state says its legal, city says no!

[onigoroshi]

What is the name of your state? ohio


I'm a Delaware county resident and was cited for a violation of a Columbus city code (Franklin). On Sept. 22, 2002 I was stopped by a Columbus traffic officer on I71 north between the 161 exit and the 270 exits. I was in the middle lane driving a modified black 2001 Hyundai Santa Fe SUV. As I approached the stationary cruiser on the far right side of the road, I noticed a silver Toyota Celica approaching my left side very quickly, presumably wanting to race because of the appearance of my vehicle. I looked at my speedometer and noted I was driving the legal speed, but the Celica had to have been doing at least 20 mph over. The traffic officer pulled into traffic as the Celica slammed on his brakes and filed in behind me and got off at the 161 exit. The officer got behind me and pulled me over! Now I ask, why would a traffic officer not pursue a person endangering the safety of others while driving at excessive speeds, but rather pursue a driver with minor violations? I turned off the car and rolled down the window as the officer approached. He asked to see my license and insurance. As I was locating it he said that he had pulled me over for 2 things, then changed his mind and said 3.
The officer, with an aggressive and rude demeanor, stated that my clear license plate cover was illegal, although my plate numbers can be easily read from 50 feet to the rear, my blue neon behind the plate was illegal, although the bulb wasn’t showing, called a halo effect, and it only produced a soft glow (not distracting and similar to under car neons), and my rear window decal, only taking up 20% of the total window surface area, was also illegal. I informed him that I was cited for blue washer l.e.d. on the hood of my vehicle in January of 2002 and it was dismissed from court. At the time I was cited for that violation I wasn’t cited for the 3 violations he "discovered". I also said that I had checked with state laws, talked to several law enforcement officers, and had passed and been tailed by easily over 100 officers in the past year and none of which had pulled me over nor pointed out any violations. He responded as saying "well, the others weren’t traffic cops." My thought was “are traffic cops different than normal officers?” He went back to his cruiser and proceeded to write the ticket, then returned to have me sign it.
When I was released I drove up to the rest area past the Polaris exit and found a maintenance worker there. I asked him where I could find a state trooper station. He asked why and I told him what had happened. He said, "This isn’t the first time this has happened." He told me to go up to the 36/37 exit and ask someone at the "flying j” since he didn’t know where one was. I drove to the gas station where he told me to go and asked the attendant if they knew where the state troopers station was. She asked why I wanted to know and I told her what had happened. She replied and said virtually the same thing as the maintenance worker, "well, I’m not sure, but this happens quite a bit." One of the over hearing customers told me that there was a Delaware police station up the road. I drove the police station only to find no one inside.
I drove home and did a 4-hour online search of Ohio traffic laws and statutes. The next day I did another 8-hour search only to find a total of 6 sites, which I had reviewed previously, and none of which described my violations. I finally came across the Columbus statues, after a total of 12 hours of searches (a very well hidden site, I must add).
I have read that if a Florida resident, with 20% tinting on their side front windows, is pulled over in Ohio where the legal limit is 50%, they cannot be cited for the window tinting since they are not residents of Ohio and Florida does not share the same codes. Would it be reasonable to say that because I am a Delaware resident and we don’t have the same codes as Franklin county, or Columbus for that matter, then I would not be subject to the citations? I see it as ridiculous that a resident of a certain area would have to remove certain objects to appease a different town every time they pass through.
My family and I took pictures of my vehicle to show that the interior and exterior was easily viewed through my rear window decal, both at day and at night. We also took pictures of the rear license plate from a distance of 50 feet away to show the legibility of the plate and the soft glow of the neon, which is hardly visible. we then parked another vehicle parallel to mine and took a picture again at 50 feet. My license plate was more legible than the other vehicle! I strongly believe that drivers like myself all over the country are being profiled and cited because of the appearance of the vehicles we drive. Does anyone have any advice for me as I fight the system?

 

[Bravo8]

You seem to know that your equipment is illegal, yet are trying to justify it by saying, "It isn't that bad."

I will tell you this. Your neon lights (on the hood and behind the license plate) are illegal. I can't find the exact citation right now, but will locate it when I'm home. I looked this up under OHIO STATE LAW and found it a while back. When I find the sections, I'll post it.

Now to address some other points....

1. You were stopped as opposed to the other vehicle probably because you have obvious violations, while the other driver (if he has any sense) isn't going to commit more traffic violations after seeing the officer.

2. The officer citing you for the idiot lights on your hood in January has nothing to do with this officer. Just because Officer A chose not to cite you for one violation, doesn't preclude Officer B from doing so.

3. Why were you looking for a State Police barracks? You must be one of those people who think the SP are the local cops bosses? Or maybe the State learns all the laws, but local guys only learn a couple, huh? The State is going to blow you off.....it's not there problem.

Additionally, you were cited under a local ordinance and not a state law. State Troopers enforce State law (you see.....its inherent in the name).

