My cousins cheated us out of our inheritance when selling grandfather's condominium

[Trudijane]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? I live in SF, all this occurred in Florida.

I hope someone can help us or give us advice. It's hard to make this brief but I'll try.

I'll go back to my grandfather and his Will. He had 2 daughters (my mother and my Aunt). He lived in a condo in Florida for many years. His Will specifically left 1/2 of his total Estate (including the proceeds of the sale of the Condo) to my mother and 1/2 to my Aunt. When one or both of them passed away, 1/2 of the estate was to be distributed to My brothers and I and the other half to my 3 cousins. I have a copy of my Grandfather's last will and Testament. Furthermore, I also have another legal document or "contract" between my mother and my aunt (when they were both alive) saying that my Aunt could live in my grandfather's condominium until she decided to sell it at which time 1/2 of the sale was to be distributed to my mother. This contract protected my Aunt from being kicked out of the Condo and my mother was in agreement with that until she herself decided to sell it.

My mom passed away in 2000 and all I know is the sale of the condo was noted as 1/2 of my mom's estate. However, my aunt was still living there with my grandfather. As far as we knew, there was no intention of my Aunt selling that condo.

These are the circumstances of how my mom and aunt came to live in Florida from NY. My parents retired in Florida plus both my grandparents were failing in their health and my mom, although in a separate condo nearby spent many years taking care of my grandparents which caused a lot of stress in my mother's life.

Several years later, and after my grandmother died, my Aunt decided to move to Florida and in the condo with my Grandfather to take care of him, rent-free and she spent a lot of my grandpa's money to remodel the condo (which was very nice) while she lived there. My grandfather's health got worse & worse so both my mom and aunt continued to help take care of him. After my grandfather died at age 99, my aunt continued to live there and my aunt felt that the condo should belong 100% to her because of all the sacrifices she had to make, etc. They had many feuds over this issue because 1/2 of the condo was my mothers when, and only when my aunt decided to sell it. At one time when I was visiting, my aunt offered me $5,000 to waive any inheritance rights I might have in the future if the condo was sold. I consulted with my brothers about this and they told me to turn it down as the eventual sale of the condo would bring me a lot more. So, I did.

My aunt eventually had to go into Assisted Living which I knew about, but as far as I knew, they still held on to the Condo. However, indirectly, about 6 months ago I found out that my aunt gave the condo to my cousins as a gift? I'm not sure ... and they sold the condo in 2008 for $70,000. I immediately contacted my remaining brother and asked him if he was aware of this. He was not and since we had learned that they kept the proceeds of the sale entirely for themselves, we have been writing, E-mailing, etc. informing them of an issue that they already knew about. In the midst of all this, my Aunt just passed away 2 weeks ago and I went to the funeral only because I loved my Aunt despite her greediness and had not seen her for a long time.

I believe my younger cousin was about to do the right thing by distributing a check 3 ways (my brother, my SIL in lieu of my deceased brother and I). Plus the actual intention of my brother was that I was to receive my SIL share so I would have gotten more. Suddenly after most of the communication with my younger cousin, he suddenly tells my brother that his older sister is now in charge.

However, no matter how much we try and talk to her and thus far we have been amicable, she does not return our communications. We were even willing to negotiate a much lesser amount.

I feel very betrayed now by a cousin that I once had respect for. It seems that the only thing left to do is to retain a lawyer in Florida, however, I was told by an attorney in SF that it would be hard to find a lawyer who would take the case on contingency because the amount was too small, and my brother nor I are not in a position to spend close to the amount we are entitled to.

Is there anything that we can do to make a wrong, right? We feel betrayed, cheated and I'm trying to fight for my mom who is no longer here anymore. I have the will and the notarized copy of the agreement between my mother and Aunt to back up our claims.

Can anyone offer any advice? I am sorry this is so long.

Thank you for reading.
Trudijane

 

[anteater]

It would help if you put this into a simple timeline. Because in one place you say:

My mom passed away in 2000... However, my aunt was still living there with my grandfather.

And elsewhere:

After my grandfather died at age 99, my aunt continued to live there and my aunt felt that the condo should belong 100% to her because of all the sacrifices she had to make, etc. They had many feuds over this issue because 1/2 of the condo was my mothers when, and only when my aunt decided to sell it

One implies that your mother passed away before grandfather. The other implies that your grandfather passed away before your mother.

