Stupid cops in traffic court

[plifter]

Here are some semi-quotes from various traffic court trials that I've won. I've always found these amusing.

For a speeding ticket case in Ohio:

Prosecutor: When you clocked the defendant on radar were there any other vehicles around?

Cop: No, no other vehicles were in sight.

(a few minutes later under cross examination)

Me: Isn't it possible that the Red Dodge Dakota was traveling faster than me?

Cop: You were clearly traveling faster than the Dakota!

Me: I'm a bit confused. You stated a few minutes ago to the prosecutor that there were no other cars around. Did you commit perjury or are you just a little confused over the details of this case?

Judge: NOT GUILTY!

For a ticket for parking more than 12 inches from the curb

Me: How far from the curb was my vehicle parked?

Cop: 14 inches

Me: Did you measure this with a police department issued measuring device?

Cop: I didn't actually measure it

Me: Then how do you know I was parked 14 inches from the curb?

Cop: It looked about like 14 inches

Judge: NOT GUILTY

In a window tinting trial:

My lawyer: Is it necessary to clean the window before using the light meter?

Cop: Yes

My Lawyer: Can you decsribe how you cleaned the window?

Cop: I spit on my fingers and wiped a spot clear.

My Lawyer: Is this how the state police recommend cleaning the window before performing this test.

Cop: Not exactly.

My lawyer: Could this be why your instrument reading is considerably different than the reading the inspection mechanic came up with.

Cop: I reckon it could be.

Judge: NOT GUILTY

 

[racer72]

Even though some of my replies may not indicate it, I have always enjoyed watching folks win their cases in traffic court. I have 7 wins, 2 losses and a tie (charges reduced to a non moving violation, no fine) in the 10 cases that I have assisted on.

 

[dabear]

Cops were stupid? Reread your post

You mean to tell me you had a prosecutor and a defense attorney in simple infraction hearings? I don't believe a word you say and I would love to be setting across from you anyday in a court room.

 

[plifter]

Re: Cops were stupid? Reread your post

You mean to tell me you had a prosecutor and a defense attorney in simple infraction hearings? I don't believe a word you say and I would love to be setting across from you anyday in a court room.

Yes, I had a "real" prosecutor in a speeding ticket case. It happened in Lawrence County Ohio. It was the sam prosecutor that was trying cases with men wearing bright orange jumpsuits. I hired a lawyer for the window tinting case because I'm sick of police harassing me for the purpose of raising revenue. I was happy to pay the lawyer $75 rather than pay $60 to the state of VA. Are you having hard time realizing that most police have IQ's below 100?

 

[DRN]

I have acted pro se in traffic court on 8 occasions in New York - my record is 6 wins (not guilty), 0 losses, 1 tie (speeding dropped to no seat belt) and one is pending.

I took a speeding conviction to the Appellate Term of the Supreme Court, 9th Judicial District and WON. It was so obvious from the start - the cop didn't sign the supporting deposition, which is a sworn statement - he typed his name in. The DA didn't even bother showing up.

I am presently appealing a "no seat belt" conviction to County Court. This one is actually a bit of a challenge as there are two cops involved - a spotter and the cop manning the roadblock. But with their answers, which I wrote down on a prepared question sheet, I've got plenty of grounds to dismiss.
The spotter admitted he couldn't tell if I was wearing the lap belt. The roadblock cop admitted I was wearing my lap belt. The claimed their testimony was based on their memory of the incident, but they couldn't remember any other details about the incident, including vehicle color, interior/seatbelt cover, reason for roadblock, etc etc etc.

The ADA is this case is an obnoxious balding jerk who looks and acts like "Newman" on the Sienfield tv show. He claimed in court that no case law existed that gave CPLR rights to traffic violations (NY Court of Appeals and Appellate Divsion, Second Department cases) and that no case law existed involving police roadblocks (U.S. Supreme Court, various District Courts). He told ME that I should go back to law school. ROFL

I'm a paralegal and I'm much smarter than most attorneys I've met and smarter than every DA I've met.

The problem here in New York is that the local courts are merely fund-raisers for their respective towns. The "Justices" are mostly local people with no legal training or experience, who depend on the DA to take the lead and run the show. If you proceed Pro Se, you will very rarely win on the local level, but if you know how to research and interpret case law, you'll win on appeal almost every time. On the local level, they make truly stupid mistakes and give ample cause for appeal.

They don't care if you appeal because their job is to convict and fine - they are not judges so they don't care how many times their decisions are overturned. Their attitude is: go ahead and appeal but first, pay the fine.

If I ever do get a law degree, I'll have a field day.

