Florida unemployment - pay cut

[jlowi]

I was working for a local financial company in Orlando, FL area. Last month, I resigned from the company as my firm was asking me to take a demotion - reason cited as poor performance. I am thinking about suing these folks as i have received regular raises for last 6 years for meeting and often exceeding performance. So i don't understand why the performance issue - but that's another discussion.

I haven't applied for unemployment claims yet thinking i'm not qualified. But a friend of mine has suggested that i can be eligible for one.

I would like to get your advise before I apply.

thanks,
JL

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? FLWhat is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

 

[LeeHarveyBlotto]

Based on what you've told us, it's extremely unlikely you would be granted unemployment. That said, what's the harm in applying?

 

[cbg]

It's also extremely unlikely that you have any cause of action to sue.

 

[jlowi]

It's also extremely unlikely that you have any cause of action to sue.

I have few reasons:

- In March, I was told that i don't have knowledge about processes & procedure @my dept however in my last review in Oct, which i have in writing, I was told that i have mastery about processes & procedure, infact got kudos in my review!!
- I was told in my last review in Oct that i have too many projects assigned and this is the reason that i am behind on few. Later on in March, he compalined that i haven't finished projects on time.
- My supervisor has said on numerous occasions that people from <my country> have been taking American jobs. I asked him that is he not making a unprofessional remarks, he got furious in front of HR and said that this is true and a fact that people of <my country> are taking american jobs. Also during elections, he was asking me about my political inclination. Infact, he advised me to do research on a specific political party website and advised me to not to believe in just what we see on television.nc
- He has expressed anger on me by kicking boxes [abuse?]
- On two ocassions, he asked to skip lunch and DO WHAT HE SAYS RIGHT NOW.

 

[pattytx]

None of that makes a civil suit. Although the remarks about "my country" are unprofessional, I'm not seeing any damages that you have suffered because of the statement.

You can't sue for what you see as unfair or inaccurate statements on reviews. You can't sue for him kicking boxes; if he had kicked YOU, then you would have had an assault charge. He asked you to skip lunch, twice? Oh, no.

 

[Mass_Shyster]

I have few reasons:

Then go ahead and contact an attorney. I don't think it will go far, but I've been wrong before.

 

[ecmst12]

Florida doesn't require you EVER be allowed to take a lunch break.

If you think you have evidence that you were fired BECAUSE of your national origin, go ahead and file a claim with the EEOC.

 

[commentator]

file for unemployment in this situation? Definitely!

If this was a situation where you were told you had the choice of taking a demotion or being fired for poor performance (especially when you have documentation that your performance had not been considered poor in the past) by all means, file for your unemployment benefits. This sounds like a clear case of quit or be fired, which means the burden of proof would be on the employer (that they had a good job related reason to terminate or force the demotion). It sounds a lot as though they have not got a very good one, except that your supervisor had a problem with you personally. In making my case, I would not bring in issues such as the employer denying your your lunch or kicking boxes and behaving abusively. This will merely muddy the water of the original issue, that you were given the option of a demotion or being forced to quit supposedly due to your poor performance.

File for unemployment benefits immediately. There is no downside to filing the claim, the sooner the better, even if you expect to find something else very soon. My take is that you have a pretty good shot at benefits, though it may take some appeals. (Of course we can't ever say for sure!) A lot will be based on how thoroughly the company has documented those alleged performance issues. You do not need an attorney to file an initial claim. In Florida, you will not be able to file this on line, you will need to use the telephone system, since this is an "issue" claim.

As a person ahead of me has said, you can file an EEOC complaint if you feel that you were discriminated against due to your race, religious or political beliefs or your national origin. They will make an initial evaluation of whether they feel that you have a case worth considering. But there is usually little value in filing EEOC on the short term. Unemployment benefits to keep you afloat until you can find something else are important right now. If you quit your job for a valid job related reason, you have a fair shot at approval to draw. Good luck, sounds as though you needed a better job anyhow, which may be out there for you now.

 

[cbg]

FYI, political beliefs is not a protected characteristic under Federal law and is only protected by law in a minimum of states.

 

[ecmst12]

'Quit or take a demotion' is NOT even in the same neighborhood as 'quit or be fired' when it comes to unemployment. As far as the UC board is concerned, any work/income is preferred to none and they will deny a claim from anyone who preferred no work to offered/available work with a pay cut.