As a first order of business, I would suggest that you find out who really owned the property by researching the deeds. That your aunt could gift the property and that the cousins could sell it implies that your aunt owned the property.

One way or the other, you are going to have to pay an attorney a good sum to pursue this. Although, perhaps having an attorney write a suitably threatening letter might get you something on the cheap.

And I have no idea what this means:

...all I know is the sale of the condo was noted as 1/2 of my mom's estate.

Noted where? Noted by whom?

 

[Zigner]

If your mom passed away before your grandpa, then it's entirely possible that you weren't entitled to anything...

 

[justalayman]

His Will specifically left 1/2 of his total Estate (including the proceeds of the sale of the Condo) to my mother and 1/2 to my Aunt. When one or both of them passed away, 1/2 of the estate was to be distributed to My brothers and I and the other half to my 3 cousins.

sorry but it doesn't work that way. If he left 1/2 to mom and 1/2 to aunt, he no longer had control of anything after that. It would be up to mom and aunt to determine what to do with their estates upon their deaths.

Several years later, and after my grandmother died, my Aunt decided to move to Florida and in the condo with my Grandfather to take care of him, and in the condo with my Grandfather to take care of him, rent-free and she spent a lot of my grandpa's money to remodel the condo (which was very nice) while she lived there

I would think your grandfather had to approve of the situation and the expenditures. After all, it was his home and his money.

After my grandfather died at age 99, my aunt continued to live there and my aunt felt that the condo should belong 100% to her because of all the sacrifices she had to make, etc.

It sounds like nobody probated the will and estate or your mother agreed with aunt living there and did nothing to claim her share of the estate. Regardless what aunt believed, the will is what would direct the distribution of the estate.

I believe my younger cousin was about to do the right thing by distributing a check 3 ways (my brother, my SIL in lieu of my deceased brother and I). Plus the actual intention of my brother was that I was to receive my SIL share so I would have gotten more. Suddenly after most of the communication with my younger cousin, he suddenly tells my brother that his older sister is now in charge.

since you appear to be lacking in information, I do not see how you can determine what the right thing is. Beyond that, your brother would have no control over your SIL's share (and why does your SIL even have a share?) Depending on exactly how anybody's estate was distributed, SIL may have had no share.

Is there anything that we can do to make a wrong, right? We feel betrayed, cheated and I'm trying to fight for my mom who is no longer here anymore. I have the will and the notarized copy of the agreement between my mother and Aunt to back up our claims.

what agreement and whose will?

 

[Trudijane]

PS to anteater

...all I know is the sale of the condo was noted as 1/2 of my mom's estate.

What I meant by this is before my mom & dad died, they wrote my brothers & I a detailed summary of ALL their assets. The CDs, money markets, etc. and last on the list was 1/2 of the proceeds when my grandfather's condominium was sold as stipulated in his will.

My aunt sold the condo, but she never owned it as far as I know. I don't how this works really. Who else would sell it if my grandparents were deceased. The remaining person living there. However, even though my aunt was living there, it was intended that both my aunt and mother owned 1/2 of the property after my grandfather died and when sold it would be half & half and then on to the heirs.

 

[Trudijane]

If your mom passed away before your grandpa, then it's entirely possible that you weren't entitled to anything...

My grandfather passed away many years before my mother. I have all the dates in chronological order. My mom passed away in 2000. My Aunt passed away 2 weeks ago in the midst of dealing with this issue with my cousins.

My brother & I went to the funeral. I don't want to create any rift in my remaining family, but I strongly believe that my cousins kept their mom's half for themselves and never bothered to even tell us when the Condo was sold. There seems to be a lot of secrecy going on.

 

[justalayman]

so, was title ever transferred to your mother and your aunt?

The CDs, money markets, etc. and last on the list was 1/2 of the proceeds when my grandfather's condominium was sold as stipulated in his will.

did you ever see an actual will? A list does not generally qualify as a will so it is meaningless once the writer dies.

If you are going to bother with this, you have to research the actions takien when your grandfathers estate was probated in court. If there was a will, it would be on record in the file. You can get a copy of that by contacting the court the action was filed in.

My aunt sold the condo, but she never owned it as far as I know. I don't how this works really. Who else would sell it if my grandparents were deceased. The remaining person living there.

nope, not how it works. The owner or the representative of the estate is who would have the authority to sell the property.

The problem I see is: you simply do not have enough of the facts to be able to determine what happened and if what happened was proper or not.