4. Are you being profiled? Probably. You are a ricer, and should be watched I have yet to meet a Ricer who was respectful and didn't drive like an a$$hole. Maybe you are the exception, but my generalization is pretty accurate. What you call profiling, I call selective enforcement. It's used often times in drug areas. By enforcing somewhat "minor" laws, you make it uncomfortable for the criminals to commit the serious crimes. By enforcing minor trafiic laws, you force compliance to all traffic law.

Take a hearing if you like, its your right. Just turn down your music when you pull into the court parking lot. Let off the gas so your bee-swarm sounding exhaust is a bit quieter, and turn your hat around, Riceboy.

 

[onigoroshi]

wow! thank you for your enlightening post! your intelligence, or lack thereof, has been oh so helpfull. please dont bother posting anymore usless information regarding my traffic violations. im seeking help from someone with experience in this situation, not closeminded, prejudice, and otherwise worthless opinions.

 

[twospirits]

Just the facts ma'am, just the facts

Well, in reference to Bravo8's response, what can I say. A guy comes on for some advice and instead gets a response that is quite shocking. Actually I expected nothing less from another officer since they always back each other up regardless whether they are wrong or not.
Need less to say, whether you think you are right or wrong Mr Officer/bravo8 there are other ways of saying and writing it. Your response is rude, arrogant, one sided and hurtful. What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty by a group of your peers. I guess in Officer Bravo8 its the other way around. To top it off he's already stereotypically calling the poster a racer (although he can't spell it) and saying that hes indirectly already a criminal. Give me a break.

Its clear from the original posters post, that it is profiling and that within that section of town its an ongoing practice that the officers stop people for little things like that. But unlike Officer Bravo8 I would rather have had him pull over the "over the speed limit guy" in the Celica than the poster which was doing the speed limit. I guess in the eyes of Officer Bravo8 its better to stop a car at the speed limit rather than one that 20 miles over and can be a hazard to other peoples lives.

So, Mr Officer/Bravo8 let me ask you this. if I'm driving from say one county which allows me to have the neons lights and drive through the next county over that doesn't allow it, should I go around the county just to avoid those profiling cops friends of yours. Give me a break.

Oh and btw, I take offense to your signature, that you are surrounded by Communist countries. New York, New Jersey and Maryland are #1 not countries but are states of these United States, and #2, They have more class than you will ever know. Pennsylvania should be ashame of having a resident such as you, it gives them a bad name.

 

[Bravo8]

No, no, no.......it's RICER. That's slang for those guys that buy a "rice-burner" (see the correlation?) car and buy all sorts of after market junk to give it the appearance of improved performance without actually improving the performance. It's common slang around here.

The poster came here looking to weasal out of citations for violations he knew were illegal. They are illegal by state statute, so the different county/state legal/etc arguments don't hold water.

The reason the section was cited under local ordinance as opposed to state statute is to prevent the money from going to the state. Citations written under state law usually go to the state, local ordinance stays local. This would be illegal in Pa (those greedy state *******s..... )

I don't always back up my fellow officers. I've just heard this same old tired argument before. The poster was wrong, not the officer. Like it or not, that's the way it is.

The poster is trying to defend himself by saying that the violations "aren't that bad". That's immaterial. His actions were illegal. Whether he feels it is a serious offense doesn't matter. he knowingly and willingly violated some traffic laws, and got tagged. He has no right to complain.

My point about the other vehicle makes sense. The Celica is tooling along above the speed limit. Sees the officer, who obviously didn't time him, and slows down. The officer isn't going to stop him and write him a ticket becasue he looked like he was going fast. That vehicle is now obeying the law, but our Rice frined is still in violation.

And since you brought it up............

New York doesn't respect your rights as an American citizen. Any state which willingly and intentionally violates the U.S. Constitution will be called Communist by my standards. They may as well be separate countries. They refuse to abide by the U.S. Constitution. I'm sorry if I offended you.......I'm not always politically correct.

All the poster is looking for is a way to circumvent the law and weasal out of responsibility. The law says they are illegal. If you don't like it, try to change it. You can't just do as you please and then expect to come here and have someone help you skirt responsibility.

Edited to add.....

I don't think my post was that nasty. I just re-read it and it was bit sarcastic and maybe harsh, but not down-right mean.

 

[onigoroshi]

well, either you cant read, you misread, or misunderstood my post. before installing those items on my vehicle i checked with state law and state law says what i have is LEGAL, as stated in the subject line, "STATE SAYS ITS LEGAL, CITY SAYS NO". im not a weasel, like some law enforcement officers i know. if i known what i did was illegal, or i would have known that a certain citys statutes were different from state statutes, then i wouldnt have added those items or i would have paid the ticket outright like i have inthe past on other occasions. besides, the items were removed that night. also if i had known that this site would be a total waste of time and i would be bashed by some out of state pig, then i wouldnt have posted here in the first place. so, as far as your insulting arian nation, right wing extremist self, have a nice day.

 

[Bravo8]

You've got to be kidding me!

