Violation Sent 2.5 years after incident

[nattyhaha]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Massachusetts

In March 2012, I stopped at a toll as I did not have any cash for it. I gave my information to the attendent who gave me a piece of paper and said a notice would be sent to me shortly after instructing how to pay it. I never received such a notice until 2.5 years after it happened.

At the time my car and license were registered in NH at the time as I was in the process of starting a new job and had not moved yet. By June of 2013 my car was registered in Mass adn I had a Mass license (where I had to surrender my NH license). Fast forward to now, my parents still live at the NH residence. In October 2014 I received two notices from the Mass RMV. The first marked "2nd notice" contained the original violation and fee. The second notice marked "3rd notice" had an added late fee.

I contacted to appeal the late fee as these notices were sent almost three years after it happened. I had moved, registered in the state and everything and that I never received the "1st notice". I was told that the first notice was sent 8/14/14 and it is up to me to inform the state of a move and to also have my mail forwarded. Appeal denied.

I wrote back again explaining that I had been registered in the state of Mass at least a year before they sent the first notice. I also informed them that mail forwarding only works for one year which means their notice still came after the period where mail forwarding would have got it to me.

They denied my appeal based off the first reasons and said I coudl appeal in person.

Im not sure how long they have to send violation notices but according to the statute, it says "as soon as applicable". Based off their statements, they can take up to two and a half years to send me my first notice. This does not seem fair whatsoever.

Should I have an in person appeal? I know the late fee isnt much ($40) but at this point, the principle is. They could be doing this to hundreds of drivers for more money as well. Doesnt seem fair that they can take such a long time. Any help would be great! Thank you!

 

[Zigner]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Massachusetts

In March 2012, I stopped at a toll as I did not have any cash for it. I gave my information to the attendent who gave me a piece of paper and said a notice would be sent to me shortly after instructing how to pay it. I never received such a notice until 2.5 years after it happened.

At the time my car and license were registered in NH at the time as I was in the process of starting a new job and had not moved yet. By June of 2013 my car was registered in Mass adn I had a Mass license (where I had to surrender my NH license). Fast forward to now, my parents still live at the NH residence. In October 2014 I received two notices from the Mass RMV. The first marked "2nd notice" contained the original violation and fee. The second notice marked "3rd notice" had an added late fee.

I contacted to appeal the late fee as these notices were sent almost three years after it happened. I had moved, registered in the state and everything and that I never received the "1st notice". I was told that the first notice was sent 8/14/14 and it is up to me to inform the state of a move and to also have my mail forwarded. Appeal denied.

I wrote back again explaining that I had been registered in the state of Mass at least a year before they sent the first notice. I also informed them that mail forwarding only works for one year which means their notice still came after the period where mail forwarding would have got it to me.

They denied my appeal based off the first reasons and said I coudl appeal in person.

Im not sure how long they have to send violation notices but according to the statute, it says "as soon as applicable". Based off their statements, they can take up to two and a half years to send me my first notice. This does not seem fair whatsoever.

Should I have an in person appeal? I know the late fee isnt much ($40) but at this point, the principle is. They could be doing this to hundreds of drivers for more money as well. Doesnt seem fair that they can take such a long time. Any help would be great! Thank you!

Pay the fee - it's the cheapest and most expeditious option.

 

[HighwayMan]

I wrote back again explainingThey could be doing this to hundreds of drivers for more money as well.

If you stop thinking about this as a conspiracy against the motoring public and more like an administrative error then maybe you'll be more reasonable about paying the fine/fees. Zigner is absolutely right - it's not worth it. Choose the good battles to fight, not stuff like this.

 

[PaulMass]

They denied my appeal based off the first reasons and said I coudl appeal in person.

Im not sure how long they have to send violation notices but according to the statute, it says "as soon as applicable". Based off their statements, they can take up to two and a half years to send me my first notice. This does not seem fair whatsoever.

Should I have an in person appeal? I know the late fee isnt much ($40) but at this point, the principle is. They could be doing this to hundreds of drivers for more money as well. Doesnt seem fair that they can take such a long time. Any help would be great! Thank you!

You can appeal all you want. The registry makes up their own rules and changes them as they see fit. Due process is a completely foreign concept to them, but you must exhaust your administrative remedies before you can go to court, where they actually must follow the law. It will cost you WAY more than $40 to file the appeals and set foot inside a courtroom.