 

[Trudijane]

sorry but it doesn't work that way. If he left 1/2 to mom and 1/2 to aunt, he no longer had control of anything after that. It would be up to mom and aunt to determine what to do with their estates upon their deaths.

YES, which is why they drew up a separate Agreement between themselves notarized in Florida as to what would happen to the Condo. It's very clear and very legal.

I would think your grandfather had to approve of the situation and the expenditures. After all, it was his home and his money.

He was senile at the time that my Aunt took over. I don't think he was capable of approving anything, however, I'm sure she spent his money as she had no income of her own

It sounds like nobody probated the will and estate or your mother agreed with aunt living there and did nothing to claim her share of the estate. Regardless what aunt believed, the will is what would direct the distribution of the estate.

My thoughts are that the Will was NOT probated. I researched that and there was none in the courts.. This is what the Agreement between my mother and Aunt was subsequently about. We did not want to kick her out of the condo and sell it as she wanted to live there, but the agreement states that when/if she did, 1/2 of the sale would go to either my mom if she were alive or us, if not. Why do you think my aunt offered me $5,000 to waive my rights to this inheritance?

since you appear to be lacking in information, I do not see how you can determine what the right thing is.

What info are we lacking? We have a Will. We have a legal Agreement between my mother an aunt. Our own cousins also know that we are entitled to half - they just don't want to give it to us, lol and they have nothing to prove otherwise.

 

[justalayman]

YES, which is why they drew up a separate Agreement between themselves notarized in Florida as to what would happen to the Condo. It's very clear and very legal.

make up your mind; either granpa's will directed 1/2 of the value of the condo to go to each child or the children made some agreeement.

He was senile at the time that my Aunt took over. I don't think he was capable of approving anything, however, I'm sure she spent his money as she had no income of her own

and yet she also took care of him, right? Taking care of an elderly person, especially one who is not all there mentally is a very difficult job. If she did not work so she could take care of him, of course his money would support her. I guess she could have refused and let dad go to a nursing home. Unless he had great insurance to pay for it, want to guess what would happen to his money in that situation?

My thoughts are that the Will was NOT probated. I researched that and there was none in the courts.. This is what the Agreement between my mother and Aunt was subsequently about. We did not want to kick her out of the condo and sell it as she wanted to live there, but the agreement states that when/if she did, 1/2 of the sale would go to either my mom if she were alive or us, if not. Why do you think my aunt offered me $5,000 to waive my rights to this inheritance?

well, if your mother refused to see that her fathers estate was probated so the will could be enforced, you end up with a mess. If the grandfathers estate was never probated, then your aunt could not sell the property. I suspect there is something that you are not aware of such as grandpa put auntie on the title to the condo or some similar act that made her the owner of the condo when her father died. That is traceable through the deeds.

What info are we lacking? We have a Will. We have a legal Agreement between my mother an aunt. Our own cousins also know that we are entitled to half - they just don't want to give it to us, lol and they have nothing to prove otherwise.

You have your grandfathers will? If it was never presented for probate, you have a real mess now but your mother is as much to blame as your aunt if that is the case.

so, what info are you lacking? Who owned your grandfathers condo at his death? How did your aunt supposedly sell a piece of real estate she did not own?

 

[Trudijane]

Response to justalayman

so, was title ever transferred to your mother and your aunt?

I'm not sure. My mom & dad lived in their own condo not far from my aunt and my aunt just continued to live in the condo after my grandfather died. We are not aware if title was ever transferred to anyone.

did you ever see an actual will? A list does not generally qualify as a will so it is meaningless once the writer dies.

Did you read my post??? I have a copy of the actual Will. I know the list is NOT legal. I'm just explaining that it was known by everyone in the family what the intentions were after the sale of my grandfather's condo WHEN my aunt decided to sell it. There was another legal document between my mom & my aunt very specifically saying who what was entitled to what after the sale.

If you are going to bother with this, you have to research the actions takien when your grandfathers estate was probated in court.

You have NO idea just how much time & research I've done concerning this issue. So much so that it has my cousins very caught off guard. They are ignoring us for a reason. And a person could have a Will and NOT have it probated in Court. It should have been, but it wasn't because I already researched this in Florida, and there was no record of my Grandfather's Will, yet both my cousins and I have the same copy of his Last Will and Testament which divides ALL his assets 50% to mom and 50% to my Aunt.

So you're wrong that IF there was a will - there IS a will. It just was not probated in court as it should have been. My aunt was responsible for doing that. Makes you wonder why she didn't, doesn't it?

nope, not how it works. The owner or the representative of the estate is who would have the authority to sell the property.

