she lied about birth control...options?

[UncleMe]

state: texas
situation...
she claimed birth control but was never on it, the baby is due in a few months.

What rights/options are out there towards...
1. the father giving up all custody with no strings attached or child support payments.
2. the father taking the baby (sole custody?) and the mom pays child support.
3. other options?

this is my brother's situation. we are worried that he will get stuck babysitting and paying for a child created by her manipulation and deception. BTW, both are about 20 years old. She is possibly borderline unstable.
Thanks

 

[Ambr]

take it you aren't married?

she will have to establish paternity before you are liable for anything. chance of more than one possibility on the father?

(1) if she is willing to allow you to do so, and you can get it drawn up in court records - that way she can't come back after you - try it.

(2) you would have to prove her unfit to get the baby and if your only reason for wanting the baby is so the mother has to pay support - YOU DON"T NEED THE BABY!!!!!!

(3) you grow up. you played - now you pay. let her have the baby. take a paternity test. estsablish your paternity. take the financial obligation for your child. another suggestion would be for you to get to know your child, build a relationship with your child. and you do that through visitations.

but you have to quit thinking - what about me, she screwed me. and start thinking - this is my child, i have to make things right.

18 years from now, i can see a child knocking on your door wanting to know what was wrong with them. why you didn't want them. slugging you and walking off. shame will be - that there is a child out there and you are missing their life. first steps, first words, first romance, graduation, marriage and grandkids.

you are a real winner!

 

[UncleMe]

man trapping

>>take it you aren't married?

They hardly know each other.

>>if your only reason for wanting the baby is so the mother has to pay support - YOU DON"T NEED THE BABY!!!!!!

It has nothing to do with that. Seeing as she created this situation, we believe she should at least be financially responsible for the child. It would be expected of the dad but not the mom? You say "he" should pay but when the idea of "she" paying comes up it is all of the sudden greedy or malicious in some way?

>>(3) you grow up. you played - now you pay.

The same could much more appropriately be told to the mother. She trapped him into giving her a baby and then will use him to financially support it and be the weekend babysitter.

>>take the financial obligation for your child.

If we can prove she lied about birth control, does that relieve him of all responsibility if he so chooses? Would it be grounds for sole custody (would this be considered a grossly immoral act on her part)?

 

[Ambr]

§ 160.254. Knowledge of Pregnancy

(a) A person who has sexual intercourse with a person of the opposite sex is deemed to have knowledge that sexual intercourse can result in the woman's pregnancy.

================================================

§ 160.102. Order for Parentage Testing

(a) When the respondent appears in a parentage suit, the court shall order the mother, an alleged father, and the child to submit to the taking of blood, body fluid, or tissue samples for the purpose of scientifically accepted parentage testing.

(b) If the respondent fails to appear and wholly defaults or if the allegation of parentage is admitted, the court may waive parentage testing.

=================================================

§ 160.005. Conservatorship, Support, and Payments

(b) On a finding of parentage, the court may order support retroactive to the time of the birth of the child and, on a proper showing, may order a party to pay an equitable portion of all prenatal and postnatal health care expenses of the mother and child.

(c) In making an order for retroactive child support under this section, the court shall use the child support guidelines provided by Chapter 154 together with any relevant factors.

 

[UncleMe]

fraud for baby

>>§ 160.254. Knowledge of Pregnancy

It's not a matter of whether he understood the birds and the bees.

>>§ 160.102. Order for Parentage Testing

It's not a matter of who's baby it is*; only if his legal rights are affected by her viscious fraud. This was not a simple "oops, she got pregnant." This was literally a scheme on her part: she wanted a baby and didn't care how she got it.

>>On a finding of parentage, the court may order support

MAY order support. Depending on the situation.

>>the court shall use the child support guidelines provided by Chapter 154 together with any relevant factors.

Relevant factors is the part I'm getting at.


*this is in no way an admission of parenthood.

 

[jyoung]

and I suppose she forced him at gunpoint to do the nasty with her right? hope so cause that's the only way he's off the hook-- he plays he pays and thats the story. Good luck to this kid because he/she is going to need all the help that it can find.....

 

[UncleMe]

rules are rules, there are no relevant issues, I guess

>>I suppose she forced him at gunpoint

You get more with sugar than vinegar, right? Who needs a gun when you can manipulate and lie to get what you want. One is no less bad than the other, they are just different means to the same wrong end.

I imagine people would feel different if I said...
HE lied to HER and ruined HER life by getting her pregnant after lieing to her that he had a vasectomy. Do you think people would be saying "suck it up, chick...that's life and now you have a baby and you better take care of it. and don't even ask him for child support. You knew it was possible to get pregnant even though he had a vasectomy. It means NOTHING that he told you he had a vasectomy."

That would seem to me to be a ridiculous thing to tell hypothetical girl. Just as ridiculous as what I've been hearing so far that He should do.

It's just like rape...nobody takes it seriously when the guy is complaining.

>>he plays he pays and thats the story.

I doubt it is as simple as that. What do you think should happen in this situation? Not just about him taking financial responsibility, but about where the kid should be kept and about both parents' rights. It's easy to spout off: "make him pay!" but harder to make that decision when you take the whole situation into account. You are focussing on minor aspects of this situation as a whole and ignoring the rest.