Just look at it as another tax on the plebes.

 

[nattyhaha]

If you stop thinking about this as a conspiracy against the motoring public and more like an administrative error then maybe you'll be more reasonable about paying the fine/fees. Zigner is absolutely right - it's not worth it. Choose the good battles to fight, not stuff like this.

I think I'm being perfectly reasonable in the fact that I explained clearly to them that it must have been an error on their part and that I would gladly pay the original fine but felt the late fee was excessive since it was their error.

Yes, I probably end up paying it but to someone who doesn't get into a lot of "battles", I felt this was worth the fight.

 

[FlyingRon]

I think I'm being perfectly reasonable in the fact that I explained clearly to them that it must have been an error on their part and that I would gladly pay the original fine but felt the late fee was excessive since it was their error.

Yes, I probably end up paying it but to someone who doesn't get into a lot of "battles", I felt this was worth the fight.

It's not "their error." You knew that you owed the toll and when you didn't receive the letter, waiting 2.5 years until they started collections was not a reasonable response.

 

[nattyhaha]

It's not "their error." You knew that you owed the toll and when you didn't receive the letter, waiting 2.5 years until they started collections was not a reasonable response.

It is their error. I was informed I would get the notice that would inform me of how to pay the toll. They waited 2.5 years to send it. It states in the statute that the clerk would certify the violation and send notice "as soon as practicable". Their 2.5 year wait resulted in it going to the wrong address which is their error. Not mine.

 

[PaulMass]

to someone who doesn't get into a lot of "battles", I felt this was worth the fight.

For someone who doesn't get into a lot of battles, you really need to pick a battle with a reasonable opponent.

It is their error. I was informed I would get the notice that would inform me of how to pay the toll. They waited 2.5 years to send it. It states in the statute that the clerk would certify the violation and send notice "as soon as practicable". Their 2.5 year wait resulted in it going to the wrong address which is their error. Not mine.

If you're really insistent, go to the registry and ask for a hearing. They don't charge for walk in hearings. If you don't agree with the registry officer's decision, you can appeal to the Board of Appeal on Motor Vehicle Liability & Bonds, but the fee for that appeal is $50.

Explain that
(a) you properly notified the RMV that you moved when you obtained your Mass driver's license
(b) the post office only forwards mail for six months
(c) you never received any notice in 8/14
(d) the 8/14 notice was likely mailed to the old address when you had already informed them of your new address

I don't think it will get you anywhere, but give it a try.

 

[ShyCat]

(b) the post office only forwards mail for six months

Correction: first class mail is forwarded for one year.

 

[Zigner]

Correction: first class mail is forwarded for one year.

You're kinda both right. It can be forwarded for up to six months and then the forwarding can be extended by another six months.

 

[ShyCat]

Well, the USPS doesn't say anything about "6 months and may be extended another 6". I have in hand the USPS "Official Change of Address Confirmation Letter" for my mother-in-law which clearly states the "Mail Forwarding Expiration Dates" for the various classes of mail. For "First Class Mail, Priority & Express" and "Packages", the letter states a one year expiration date (i.e., Mar 12, 2016).

 

[Zigner]

Well, the USPS doesn't say anything about "6 months and may be extended another 6". I have in hand the USPS "Official Change of Address Confirmation Letter" for my mother-in-law which clearly states the "Mail Forwarding Expiration Dates" for the various classes of mail. For "First Class Mail, Priority & Express" and "Packages", the letter states a one year expiration date (i.e., Mar 12, 2016).

From https://www.usps.com/manage/forward.htm:

How it Works

You can use the temporary service for as short as 15 days or as long as 1 year. After the first 6 months, you can extend for another 6 months.

Then again...it's a (quasi) governmental entity...

 

[ShyCat]

You can use the temporary service for as short as 15 days or as long as 1 year. After the first 6 months, you can extend for another 6 months.

Ah, the difference between temporary (as in vacations) and permanent (as in moving).

 

[Zigner]

You can use the temporary service for as short as 15 days or as long as 1 year. After the first 6 months, you can extend for another 6 months.

Ah, the difference between temporary (as in vacations) and permanent (as in moving).

Fair enough...