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Exemption for child - old child support order or IRS law?

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Evanston

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA
Hi, not sure if this question is best answered here or in Child Support forum but I'll start here. The Order regarding child support is from 2005. I am the custodial parent. The court decreed in 2005 that Father would file as single and I would file HOH. The Order stated that we would each be entitled to two exemptions (one personal and one for one of our two children). I completed a release form for one year and father did not ask for one the remaining years but we continued to take one child each. However this year things are very different. Father is now married and has a new child born in 2014. So he can now file as HOH or married filing jointly whichever he prefers and he will now have his new child to as an exemption.

I want to claim both children this year as it makes a huge difference to me financially. The court order was vague about how long the 2 exemptions clause was to continue. It did not address the situation of Father's filing status changing from Single to Head of Household. So much has changed in the intervening years. I've been reading the IRS rules and it appears I am entitled to revoke the release at any time. Does anyone see any issue with me informing Father that I will be claiming both children this year?

I found this on AVVO
"What if the decree awards the exemption to the noncustodial parent?
Often, one or both sides use the dependency exemption as a bargaining chip to get what they want in the divorce. When this happens, the custodial parent typically assumes that he or she is legally obligated to forfeit any dependency exemptions that the court awards to the noncustodial parent in the divorce decree. This is a common, and often expensive, misconception. Because federal law supersedes state law, the IRS ultimately decides which parent claims the dependency exemption. No matter what the divorce decree says, the noncustodial parent cannot properly claim a dependency exemption unless he or she attaches the signed Form 8332 to his or her tax return documenting the custodial parent's written consent. Attaching a copy of the divorce decree to the return is not an acceptable substitute. If Form 8332 is not attached to the noncustodial parent's tax return, the IRS ultimately will deny the dependency deduction. So for tax purposes, the divorce decree is virtually irrelevant."
 


I'mTheFather

Senior Member
Until you return to court to change the dependent exemption, your ex is entitled to receive it, and you are required to provide the form 8332. Though you won't be in trouble with the IRS for not doing so, you will be in contempt of your court order if your ex pursues it.
 

Evanston

Junior Member
Does the wording of the Order matter?

Until you return to court to change the dependent exemption, your ex is entitled to receive it, and you are required to provide the form 8332. Though you won't be in trouble with the IRS for not doing so, you will be in contempt of your court order if your ex pursues it.
Thanks for your reply. I was reading our paperwork and the exemption language was in the "statement of decision" but not in the Order filed after the hearing. The language regarding exemptions was tied to father filing as "single" and that situation has changed. I understand that when Orders are vaguely worded (in this case no years other than the year of the Order was specified with respect to exemptions) that a contempt judgement would be quite unlikely. I would give father warning of my plans so he would know what I my filing plans are. I certainly wouldn't want to get in trouble with family court. He'll be angry definitely but I don't know if he would pursue contempt as his IRS filings are very creative.

Is a court likely to take action if I give fair warning and explain the situation to Father (I am in dire financial condition and he is quite well off so this would not harm him but for me the difference in taking both children has serious financial implications - rent paid or not paid). Thanks for reading.
 

I'mTheFather

Senior Member
Thanks for your reply. I was reading our paperwork and the exemption language was in the "statement of decision" but not in the Order filed after the hearing.
I'm not in CA, so I may be wrong, but I believe the statement of decision is binding as part of the order.
The language regarding exemptions was tied to father filing as "single" and that situation has changed.
Are you saying the order says as long as father is filing as single, he gets the exemption? That's unusual.
I understand that when Orders are vaguely worded (in this case no years other than the year of the Order was specified with respect to exemptions) that a contempt judgement would be quite unlikely.
I wouldn't count on that. Does the order actually limit father to one year of exemption?
I would give father warning of my plans so he would know what I my filing plans are. I certainly wouldn't want to get in trouble with family court. He'll be angry definitely but I don't know if he would pursue contempt as his IRS filings are very creative.
The creativity of his IRS filings shouldn't be an issue to family court.
Is a court likely to take action if I give fair warning and explain the situation to Father (I am in dire financial condition and he is quite well off so this would not harm him but for me the difference in taking both children has serious financial implications - rent paid or not paid). Thanks for reading.
If father pursues it, then it will be a problem.