Are there any lawyers out there who can give some real legal advice instead of just moral judgements mixed with amatuer legal advice? I mean no offense; just looking for some real answers.

Not that I don't like the moral judgements and amatuer legal advice...it's always fun to debate.

 

[Ambr]

you have a lawyer????

he must not have given you the quick fix answer that you were wanting......hmmmm.......may he agrees wiuh us?

 

[2goodgirls]

sounds like he realy wants to do the right thing. Take sole custody so she would have to pay support.
Is that his way to punish her or to punish the kid.
What a life that baby would have with him. At least if she did this because she wanted a baby, at least she may take care of the baby with a little respect. What kind of price will the baby have to pay in the fathers custody, other than being part of his nasty revenge.

 

[UncleMe]

man trapping

>>Take sole custody so she would have to pay support.

No, that is wrong. How many times will I have to say this? It has nothing to do with "making her pay" but that she should "be liable and pay for the situation she caused." She lied and created a person (and huge financial obligation) because of it. He is possibly willing to take this kid and raise it so that it will have a better life than living with that immoral, lieing woman. Don't you think she should pay child support in that situation? She is the one who is BAD here. Yet you all attack him? Gender bias.

>>Is that his way to punish her or to punish the kid.

Should he leave the child with a bad person? That would be punishment for the kid and damaging psychologically.
And why should her paying child support be considered punishment?

>>At least if she did this because she wanted a baby, at least she may take care of the baby with a little respect.

Just because someone 'wants and makes a baby' doesn't mean they will make good parents. She has already proven that she is not ready to be a parent.

>>part of his nasty revenge...

the revenge claim is without basis and completely ridiculous. It only shows you don't see past your own narrow point of view. I challenge you to go through the posts and make a reasonable argument instead of just spouting off with the crowd. Witch burners.

 

[Ambr]

§ 160.254. Knowledge of Pregnancy

(a) A person who has sexual intercourse with a person of the opposite sex is deemed to have knowledge that sexual intercourse can result in the woman's pregnancy. </b>

Yes, it is a matter of the birds and bees. This was copied from the texas state statutes. It details what every person - male or femal - should have been taught from their parents or through a school health class. IF YOU HAVE SEX WITH SOMEONE, YOU TAKE THE CHANCE OF BECOMING A PARENT. It doesn't matter if she lied to him about birth control. When did birth control become the sole responsibility of the female. No birth control method is a 100% guarantee. He could have easily insisted that he wear a condom. I mean, you are trying to paint a picture of an immoral, sneaky woman and he had sex without a condom. Hope she was disease free. HE SHOULD OF WORRIED ABOUT PROTECTING HIMSELF.

<b> I imagine people would feel different if I said...
HE lied to HER and ruined HER life by getting her pregnant after lieing to her that he had a vasectomy. Do you think people would be saying "suck it up, chick...that's life and now you have a baby and you better take care of it. and don't even ask him for child support. You knew it was possible to get pregnant even though he had a vasectomy. It means NOTHING that he told you he had a vasectomy." </b>

my opinion would be the same, rather it was male or female. if this was just a casual relationship or a head strong 30 year romance. if you agree to a sexual relationship, you take the chance of becoming pregnant or making someone pregnant (whichever the case may be). As the parents, you are responsible for the raising of the child, to teach it right from wrong, to teach it love and respect, and to provide for it as normal and healthy of a life that you possibly can - which includes FINANCIALLY.


[Edited by Ambr on 04-27-2001 at 09:14 AM]

 

[2goodgirls]

She may have lied but I agree with ambr, he should have protected himself. Now the baby has to pay.

She may have been less than moral to lie to him, his morality was not much better for not protecting his health and wellbeing. She could have given him more than just a baby...

Hope he learned a lesson, if your going to fool around with someone your hardly know, than how can you trust. You only can trust yourself. Buy a box of condoms.

If she was fooling around with him who she hardly knew, maybe she was doing other guys the same way and the kid isn't his, have a paternity test.

 

[LegalBeagle]

I hate threads like this.. any man who believes a women when she says she is using birth control and then proceeds to NOT wear a condom, deserves all they get!

 

[UncleMe]

blaming the victim

A girl who dresses like a whore and wanders the city at night is not making a good decision, but she doesn't 'deserve it' when she gets raped.

And that's the point I'm making about him. Same kinda' thing.

Clearly, he made poor choices. But there's a world of difference.

 

[2goodgirls]

So who's more wrong, him or her...
seems pretty equal to me in the morality race.
who needs to punished more? him, her, or the baby...
maybe baby would be better off put up for adoption, lots of people would love to be able to have a precious inocent baby like like that and can't.

looks like she loses, he loses, and the baby realy loses because the baby is the one that is going to be the one surrounded by people with low morals.

I hope someone learns a lesson from this experience, and is able to raise the baby not to repeat the same in his/her future.

I'm sure your brother is a decent person, but maybe she is to and everybody let things get carried away.

SEX MAKES BABIES...

and anyone engaging in sex need to think about this and be responsible for their end results.

sorry it had to happen to your family, and good luck with the outcome. Please don't do something that your will regret with the future of the innocent baby. This child has still got to live on this planet, deserves to be loved and cared by both parents, and has to grow up to be a function responsible adult someday, and those results will be up to the way your brother and this woman handle things now. Good Luck