 

[commentator]

commentator

I respectfully disagree. Have been on those labor boards, and made those types of decisions, I maintain that any work the employer might have to offer is not the same as the work you were doing, and the decision will not go in favor of the employer based on the fact that there was a lesser or inappropriate job available to you with the employer. If the hiring agreement was that the employee was to be paid a certain amount, work a certain number of hours, and perform a certain set of duties, and the employer decides that he wishes to get rid of the employee but does not want to have to pay unemployment insurance, he cannot achieve this goal by offering the employee the choice of a job which pays much less, changes the work hours significantly (full time to part time for example) or changes his job duties significantly. It has certainly been tried by employers frequently. Rather than lay off an employee they try to get the employee to quit by any means they can. But if your former job is not available to you any more because of poor performance, and the only job that is now available to you with this company is different and less desirable, which amounts to a demotion and a pay cut, you may very well be approved. It will depend on the circumstances, of course, but is certainly worth filing for. If the employer is experiencing hard times and offers everyone in the business a pay cut due to the economic situation of the company, this may be a different issue all together, but it does not sound like this is the case or the intent of the lesser job offer in this situation.

 

[cbg]

Leaving aside the question of whether quitting because of a pay cut/demotion qualifies an employee for benefits, there still remains the question of the benefit itself.

I will admit straight out that my state is not Florida. And yes, all states are different and the formula will vary. I have, however, had employees in enough states, including Florida, to be able to say that a single example from my state should serve to explain my point.

In my state, the base period is 15 months. Your benefit will be roughly 50% of your averaged wages for that base period. For this purpose, the best possible situation for the employee is that, until the pay cut/demotion they had worked at the same wage for the entire base period. If at any time during the fifteen month base period you received an increase of any amount, this will lower the average.

What this means is that under the BEST POSSIBLE circumstances for the employee, (best for figuring the benefit) the pay cut or the reduced pay for the demotion would have to be a MINIMUM of 50% for the UI benefit to EQUAL the reduced wage. If the pay cut is less than 50%, or if the circumstances are less than ideal for the application of the formula, the employee will receive less money by quitting EVEN IF benefits are granted, than he would by staying on the job at the reduced rate.

Whereas, most if not all states will pay a partial benefit to make up some of the difference for an employee whose wages are cut.

So even if benefits are available, of what value is it to quit and receive still less money than working at the reduced rate would bring?

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

Florida is an at-will state. I don't have to have a reason to fire you - but I can't use one of the protected classes, and as earlier pointed out, politics is NOT one of those classes.

The employer cannot cut your wages PRIOR to the current period, but they can cut your pay going forward, as long as they pay minimum wage of $7.21/hour. Heck, I can be a super-duper employee and have it cut. Our county employees are having to deal with a furlough day each month. All over the place, people are having their wages cut, etc.

Oh - and our max pay for UI was $275/week. I think it just went up $25 per week.

 

[commentator]

didn't say you'd get much...

Yes, Florida is an at-will state, and the maximum weekly benefit right now is $275 per week. With the stimulus, an additional $25 per week was added to each weekly check. So no matter what, this person is probably going to have to take a huge drop in income if he quits his job and IS approved for benefits. But this does not mean he cannot quit the job instead of accepting the demotion and would not be approved for the benefits, however meager they are in the state.

Even in right to work states this does not mean you can not get unemployment if fired or forced to quit under questionable circumstances. It mostly means you cannot sue your employer for wrongfully discharging you. The employer can fire you for any reason known to man, but if they had no documented valid job related reason to terminate you, you may still be approved for unemployment benefits. Each case is individual. In many states, of which Florida is one, employers are taxed based on their "experience rating" which means that usually it is to their advantage if every employee quits and does not get approved to draw unemployment as this will cause their tax rate to be increased. If an employer demotes a professional employee to a non-professional job, or cuts his wages or hours dramatically, this may very well be interpreted as trying to force a quit.

If your job is cut back so dramatically that you are working all the hours the employer has available to you, and your gross pay for the week is less than the weekly benefit you could receive if drawing unemployment, they do pay "partial" unemployment to supplement your weekly earnings. But this is usually filed by the employer for the employees, and does not usually involve just one employee being demoted for performance issues. This would just have to be dealt with as an individual situation. If the person does agree to the lesser job and tries to work at the new position and the reduced rate of pay, and then later quits because it is not enough or he finds the new job duties unacceptable, benefits will very likely not be approved because he has made a personal decision to quit at that time, not precipitated by the employer. However, if the employer fires him because he does not accept the new job, he should definitely file for benefits. Unemployment benefits are never meant to be a good income replacement program, just something to get by on till the next job.

 

[cbg]

Right to work means you cannot be forced to join a union to get work. It has nothing to do with employment at will, hiring, firing, or unemployment benefits. If you're going to set yourself up as an expert, please at least get the terminology right.

I still maintain that it does the employee no good to quit over a pay cut if the UI benefits he may receive will be less than he would have earned at the reduced wage.