two tickets in three days

[ruffrider]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Pennsylvania

I recently got tagged twice for two different offenses:

1. 42 in a 25 Statute 3362(a)(3) (I may have been speeding), caught by (I think) Robic Accutech?
2. Turning left on a steady red Statute 3111(a) (I did not, it was yellow when I was turning and I was in the middle of the intersection so I could not have stayed there anyway)

My questions are:
1. Does 3311 (a) carry any points with it?
2. Should I fight the offense that I am innocent of, and risk being assessed points for something I say in my testimony to an ornery judge?
3. Should I contest the speeding ticket on any grounds pertaining to Robic Accutech?
4. What the heck is Robic Accutech?

Your answers are greatly appreciated....

[Maestro64]

Was it 3311 or 3111 3311 is about driving on a Divided highway, 3111 is failure to comply with a traffic control device and in PA this is a no point ticket and does not usually show up on your record. Also 3111 is what they usually give when they are giving you a break or nothing else fits.

So on the red light, IN PA you have right to clear the intersection as long as you did not enter on red. IF you fight this and the officer state it was not red when you enter it should be dismissed since you did not break any of PA's vehicle codes

On the speeding ticket you got caught with a stop watch (Rubic Accutrak) they timed you over painted lines on the road, most likely it was very short distant too, this method is laden with error, part of the reason PA give you 10MPH before a ticket can be issued. These ticket usually can be won on the fact that most of these operations are two officer, one measuring and the other writing ticket and the one measuring usually never shows in court.

Most likely since you just got the tickets you got caught in PA's smooth operator operation and they are tagging people for any reason they can since the State and Fed is paying overtime costs for the police to be out writing tickets and the increase fines they collect are not subject the PA rule on no more than 5% of the towns income can come from tickets.

If you fight the speeding ticket and depending on the officer and the mood of the court they might even reduce it to 5 over and no points or simply another 3111 ticket.

[ruffrider]

it was 3111 so no points...whew. I thought that was what I read. What type of defense do I need to mount for the speeding ticket? Do I just need to show up and maintain that I was not speeding and they will take the path of least resistance and reduce? Or do I have to get all Matthew Harrison Brady from "Inherit the Wind" and prove through some math formula that I could not have done it? In the 16 years I have been driving I have gotten exactly one ticket and that was over 12 years ago, so I am unsure as to what to do.

Any help would be appreciated.

[ruffrider]

Sorry, I forgot to add that there was only one officer in the car. Does this make a difference? I did the calculations my self and they are correct based on his findings, but the officer doing it solo seems almost impossible to be accurate (human reflexes and such).

[Maestro64]

Originally Posted by ruffrider

Sorry, I forgot to add that there was only one officer in the car. Does this make a difference? I did the calculations my self and they are correct based on his findings, but the officer doing it solo seems almost impossible to be accurate (human reflexes and such).

Are you sure it was only one, many time one sits up the road measureing and then radios head to another car and he pulls everyone over. But sometime it is a single person operation.

Yes, this method is prone to error, not doubt about that, the error becomes greater as the distance between the lines become smaller. I have seen them do this as little as 50ft most are around 150 to 200 ft and speed plays in to the error, measure over 200 on a 25MPH road the error is low, but measuring over 200ft on a 55MPH road and the error becomes greater again. There is a Fed Study done by the NHSA which they said they no distance less then 500 ft should be used to eliminate error but PA ignores this totally since most roads in PA its had to get 500ft with clear line of sight of both lines.

Because of these error and there are few more the state has granted you a 10MPH buffer. The state feels if you at least 10 over using this method your more likely to be speeding than not. The only questions is the error in your case more then 7MPH because you could be less the 10MPH over if this was in fact the case.

Look at the distance, distance are measured in ft but Accutrak requires distance to be manually enter in fraction of a mile and it is limited to 3 decimal places and on very short distance this rounding error can be as much as 5 to 15 ft off usually in the short distance. So by telling the stop watch the distance is 10 less for the same amount of travel time can cause a higher speed. The other question you need to understand is what was the real distance and who measure it. Many time towns have various distances they use in the same town depending on the road. So was it 75 , or 100 or 150 if he thought it was 100 and it was actually 75 this can be an issue.

Anyway, you get the idea.

[seniorjudge]

Originally Posted by Maestro64

I am not a lawyer nor am I in Law enforcement,

I will not make an value judgment on why your asking a questions.

I will try to provide information so you can make an informed decisions so take it for what is worth and do your own research.

Remember it easy to tell someone they will loose verse providing knowledge.

Lastly, I have no vested interest in the your outcome win, loose or draw and the same goes for anyone else.

I'm curious.

What does this mean?

Remember it easy to tell someone they will loose verse providing knowledge.

[CMLANDLORD]

Originally Posted by seniorjudge

I'm curious.

What does this mean?

Remember it easy to tell someone they will loose verse providing knowledge.

I'm going to assume it should read:

Remember, it is easy to tell someone that they will lose as opposed to providing knowledge to assist.

Giving him/her the benefit of the doubt of course :P

[seniorjudge]

Originally Posted by CMLANDLORD

I'm going to assume it should read:

Remember, it is easy to tell someone that they will lose as opposed to providing knowledge to assist.

Giving him/her the benefit of the doubt of course :P

Or maybe it has something to do with poetry; "loose verse" and all...

[CMLANDLORD]

Senior I think your assumption is 100% correct. Here is my attempt at poetry..... Loose verse, moose curse. :P

[seniorjudge]

Originally Posted by CMLANDLORD

Senior I think your assumption is 100% correct. Here is my attempt at poetry..... Loose verse, moose curse. :P

Prize winning stuff, that!

[LeDeb]

Hi, I got a speeding ticket a couple of weeks ago. I plead not guilty, wen to court. There was another police officer. He told me that he could reduce some speed so I could get 2 points, so I was very happy just to lower it down a bit, until yesterday I was thinking How can another officer appear? The Judge only asked me if I was ok, and Scared I just said Yes.
It was my first ticket, but I am thinking in calling tomorrow and see if it was valid .....is it too late to avoid this at all? Was it fair?
It is not just the points, is just I am regreting accepting the another officer offer.....besides the money of course....
Any advises pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Maestro64]

Originally Posted by LeDeb

Hi, I got a speeding ticket a couple of weeks ago. I plead not guilty, wen to court. There was another police officer. He told me that he could reduce some speed so I could get 2 points, so I was very happy just to lower it down a bit, until yesterday I was thinking How can another officer appear? The Judge only asked me if I was ok, and Scared I just said Yes.
It was my first ticket, but I am thinking in calling tomorrow and see if it was valid .....is it too late to avoid this at all? Was it fair?
It is not just the points, is just I am regreting accepting the another officer offer.....besides the money of course....
Any advises pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

First you should have make a new post.

To answer your question, is it valid what the officer did, yes, unless you stand up for your rights, which you did not and accepted their plead. No going back now.

BTW, this tends to be standard operating procedure in PA when they run these traffic enforcement programs from time to time. they write so many ticket that the officer has no time to show, so they send one to try and work a deal and if one can not be worked they will still attempt to have a hearing with the officer that showed reading from the ticket. Most people have no clue it was not the officer who actually wrote the ticket. So they still get their money even though they violated your rights to confront your accuser, but if you do not object, you have waive your rights.