You obviously don't understand what you speak of, my friend.

For starters, it's A-R-Y-A-N....not "arian"

Secondly, the term "right-wing" isn't an insult. I am very right-wing. I'm not a liberal tree-hugger, which would be the opposite. As a matter of fact, the terms "right" and "left" actually indicate one's economic philosophy. "Right" meaning little to no governmental control over economics (pure capitalism), and "left" meaning more or total control over economics (socialism or Marxism). More correctly, what you would be referring to would be the difference between Authoritarian and Libertarian. I am more of the Libertarian persuasion.

Even so, that doesn't jive with what you are trying to say. To correctly attempt to insult me you should have called me a left-wing, neo-facist. That would have pissed me off.

Secondly, most "right-wing extremists" are not overly pro-police. They would seem to support your position.

In other words, think before you speak. By the way, the civics lesson is free.

You still strike me as a weasal trying to skirt responsibilities for your actions. Ignorance is no excuse, even though you supposedly researched the law.

While I will agree that it seems a bit unfair to enforce local ordinances on people not local, it is nonetheless legal. Therefore you are still responsible.

For just a moment, you made me feel a bit remorseful for being so harsh in my response to you. You see, I deal with people all the time that have the same arguments as you. The bitch and moan and try to weasal out of responsibility. One tends to become a bit desensitized after a while. I have no patience for bull**** and stupidity, which is exactly how your post smelled to me. But then you let your true motivations show.........

Your feeble attempt to insult me by calling me a "pig" does nothing more than show your anti-police bias. You came here with a chip on your shoulder, and complete ignorance of the real world.

You got what you deserved.

 

[Kaz the Minotau]

BRAVO to Bravo8 HA! HA! I couldn't have said it any better my self! No one is ever man enough to step up to the plate and take responsibility for their actions....

 

[lauras2u]

wow how did u get so lucky

They really should limit the number of posts these police officers post. They are just venting frustrations they cannot vent at home with thier own name attached. Ignore them. Good luck getting advice that is worth something.

 

[onigoroshi]

thanks lauras2u

thanks lauras2u! i agree completely!

 

[lauras2u]

who is this kaz?

kaz made 12 posts in a single day and as far as i can see has just been following bravo around like some kinda trained puppy agreeing with him. I find it revealing that he choses roman 1-4 which gives him power as a civil servant and is questioned as Pauls work and not 8-10 which says what we owe others more than anything else is love and ths whole of law is summed up in love.

I think you would beat the ticket if u go to court.

 

[Bravo8]

Ok, ok, ok.......

Laura, I love you too.

Onigoroshi (what's that mean anyway....gives me a headache trying to type it), take advice from Laura if you like. Her other posts speak for her understanding of the law.

As you can see, she posts here due to an anti-police bias as well. If I was Joe Schmoe A$$hole who worked at the local factory, I'd be a regular guy. But no, since I am a police officer, the world is different. Talk about discrimination, Laura.......

I don't think you will win if you go to court...at least not on any valid legal grounds. Judges do what they wish, so who knows what the outcome will be. Take a hearing if you like, it's your right.

BTW Laura, I will not reveal my name in a public forum....and it has nothing to do with my opinions. If you were to ask my fellow officers, you would see I am the outspoken, politically involved, overly opinionated, no BS type. I am involved in local politics and routinely make my opinions known through various channels.

You need to remember two things:

1. My opinions (valid or not) do not represent my department, therefore I need to be careful in my presentation.

2. It is stupid and moronic for anyone to reveal pertinent personal information in a public forum. Cop or not.

Enough's enough. I formally apologize for upsetting you. Can we at least just agree to disagree, then? I am forceful in arguing my position and apparently you took it to heart. This is just an internet forum, not the *real world*.

Please don't judge all police officers upon the actions of myself. You speak of discrimination and bias, yet you have proven my point....you are just like those who live to create controversey. You and I don't agree, but I haven't made any generalizations such as, "They really need to limit the amount of posts these women post in here.....etc, etc, ad naseum. Yet you felt the need to generalize all officers because you and I don't agree. Besides if you don't stop, I might start talking about logic again.

 

[Bravo8]

Oh.....and Kaz is the MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





See, I take care of ya brother........

 

[Kaz the Minotau]

Yep.

 

[prbbleloophole]

BRAVO.....

Would you please leave your opinions out of your posts. They are not appropriate. The questions razed by the original poster have nothing to do with what you suspect he is, or the fact you can't spell his screen name or the list of other things that have nothing to do with the questions he asked. Please, if you don't want to offer clean advice, don't offer any at all. There are political web post sites for that -this is legal advice.

People come to this site because they want information.

I appreciated your response to my post "Was there Probable Cause?". However, after reading some of your other posts, I feel compelled to mention that your post to my question does not contain solid facts or solid legal references. Therefore, it is useless, but interesting commentary.

Once again unless you are here to offer advice based in law (which is what everyone is here to find) don't post, find a "Speak Out" web site.

-matt aka prbbleloophole