fractions of a mile, they only measure in feet so what was the feet he actually measured and how did he calculate the fraction of the mile. Most likely he used a look up table and thus the reason he wrote 0.0189 miles on the ticket. Somehow he determined the distance was 100ft, either is measured it or someone told him, then used calculator or look up table and got 0.0189 miles.

Remember, someone telling him is hearsay, and is not admissible, he has to provide the court evidence he actually measured it or some sort of document that says it was in fact 0.0189 miles and was measure by a calibrated device.

As called out in section 3368 of Title 75

(d) Classification, approval and testing of mechanical, electrical and electronic devices.--The department may, by regulation, classify specific devices as being mechanical, electrical or electronic. All mechanical, electrical or electronic devices shall be of a type approved by the department, which shall appoint stations for calibrating and testing the devices and may prescribe regulations as to the manner in which calibrations and tests shall be made. The certification and calibration of electronic devices under subsection (c)(3) shall also include the certification and calibration of all equipment, timing strips and other devices which are actually used with the particular electronic device being certified and calibrated. Electronic devices commonly referred to as electronic speed meters or radar shall have been tested for accuracy within a period of one year prior to the alleged violation. Other devices shall have been tested for accuracy within a period of 60 days prior to the alleged violation. A certificate from the station showing that the calibration and test were made within the required period and that the device was accurate shall be competent and prima facie evidence of those facts in every proceeding in which a violation of this title is charged.

 

[drive2fast]

Maestro

Thanks. I think I will call Robic and ask them how many places it accepts just to be sure. And I might ask the magistrate to have the cop bring it to the hearing. And I think I will measure the distance between the lines myself.

You've been a big help. Thank you.

 

[drive2fast]

Question

Hey, can anyone tell me if there is a time limit on scheduling the hearing? The ticket was in October but I have not heard yet about a hearing and I did plead not guilty. Maestro?

 

[drive2fast]

Hey Maestro or someone knowledgeable

Is there a deadline for setting a hearing date? See previous post.

 

[HighwayMan]

Contact the court if you are concerned.

 

[drive2fast]

The Result of Court

I won! Thanks for the help Maestro and others.

 

[Maestro64]

I won! Thanks for the help Maestro and others.

Congratulation, another one in the win column. Can you provide details on what happen... Either the officer was a no show, which happens lots or you presented enough reasonable doubt the judge believed you.