We don't know how she managed to sell the property w/o distribution of what we were entitled to. That's what we're trying to find out in a so-far amicable way. I asked my cousin to explain to us her side of the story if perhaps I didn't understand something. We are being ignored.

The problem I see is: you simply do not have enough of the facts to be able to determine what happened and if what happened was proper or not.

We think we do, and I think that unless you are a lawyer, you don't know enough to really know who was entitled to what. The probate lawyer that I spoke with in SF said we had a very good case but it's complex and we'd wind up spending a lot of money unless we could find a lawyer to take it on a contingency basis. But he saw the legal documents that we dated and compiled and he feels we were taken.

Trudijane

 

[justalayman]

And a person could have a Will and NOT have it probated in Court

and if that is the case, the will means nothing. It is required to present a will for probate for it to have any effect on the estate.

My aunt was responsible for doing that

No, she wasn't. She could have opened probate but so could your mother. Since your aunt did not open probate, your mother should have done so. She didn't for some reason. Kind of makes one wonder why.

Makes you wonder why she didn't, doesn't it?

Not at all. What I wonder about is why your mother didn't open probate.

We don't know how she managed to sell the property w/o distribution of what we were entitled to. That's what we're trying to find out in a so-far amicable way. I asked my cousin to explain to us her side of the story if perhaps I didn't understand something. We are being ignored.

why are you even asking the relatives. Everything you need to know is discoverable in the public records.

We think we do, and I think that unless you are a lawyer, you don't know enough to really know who was entitled to what.

based on what you have stated, you do not have enough information to understand what happened and being a lawyer or not is not required to realize that. As to who is entitled to what: that is based in the laws of Florida. If you know how to read, it tells you who is entitled to what.

The probate lawyer that I spoke with in SF said we had a very good case but it's complex and we'd wind up spending a lot of money unless we could find a lawyer to take it on a contingency basis.

Unless there is a lot of money to be had, no lawyer will take it on contingency. So, that leaves you with nothing.

But he saw the legal documents that we dated and compiled and he feels we were taken.

documents you dated? I sure hope that doesn't mean what is sounds like it means.

Anyway, feeling you were taken is far from knowing there was something illegal with what happened. Being taken means you are out of luck. Only if there was something illegal would you have a legitimate course of action available.

 

[anteater]

The probate lawyer that I spoke with in SF said we had a very good case but it's complex and we'd wind up spending a lot of money unless we could find a lawyer to take it on a contingency basis. But he saw the legal documents that we dated and compiled and he feels we were taken.

Then, I'm rather lost. After all these words, what is your question?

In my first response, I said:

One way or the other, you are going to have to pay an attorney a good sum to pursue this. Although, perhaps having an attorney write a suitably threatening letter might get you something on the cheap.

Ask the attorney in SF to write that letter. If that does not work, be prepared to look for an attorney in Florida.

 

[curb1]

Trudijane,

You need to answer the question of whom was on the title when your grandfather died. That won't cost you anything, or very little, to find that information at the courthouse. Knowing that information could very possibly determine whether, or not, you will have a case.

 

[anteater]

I just want to add...

Florida has some unique law surrounding homesteads. If grandfather's condo was his homestead, it may not have been a probate asset. If I recall, there is a process for petitioning the court for something that I think is called a "Determination of Homestead" - or something like that. Once the court approves, the homestead property can be transferred to the heirs/devisees.

I remember seeing attorneys advertising to do it for a couple hundred bucks.

 

[LdiJ]

To be honest, I do not think that there is enough money involved here to try to pursue anything legally.

In order for a property to be sold, there has to be a clear title. So somehow, somewhere it was able to be sold, which indicates that the titled somehow passed differently than the will that you have.

Unraveling that would be very expensive legally (hence why no lawyers are willing to take it on contingency) which indicates that the legal cost of trying to make a claim could be greater than the eventual proceeds.

For example, if somehow your grandfather gifted the condo to your aunt before he died, that would negate his will...unless you could prove that it happened fraudulently. Then when your aunt went into assisted living the condo may have been sold to cover her expenses there, and perhaps even so that eventually medicaid could kick in...so your cousins may have received nothing.

You can certainly research the deed to see what happened there, and its probably something that you should do before attempting any legal action. However, again and honestly, the cost of litigating this may be greater than anything you could hope to receive.