Have you had a child support review since 2005? If not, it may be worth your while. You can also request a change to the exemptions, though the fact that father has additional exemptions now is probably not a factor.
 

Evanston

Junior Member
I'm not in CA, so I may be wrong, but I believe the statement of decision is binding as part of the order. Are you saying the order says as long as father is filing as single, he gets the exemption? That's unusual.I wouldn't count on that. Does the order actually limit father to one year of exemption?The creativity of his IRS filings shouldn't be an issue to family court.
If father pursues it, then it will be a problem.

Have you had a child support review since 2005? If not, it may be worth your while. You can also request a change to the exemptions, though the fact that father has additional exemptions now is probably not a factor.
We have had modifications but they never addressed that issue. I just never thought about it until this year. I've done some more research (but I'm not a lawyer and that's why I'm here seeking opinions :)) and since the IRS made changes in 2008 to Code Sec. 152(e)(2)(A) the IRS now requires the noncustodial parent to attach a signed Form 8332 each year. The judge in our case never ordered that I sign this form (likely as it was issued prior to the law change in 2008).

It seems that father should not have been able to file his returns from 2009-2013 without that form attached. But he did. This time I will let him know up front that he does not have the form and therefore he is not entitled per the IRS to take one of our children as an exemption.

ImtheFather, do you think given all this the state court will fault me for my interpretation of the situation? It seems murky and if I had the money of course I would see a family law atty about this question. If I use a tax preparer instead of filing my taxes myself and I rely on the tax preparer will that reduce the liklihood of any contempt concerns?
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA
Hi, not sure if this question is best answered here or in Child Support forum but I'll start here. The Order regarding child support is from 2005. I am the custodial parent. The court decreed in 2005 that Father would file as single and I would file HOH. The Order stated that we would each be entitled to two exemptions (one personal and one for one of our two children). I completed a release form for one year and father did not ask for one the remaining years but we continued to take one child each. However this year things are very different. Father is now married and has a new child born in 2014. So he can now file as HOH or married filing jointly whichever he prefers and he will now have his new child to as an exemption.
Dad cannot file Head of Household. Someone who is married is absolutely not permitted to claim head of household unless they have been separated from their spouse for the last 6 months of the year.

I want to claim both children this year as it makes a huge difference to me financially. The court order was vague about how long the 2 exemptions clause was to continue. It did not address the situation of Father's filing status changing from Single to Head of Household. So much has changed in the intervening years. I've been reading the IRS rules and it appears I am entitled to revoke the release at any time. Does anyone see any issue with me informing Father that I will be claiming both children this year?
Are you aware that you can claim head of household and EIC for both children, even if dad takes the exemption and the child tax credit for one of them?

I found this on AVVO
"What if the decree awards the exemption to the noncustodial parent?
Often, one or both sides use the dependency exemption as a bargaining chip to get what they want in the divorce. When this happens, the custodial parent typically assumes that he or she is legally obligated to forfeit any dependency exemptions that the court awards to the noncustodial parent in the divorce decree. This is a common, and often expensive, misconception. Because federal law supersedes state law, the IRS ultimately decides which parent claims the dependency exemption. No matter what the divorce decree says, the noncustodial parent cannot properly claim a dependency exemption unless he or she attaches the signed Form 8332 to his or her tax return documenting the custodial parent's written consent. Attaching a copy of the divorce decree to the return is not an acceptable substitute. If Form 8332 is not attached to the noncustodial parent's tax return, the IRS ultimately will deny the dependency deduction. So for tax purposes, the divorce decree is virtually irrelevant."
While the above is true, the state court judge could still find you in contempt for not obeying the court orders regarding the exemptions and order you to pay dad the money he would have received from claiming the child, therefore its not a good idea.

However, once again, you can claim head of household for the child dad is claiming, as well as EIC (and daycare credits too)...and could have all along. In fact, you could amend 2011, 2012, and 2013, to do so now.
 

I'mTheFather

Senior Member
I agree with the previous poster, and will also clarify that the IRS has their rules and family court has theirs. The IRS won't care that father didn't attach 8332 if no one else was claiming the child. The family court will care if you don't provide the form and claim the child if father is allowed to claim the exemption. Nothing you've stated indicates that father cannot claim the child.
 