 

[plifter]

I had the judge chuckling at the cop who claimed there were no other vehicles around and then changed his mind a few minutes later. When I pointed out his inconsistent testimony he tried to back his way out of it but he looked like a total fool. I've never taken any law courses and have no experience working with lawyers.

 

[dabear]

Any other dumb cop stories? I'm sure you can make up more than that.

 

[txnskr]

I have acted pro se in traffic court on 8 occasions in New York - my record is 6 wins (not guilty), 0 losses, 1 tie (speeding dropped to no seat belt) and one is pending.

I took a speeding conviction to the Appellate Term of the Supreme Court, 9th Judicial District and WON. It was so obvious from the start - the cop didn't sign the supporting deposition, which is a sworn statement - he typed his name in. The DA didn't even bother showing up.

I am presently appealing a "no seat belt" conviction to County Court. This one is actually a bit of a challenge as there are two cops involved - a spotter and the cop manning the roadblock. But with their answers, which I wrote down on a prepared question sheet, I've got plenty of grounds to dismiss.
The spotter admitted he couldn't tell if I was wearing the lap belt. The roadblock cop admitted I was wearing my lap belt. The claimed their testimony was based on their memory of the incident, but they couldn't remember any other details about the incident, including vehicle color, interior/seatbelt cover, reason for roadblock, etc etc etc.

The ADA is this case is an obnoxious balding jerk who looks and acts like "Newman" on the Sienfield tv show. He claimed in court that no case law existed that gave CPLR rights to traffic violations (NY Court of Appeals and Appellate Divsion, Second Department cases) and that no case law existed involving police roadblocks (U.S. Supreme Court, various District Courts). He told ME that I should go back to law school. ROFL

I'm a paralegal and I'm much smarter than most attorneys I've met and smarter than every DA I've met.

The problem here in New York is that the local courts are merely fund-raisers for their respective towns. The "Justices" are mostly local people with no legal training or experience, who depend on the DA to take the lead and run the show. If you proceed Pro Se, you will very rarely win on the local level, but if you know how to research and interpret case law, you'll win on appeal almost every time. On the local level, they make truly stupid mistakes and give ample cause for appeal.

They don't care if you appeal because their job is to convict and fine - they are not judges so they don't care how many times their decisions are overturned. Their attitude is: go ahead and appeal but first, pay the fine.

If I ever do get a law degree, I'll have a field day.

You seem to know quite a bit about the NY state system, I got a ticket in orange county for speeding 82/65 and I was wondering what kind of defense you would suggest, you can send me a message if you wish.

 

[abezon]

Possible defenses: Hearsay (one cop clocks you, the other cop stops you. State has to call both cops to establish speding & your identity as the driver.)

Speed measurement inaccuracies: Other vehicles around in the "radar cone", cop holding radar gun by hand making the reading subject to error from his hand movements, etc. Check out fighting traffic ticket books at the library.

deferred finding of guilt: you admit guilt & pay a fee, but if you don't get a ticket for 12 months, the ticket disappears. May or may not be eligible, costs vary.

Plea bargain to a non-moving violation in exchange for a bigger fine.

 

[CdwJava]

Wow ... I didn't know people could FIND a 2-year-old message thread to revive somehow.

Now the question is, why not just start a new one?

Carl

 

[txnskr]

Possible defenses: Hearsay (one cop clocks you, the other cop stops you. State has to call both cops to establish speding & your identity as the driver.)

Speed measurement inaccuracies: Other vehicles around in the "radar cone", cop holding radar gun by hand making the reading subject to error from his hand movements, etc. Check out fighting traffic ticket books at the library.

deferred finding of guilt: you admit guilt & pay a fee, but if you don't get a ticket for 12 months, the ticket disappears. May or may not be eligible, costs vary.

Plea bargain to a non-moving violation in exchange for a bigger fine.

In NY, you cand do the deffered finding of guilt, or deferred adjudication...and after talking to the DA which said that the police officer handles the whole case and that I needed to talk to him about a plea bargain out of court, I called the court and they said they dont allow people to talk to the officers out of court. seeing as this ticket is far away and an inconvience to get to, I dont see how I can get out of going to court since I plead not guilty. Is there any law saying that I must be able to talk to whomever is charging me, ie the DA?

 

[You Are Guilty]

You can talk to them right before the hearing. That's when 99% of all pleas are made anyway.

 

[txnskr]

You can talk to them right before the hearing. That's when 99% of all pleas are made anyway.

I know that. my question is that since the trial is far away from where i live, I wanted to try to plea bargain before going to the court- is there any law guaranteeing your ability to talk to the prosecution beforehand?

 

[dequeendistress]

There are NO Guarantees...but I can guarantee you that next time you start your own thread via a two year old thread, you may not receive such assistance as this time.