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Release of Liability on sale 11 years ago.

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Tonersniffer

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California

Just received a call from a collections agency that I'm in collections for a camping trailer I sold 11 years go. Seems the trailer was towed from the side of the road and was at the tow yard, they sent notices to old address that I moved from that address over 12 years ago and guess I didn't change the address on the trailer, PTI plate you don't get tags to pay each year. I sold the trailer to a nice couple 11 years ago and he never registered it and I thought I sent in the release of liability. After contacting him and asked why he didn't register it in his name, he said I never gave him the pink slip. Apparently I told him he would have to file for a duplicate title but I wouldn't sell it without a pink, that's just stupid. He gave the trailer away 5 years later since he had no pink and that party is the one that had it towed.

I have no proof of sale other than a few emails. He agreed to do sign a bill of sale and have it notarized that he did purchase it and he was responsible for title transfer.
 


Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California

Just received a call from a collections agency that I'm in collections for a camping trailer I sold 11 years go. Seems the trailer was towed from the side of the road and was at the tow yard, they sent notices to old address that I moved from that address over 12 years ago and guess I didn't change the address on the trailer, PTI plate you don't get tags to pay each year. I sold the trailer to a nice couple 11 years ago and he never registered it and I thought I sent in the release of liability. After contacting him and asked why he didn't register it in his name, he said I never gave him the pink slip. Apparently I told him he would have to file for a duplicate title but I wouldn't sell it without a pink, that's just stupid. He gave the trailer away 5 years later since he had no pink and that party is the one that had it towed.

I have no proof of sale other than a few emails. He agreed to do sign a bill of sale and have it notarized that he did purchase it and he was responsible for title transfer.
Honestly, your best bet may be to pay the bill since you don't have any evidence that you sent a release of liability.
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
Honestly, your best bet may be to pay the bill since you don't have any evidence that you sent a release of liability.
Those accumulated bills for storage and towing from tow yards can be enormous. Not many people would have kept records of sending a release of liability for 11 plus years. I would go have a discussion with the DMV before contemplating paying the collection agency. I also want to check the statute of limitations as well.
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
Those accumulated bills for storage and towing from tow yards can be enormous. Not many people would have kept records of sending a release of liability for 11 plus years. I would go have a discussion with the DMV before contemplating paying the collection agency. I also want to check the statute of limitations as well.
The OP would have continued to receive registration renewals (at least two) as well as notices. Unfortunately, the OP didn't maintain the proper address. It can't hurt to speak with the various parties involved, but I don't see much coming of it since the OP never even provided a title...
 

Tonersniffer

Junior Member
The OP would have continued to receive registration renewals (at least two) as well as notices. Unfortunately, the OP didn't maintain the proper address. It can't hurt to speak with the various parties involved, but I don't see much coming of it since the OP never even provided a title...
It never crossed my mind on the proper address as I assumed the buyer registered it and they were going to the new address. Will a statement of facts notarized and signed by both parties help?
 

Tonersniffer

Junior Member
Those accumulated bills for storage and towing from tow yards can be enormous. Not many people would have kept records of sending a release of liability for 11 plus years. I would go have a discussion with the DMV before contemplating paying the collection agency. I also want to check the statute of limitations as well.
$3500 before they sent it to Pick N' Pull. $400 something for towing and $65 a day for storage fees. I'm wondering if they are will to negotiate fees?
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
$3500 before they sent it to Pick N' Pull. $400 something for towing and $65 a day for storage fees. I'm wondering if they are will to negotiate fees?
A collection agency might negotiate a payoff but you have to be very careful to make sure that they release all liability. Some collection agencies have been known to negotiate a payoff and then sell off the balance to a third tier collection agency.

Personally, I wouldn't pay them at all. Yes, it damages your credit to have something in collections but you sold the trailer 11 years ago and should not be responsible for that bill. I would let them sue me and let a judge decide. I would even bring in the person you sold it to into the case if necessary.
 

Tonersniffer

Junior Member
A collection agency might negotiate a payoff but you have to be very careful to make sure that they release all liability. Some collection agencies have been known to negotiate a payoff and then sell off the balance to a third tier collection agency.

Personally, I wouldn't pay them at all. Yes, it damages your credit to have something in collections but you sold the trailer 11 years ago and should not be responsible for that bill. I would let them sue me and let a judge decide. I would even bring in the person you sold it to into the case if necessary.
Some new light. The person I sold it to, who then later gave it away, provided me with copy of a bill of sale on a DMV form with our names, dates, and price. Not sure if that is proof enough for the collections to get me off the hook. He also provided the application for transfer of title with duplicate title on the DMV form and I think this is where we screwed up. We never completed the form or had it notarized. He also provided a letter that is signed by himself and the person he gave it to in March of 2017. Again, not sure if that is enough for the collectors or for DMV to finish the paperwork, if at all possible.
 
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LdiJ

Senior Member
Some new light. The person I sold it to, who then later gave it away, provided me with copy of a bill of sale on a DMV form with our names, dates, and price. Not sure if that is proof enough for the collections to get me off the hook. He also provided the application for transfer of title with duplicate title on the DMV form and I think this is where we screwed up. We never completed the form or had it notarized. He also provided a letter that is signed by himself and the person he gave it to in March of 2017. Again, not sure if that is enough for the collectors or for DMV to finish the paperwork, if at all possible.
It might not be enough for the collection agency, because, quite frankly, they have little interest in resolving the matter if it does not involve them getting money from you. Again, if you prove that they cannot collect from you, they might just very well sell the debt on to another collection agency. It certainly however, will be useful should you eventually get sued for the debt, since you will be able to demonstrate who the actual owner was at the time it was towed.
 

Tonersniffer

Junior Member
So at this point is it even worth going to DMV and having it transferred to the person who actually bought it? Even if DMV does do the transfer it's after the incident. Would contact the towing company after the title has changed make any difference?
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
So at this point is it even worth going to DMV and having it transferred to the person who actually bought it? Even if DMV does do the transfer it's after the incident. Would contact the towing company after the title has changed make any difference?
You need to speak with the DMV, in person. Take all of your documents to the DMV and ask, in person, how you can get their records updated to show that you are no longer financially responsible for the trailer as of 11 years ago. If they do update their records, then you can show all of that to the tow company and/or the collection agency to be let off the hook, so to speak.

Just to be clear...your beef is not with the new (as of March, 2017) owner, your beef is with the guy you sold it to 11 years ago.
 

Tonersniffer

Junior Member
You need to speak with the DMV, in person. Take all of your documents to the DMV and ask, in person, how you can get their records updated to show that you are no longer financially responsible for the trailer as of 11 years ago. If they do update their records, then you can show all of that to the tow company and/or the collection agency to be let off the hook, so to speak.

Just to be clear...your beef is not with the new (as of March, 2017) owner, your beef is with the guy you sold it to 11 years ago.
That's what I was thinking of doing, makes the most sense. I'll schedule an appointment with DMV and see what happens. Should I have the old transfer of ownership notarized or start fresh?
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
That's what I was thinking of doing, makes the most sense. I'll schedule an appointment with DMV and see what happens. Should I have the old transfer of ownership notarized or start fresh?
You need to take the original documents in - you're not going to get out of this by creating new documents. In fact, your best bet is to go in with the guy you transferred it to, if you can swing that.
 

Tonersniffer

Junior Member
You need to take the original documents in - you're not going to get out of this by creating new documents. In fact, your best bet is to go in with the guy you transferred it to, if you can swing that.
Got it, not just to see if he is willing to take time off work.
 

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