Evanston

Junior Member
Dad cannot file Head of Household. Someone who is married is absolutely not permitted to claim head of household unless they have been separated from their spouse for the last 6 months of the year.


Are you aware that you can claim head of household and EIC for both children, even if dad takes the exemption and the child tax credit for one of them?


While the above is true, the state court judge could still find you in contempt for not obeying the court orders regarding the exemptions and order you to pay dad the money he would have received from claiming the child, therefore its not a good idea.

However, once again, you can claim head of household for the child dad is claiming, as well as EIC (and daycare credits too)...and could have all along. In fact, you could amend 2011, 2012, and 2013, to do so now.
Thanks LdJ. You're right he's been using the married filing jointly status last few years. I don't qualify for EIC this year for the first time ever but I had no idea I could amend my past years filings. That is really great news! Is that something that requires seeing an actual tax preparer or could I possibly file amendments using H&R block online program?
 

davew128

Senior Member
I just want to point out that that the divorce decree isn't worth the paper its printed on with regards to how each of you chooses a filing status. Filing status is determined by federal law, not the divorce court.
 

Evanston

Junior Member
I just want to point out that that the divorce decree isn't worth the paper its printed on with regards to how each of you chooses a filing status. Filing status is determined by federal law, not the divorce court.
Hi Dave. Sounds like that is the case with the IRS. But I am concerned about the CA family court. I would seriously hate to have a contempt case brought against me! Any savings on taxes would be wiped out by one mandatory flight out for a hearing in CA!
 

Evanston

Junior Member
LdJ why didn't I ask this three years ago!! kicking myself

Thanks LdJ. You're right he's been using the married filing jointly status last few years. I don't qualify for EIC this year for the first time ever but I had no idea I could amend my past years filings. That is really great news! Is that something that requires seeing an actual tax preparer or could I possibly file amendments using H&R block online program?
Went back to my old tax returns and only claimed one child for EIC credit 2006-2009. Claimed both for 2010 and and 2011 and 2013. Only one filing (2012) did only use 2 for EIC and falls within the required time frame to amend. Working on that now . .
 

Astrolink

Member
Went back to my old tax returns and only claimed one child for EIC credit 2006-2009. Claimed both for 2010 and and 2011 and 2013. Only one filing (2012) did only use 2 for EIC and falls within the required time frame to amend. Working on that now . .
I'm not a tax expert, but I believe you can only go back three years to make any corrections that result in additional tax refunds, as there is a three-year statute of limitations on issuing tax refund checks.
 

Evanston

Junior Member
Deadline post tomorrow??

I'm not a tax expert, but I believe you can only go back three years to make any corrections that result in additional tax refunds, as there is a three-year statute of limitations on issuing tax refund checks.
I filed my 2012 return on 2/2/13.

I found this "You must file a Form 1040X, Amended U.S. Individual Income Tax Return, within three years from the date you filed your original return or within two years from the date you paid the tax, whichever is later." .

So please tell me - if I send this certified mail tomorrow 2/2/15 will it be counted on time? That would be exactly 2 years after I filed my original return. I received a refund that year. But if I add my second child for EIC I get an additional 1000k back and I really need that money. What do you all think? Am I understanding this correctly?
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
I filed my 2012 return on 2/2/13.

I found this "You must file a Form 1040X, Amended U.S. Individual Income Tax Return, within three years from the date you filed your original return or within two years from the date you paid the tax, whichever is later." .

So please tell me - if I send this certified mail tomorrow 2/2/15 will it be counted on time? That would be exactly 2 years after I filed my original return. I received a refund that year. But if I add my second child for EIC I get an additional 1000k back and I really need that money. What do you all think? Am I understanding this correctly?
Yes, the opportunity to correct 2012 doesn't expire until April 15, 2016.
 

davew128

Senior Member
Hi Dave. Sounds like that is the case with the IRS. But I am concerned about the CA family court. I would seriously hate to have a contempt case brought against me! Any savings on taxes would be wiped out by one mandatory flight out for a hearing in CA!
A family court cannot tell you to take an illegal status on your federal tax return.
 

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