what is considered speeding? 5 miles over?

[dkoder1]

What is the name of your state? Pennsylvania - PA
what is considered speeding? my son (who is 19) was doing 30 in a 25 mile zone, not a school zone, this was a road off of a main road in a small town (a back road to the country). The officer told him that they were getting complaints of speeders, yet while the officer was giving him his ticket a truck spun out his tires at the stop sign. I always thought there was a grace of 5 miles, due to influcts in cars speedometers.

[sukharev]

You can get a ticket for going 1 mile over, if the officer feels like doing it. Don't expect that by default you can exceed the speed limit within some reasonable range and be OK (I know, everybody thinks that driving 72 in 65 mph is not speeding). That's another urban legend. In reality, you have to argue your case based on evidence presented, and if laser (lidar) was used, you will hear the officer say that it's accurate within manufacturer's specification of 1 mph. The fact your speedometer was off is typically of no interest to the judge (except for a few states like VA), you are expected to maintain your car in proper working order.

Now, if it was a pace ticket and police car speedometer that was off, you could argue that, no problem.

In practice, you are right, and 5 miles over is a stupid ticket. Here is advice to your son: take it to court, hear what DA has to say before trial, try to negotiate to lower the ticket to a non-moving violation or outright dismissal. Don't plead guilty. If DA is not willing to budge, go to trial and have the right defense tools with you. You need a lot more than you currently have (like figuring what was used to measure speed and how to beat it, if officer was trained, if speed limit was established properly, etc.). But, always be respectful to the officer and his job, recognize he was just making an honest mistake, and not trying to get you. Same for DA and judge, be respectful and not confrontational. You are encountering the system, and it's one of the rules (to see full list, just look at one of seniorjudge's posts). Good luck.

[loulblades]

You didn't mention how speed was determined.

PA 75.3368

(c) Mechanical, electrical and electronic devices authorized.--

1. Except as otherwise provided in this section, the rate of speed of any vehicle may be timed on any highway by a police officer using a mechanical or electrical speed timing device.
2. Except as otherwise provided in paragraph (3), electronic devices such as radio-microwave devices (commonly referred to as electronic speed meters or radar) may be used only by members of the Pennsylvania State Police.
3. Electronic devices which calculate speed by measuring elapsed time between measured road surface points by using two sensors and devices which measure and calculate the average speed of a vehicle between any two points may be used by any police officer.
4. No person may be convicted upon evidence obtained through the use of devices authorized by paragraphs (2) and (3) unless the speed recorded is six or more miles per hour in excess of the legal speed limit. Furthermore, no person may be convicted upon evidence obtained through the use of devices authorized by paragraph (3) in an area where the legal speed limit is less than 55 miles per hour if the speed recorded is less than ten miles per hour in excess of the legal speed limit. This paragraph shall not apply to evidence obtained through the use of devices authorized by paragraph (3) within a school zone.

[sukharev]

Ah, yes, PA does have that law, thanks loulblades for correcting me.

However, the officer can still say he visually estimated the speed, and just used device to confirm it (and not as evidence).

[loulblades]

However, the officer can still say he visually estimated the speed, and just used device to confirm it (and not as evidence).

Not sure what you are saying since visual estimate won't stand on its own in PA. (Comm. v Martorano)

[sukharev]

I think you just built his entire defense, well done! I love PA, my favourite state

P.S. I got to say, he has to learn how to use it. Just because there are certain state laws and case laws does not mean a squat it traffic courts. You have to know what to say, how and when, and all of a sudden the system works in your favor. You never get this automatically. My previous remarks are what the officer, prosecutor or judge is likely to say instead. The key is to say "OBJECTION, YOUR HONOR"

[loulblades]

P.S. I got to say, he has to learn how to use it. Just because there are certain state laws and case laws does not mean a squat it traffic courts. You have to know what to say, how and when, and all of a sudden the system works in your favor. You never get this automatically. My previous remarks are what the officer, prosecutor or judge is likely to say instead. The key is to say "OBJECTION, YOUR HONOR"

Right you are. They certainly won't make it easy for you but that's where the knowledge comes in (and you can read off your notes). Of course keeping your fingers crossed that the magistrate is a reasonable individual and will listen in the first place couldn't "hoit".

IMHO it is not worth getting an attorney at the first level in PA (Since it is you, the magistrate and the officer and it only costs $6). If you have the law behind you then an attorney would probably be required to go to the next level. Although hiring an attorney for 5mph over would prob. have more to do with principle than the fine.