Grandfather with no will

[JOEYBELLO]

What is the name of your state? New York

The recent issues with my my father's mothers death have made me think about what would have happened when my mother's father died.

he died in sept 1999. He had no will. He had a house. and over 200,000 is investments/banking accounts. I am not sure which assets were entirely in his name and which were joint. I ran a land check on the local website and it only shows my grandmother's recent actiivity this year. There are no records with his name or both their names. Saying he died with no will. Does the wife automatically get 100%? Or can the kids and grandkids fight for some of it? How long of a time limit is there on things like this? I know its probably too late. But I am curious. Because he always told me he had money for me and my mother. But we didn't get a dime. And I just foudn out last night that my sneaky aunt who works for a lawyer had the house signed over to her 3 weeks ago.

 

[Dandy Don]

It probably is too late, but you must check at the county courthouse surrogate court for whatever county he died in to see if anybody filed to open up probate for his estate. If someone did, there will be a file to look at to see how the estate was handled.

If there is no probate, do you know the name of the company that had the investments? Check with that company to see if the account is still there or not.

 

[JOEYBELLO]

It probably is too late, but you must check at the county courthouse surrogate court for whatever county he died in to see if anybody filed to open up probate for his estate. If someone did, there will be a file to look at to see how the estate was handled.

If there is no probate, do you know the name of the company that had the investments? Check with that company to see if the account is still there or not.

My uncle is a big shot at Merril Lynch and he took care of most of their money and investments. I saw an actual statement that came once. It had over 200,000$ in it and I know my grand father also had bank accounts atleast 2 different ones. I think my uncle's name was on the investments also.. but the bank accounts were probably in his name alone. But I have no idea what happened I think my grandmother just left everything the way it was and uses it. Because there are still plenty of things that come in the mail in his name even though he is dead. I am not sure if she changed any of this recently but up until not long ago I still saw plenty of things in his name.

 

[JOEYBELLO]

It probably is too late, but you must check at the county courthouse surrogate court for whatever county he died in to see if anybody filed to open up probate for his estate. If someone did, there will be a file to look at to see how the estate was handled.

If there is no probate, do you know the name of the company that had the investments? Check with that company to see if the account is still there or not.

The county is Westchester and you say check to see if someone opened probate. Don't you need a will to do that?

 

[anteater]

Don't you need a will to do that?

Joey -

If you are going to be rummaging around the family tree, you need to do an internet search on "probate." You can probably find some intro articles on this site.

Probate is the legal process of wrapping up the affairs of someone who is deceased. It includes collecting the deceased's assets, paying legitimate creditors, and distributing the remaining assets. If there is a valid will, then the assets would be distributed according to the wishes expressed in that will (but see the next paragraph). If there is no valid will, then the assets are distributed according to the applicable state's intestate succession statutes.

However, the probate process only applies to assets that the deceased owned solely (or co-owned without the right of survivorship). Assets that have beneficiary designations (Pay on Death or Transfer on Death accounts, life insurance, IRA's, etc) or assets owned jointly with right of survivorship or assets in a trust transfer to the designated beneficiaries or to the joint owner(s) outside the probate process - by what is often called by operation of law.

 

[JOEYBELLO]

So you cannot contest anything passed by the operation of the law?

Joey -

If you are going to be rummaging around the family tree, you need to do an internet search on "probate." You can probably find some intro articles on this site.

Probate is the legal process of wrapping up the affairs of someone who is deceased. It includes collecting the deceased's assets, paying legitimate creditors, and distributing the remaining assets. If there is a valid will, then the assets would be distributed according to the wishes expressed in that will (but see the next paragraph). If there is no valid will, then the assets are distributed according to the applicable state's intestate succession statutes.

However, the probate process only applies to assets that the deceased owned solely (or co-owned without the right of survivorship). Assets that have beneficiary designations (Pay on Death or Transfer on Death accounts, life insurance, IRA's, etc) or assets owned jointly with right of survivorship or assets in a trust transfer to the designated beneficiaries or to the joint owner(s) outside the probate process - by what is often called by operation of law.

 

[anteater]

Well, yes, creation of joint ownership, beneficiary designations, etc can be "contested." But you have to prove that some worngdoing occurred or the deceased was not legally competent to take those actions. That is a tall order when one of the parties is not around any longer to testify.

In one of your posts, you referred to gaining knowledge from "TV and stuff." This is the real world. On TV and in the other media, nobody mentions the costs invovled and the low odds of success. Nor do they mention that not every attorney is Perry Mason, regularly pulling rabbits out of his hat.

I can't recall the numbers, but I do remember an article that put the percentage of successful will contests in the single digits. And that is for wills, where you have a writing (and the potential of technical defects), witnesses, usually an attorney who was involved, possibly prior wills.... In other words a fair amount of potential evidence.

What do you have for creation of a joint account or a beneficiary designation? Usually just a signed form. Unlesss there is red-handed forgery, you are generally left with trying to prove that the deceased did not intend to do what they did. And intent is tough to prove when the person that signed that form can't testify.